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re: Question about Freeze and those coaches that wear their faith so openly
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:44 pm to AshLSU
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:44 pm to AshLSU
quote:
That's not disrespectful to say that prayer doesn't heal. Do you believe Voodoo is real? If not, that's disrespectful...
It is disrespectful to word it the way you did.
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Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:46 pm to AshLSU
quote:
That's not disrespectful to say that prayer doesn't heal. Do you believe Voodoo is real? If not, that's disrespectful...
There are medicines out the there that heals diseases. The medicine may not work every single time. It might not heal every person you want it to heal. Just because it does not heal everybody you think it should does not mean the medicine does not heal.
Just because God does not heal everybody or everybody you think He should heal does not mean God cannot heal.
Just because God does not behave in the way you think He should does not mean He does not exist.
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:49 pm to bayou85
quote:
nd coping with your lost limb, yes. Prayer isnt a buffet for us to plunder. It is grace from the creator that is held in respect and reverence. Most people who are not children do not mass pray or anoint some one with oil over little things.
So you are saying that he answers some people's prayers but not others? Because for every case that you can come up with where people prayed that someone would be cured of cancer and it happened, I can point to thousands of others where people prayed the exact same amount or more and the person still died or I can point to cases where nobody prayed and the person was cured.
So god has "favorites" among his creation. Still sounds like an a-hole. Or are you going to use the old tried and true "god works in mysterious ways" argument here which is nothing more than saying "I have nothing else to say to prove my point so I'm just going to say something vague to try and make a point". I could just as easily say Bigfoot cured their cancer and the evidence would be just as supportive because you know "Bigfoot works in mysterious ways".
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:53 pm to AshLSU
quote:
That's not disrespectful to say that prayer doesn't heal. Do you believe Voodoo is real? If not, that's disrespectful...
One of the biggest problems I have with debating self-identified christians. Firstly, you have to step into their arena where God created man, we must atone for sins we didn't commit, etc etc. The argument always starts from the bible being the truthful account of our origins. The starting point, the given situation, presupposes biblical truth and accuracy.
Then once you point out all the inconsistencies in the bible. Once you talk about how various denominations ignore or reject certain parts of it. once you get to a point where you ask yourself "why would a benevolent god choose to do this, it doesn't add up?". They cite 'faith', which is to say "it doesn't make sense, but I believe it to be true anyway".
By and large, most religions have a pretty solid message. Treat people nicely, try not to take advantage of one another, honor your parents, etc. I guess I just don't need the threat of eternal damnation, nor the promise of eternal salvation, from a moody creator to do those things.
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:57 pm to AshLSU
quote:
So you are saying that he answers some people's prayers but not others?
Not at all. Some he answers yes, and some he answers no. God doesn't answer every prayer the way we want Him to.
quote:
So god has "favorites" among his creation.
Not sure where you got this idea.
Look. I usually know better than to get caught up in an argument about God. most that want to talk usually already have their minds made up. there is nothing I can say that is going to change your mind. The only thing that will come of this is your mocking God.
There really is no use to go on talking about this. I find it odd that Christians (at least in this thread) do not mock you for your unbelief, but present their point of view with respect...and yet you choose to demean and belittle. yet...for some reason, it is the Christians who are told they are closed minded.
Have a good day, and i hope and pray one day you begin an honest search.
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:58 pm to AshLSU
quote:
if the Christian god is real, then he's a fricking idiot.
Not necessarily an idiot, but certainly nothing that any sane person would want to worship or spend eternity with.
Posted on 3/7/17 at 1:59 pm to DawgsLife
quote:
Just because God does not behave in the way you think He should does not mean He does not exist.
Exactly. That way, you can keep attributing all the good things that happen, to him.
And all those bad things that happen, well, he had his reasons for not intervening. Or was it that pesky little Devil (the one whom god supposedly has dominion over, but 'mysteriously' allows to carry on)
Posted on 3/7/17 at 2:07 pm to Covingtontiger77
$$$$
This post was edited on 8/26/20 at 12:49 pm
Posted on 3/7/17 at 3:33 pm to coachcrisp
Why are you calling god a he? Does a spiritual force have a dick and balls?
Posted on 3/7/17 at 3:37 pm to Peepdip
God approves unisex and transgender bathrooms.
Posted on 3/7/17 at 3:40 pm to Covingtontiger77
It's all a smoke screen, freeze doesn't care about Jesus
Posted on 3/7/17 at 4:24 pm to DawgsLife
quote:
Look. I usually know better than to get caught up in an argument about God. most that want to talk usually already have their minds made up. there is nothing I can say that is going to change your mind. The only thing that will come of this is your mocking God. There really is no use to go on talking about this. I find it odd that Christians (at least in this thread) do not mock you for your unbelief, but present their point of view with respect...and yet you choose to demean and belittle. yet...for some reason, it is the Christians who are told they are closed minded.
This is why a lot of people do t like Christians. You perceive anyone that brings up valid points against your beliefs as "attacking and belittling" you.
The "we are being persecuted" bit has really become rather redundant.
I already stated clearly that I don't give a damn what you believe as long as you don't try to force me to live under those beliefs as well. That's where my problem with a lot of Christians begins.
It is in fact narrow minded to ignore evidence presented to you. If I believed that the moon is made of cheese, you would point out evidence to dispute that claim. It would in fact be very narrow minded of me to ignore the fact that humans have walked on the moon and fully discovered that it is in no way made of cheese. You would not be belittling me by simply pointing out a fact.
That's how facts work. They are true whether or not someone believed them.
Posted on 3/7/17 at 4:29 pm to UAtide11
quote:
By and large, most religions have a pretty solid message. Treat people nicely, try not to take advantage of one another, honor your parents, etc. I guess I just don't need the threat of eternal damnation, nor the promise of eternal salvation, from a moody creator to do those things.
That's exactly how I see it. If someone's religion makes them a better person, I'm all for it. They just shouldn't expect others to folliw their religion simply because they say so. Show me concrete evidence that the earth is only 6000 years old or that it ever completely flooded wiping out all humanity except for a few people on a boat (despite the fact that this is a physical impossibility for numerous scientific testable reasons) and I may say "hey, there is something to this after all".
Posted on 3/7/17 at 4:57 pm to Covingtontiger77
none of the very spiritual people I have known have advertised it and I have known a good many. not saying Freeze is one, but charlatan's abound. in my experience many that wear their religion on their sleeve (or constantly advertise it) are indeed full of shite and using it as an angle to get something they want; most often money.
Posted on 3/8/17 at 7:22 am to AshLSU
quote:
This is why a lot of people do t like Christians. You perceive anyone that brings up valid points against your beliefs as "attacking and belittling" you.
You just called God an Ahole. How is that not attacking or belittling? There are respectful ways to discuss things without trying to piss off the counter arguer. Your response to me and Dawg have been to irritate and anger. Quite acting like we are sensitive. You're doing it on purpose and throwing your hands up like nothing happened.
Posted on 3/8/17 at 8:01 am to Wanderin Reb
While I am a beliver, I do struggle with a couple of things.
Do we truly have free will? God is all knowing, correct? If so he knows the choices we are going to make before we choose them, correct? If that is indeed the Case, then how is that free will?
Also, many times when someone is praying, they will end their prayer with "if it is your will". How is that free will? Or someone will say "it is all part of god's plan", well isnt that destiny?
Again, I do believe in god but in a different way. Afterall, we all had to be created from something and I am not buying evolution. If we all came from monkeys then explain to me, why the hell are monkeys still in existence? Are they special?
Do we truly have free will? God is all knowing, correct? If so he knows the choices we are going to make before we choose them, correct? If that is indeed the Case, then how is that free will?
Also, many times when someone is praying, they will end their prayer with "if it is your will". How is that free will? Or someone will say "it is all part of god's plan", well isnt that destiny?
Again, I do believe in god but in a different way. Afterall, we all had to be created from something and I am not buying evolution. If we all came from monkeys then explain to me, why the hell are monkeys still in existence? Are they special?
Posted on 3/8/17 at 8:11 am to AshLSU
quote:
You perceive anyone that brings up valid points against your beliefs as "attacking and belittling" you
Reading through this conversation, you have been belittling him
Posted on 3/8/17 at 8:40 am to firewater706
quote:I will give it a shot but will probably botch it. Some doctrines preach predestination which means that everything you do is predetermined by God even the fact that you one of the elect or you are not. Free will states that you have the choice (or free will) to make choices even if they are not what God wants but will allow it to happen. True, God is omniscient and knows that your choice is going to be before you make it but doesn't interfere with it. It's on you.
Do we truly have free will? God is all knowing, correct? If so he knows the choices we are going to make before we choose them, correct? If that is indeed the Case, then how is that free will?
quote:Jesus in the Garden just prior to his being taken into custody prayed to God that if he would take this cup from me, but said, but not my will but thy will be done. This has little to do with free will because you are asking God in an intercessory way to take a burden, heal a family member, etc, etc. You have no power over either but only God. It is his will not yours as to whether or not that happens.
Also, many times when someone is praying, they will end their prayer with "if it is your will". How is that free will? Or someone will say "it is all part of god's plan", well isnt that destiny?
Posted on 3/8/17 at 8:58 am to firewater706
quote:
If we all came from monkeys then explain to me, why the hell are monkeys still in existence? Are they special?
If Americans originally came from Europeans, why are there still Europeans?
But if you really want to know, humans didn't evolve from Bubbles the chimp. It would be more accurate to say that both humans and chimps evolved from the same common ancestor, many years and many species ago. In fact, all living organisms share a common ancestor if you go far enough back.
Evolution is a pretty well established scientific theory, not unlike cell theory, gravity, germ theory, etc.
Posted on 3/8/17 at 9:55 am to UAtide11
If all beings came from one living organism or cell then where did that cell come from?
If humans and chimps evolved from the same ancestor, then am I to assume chimps are retarded and chose to stay chimps?
If humans and chimps evolved from the same ancestor, then am I to assume chimps are retarded and chose to stay chimps?
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