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re: LSU basketball looks a whole lot like Alabama last year
Posted on 12/13/18 at 12:36 pm to BHMKyle
Posted on 12/13/18 at 12:36 pm to BHMKyle
quote:
How???
Make 1 free throw against FSU and we're probably still in the top 25 with a loss to Nova instead of Okie St.
Do you not realize that those rankings would change had we won those two games?
I understand that we lost and at the end of the day that's all that matters when making a resume. Playing #15 to a stalemate at a neutral site and #36 fairly evenly on the road tells me they're probably about as good as those two teams. Of course the rankings don't reflect that because we didn't win.
I never said we're a shoe in for the tourney. We have a ton of work to do. Just saying mailing it in is absurd at this point.
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Posted on 12/13/18 at 1:56 pm to Not Cooper
quote:
Do you not realize that those rankings would change had we won those two games?
Who cares? You did not win. If you were a Top 25 team or even a "fringe" Top 25 team, you probably would have won those games. That's the entire point.
There are a lot of teams with close losses to good teams. LSU is not the only one out there.
Look at Arkansas for example.... In their two losses to Texas and Western Kentucky, the Razorbacks had the lead in the final minute of both games, but ultimately came up short. Had they won both of those games, they'd be undefeated with wins over Indiana and Texas and likely sitting in the Top 10 or 12 in the country.
But they lost. Arkansas is not a Top 25 team just as LSU is not. Why? Because they lost games that a Top 25 team would have won.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:02 pm to BHMKyle
quote:
#53 St. Mary's in Las Vegas
#115 Furman at home
I know you like kenpom, but NET is way more relevant here.
St. Mary's is #76 there where as Furman is #35. Those are 2 games by winning (Saint Mary's at neutral site) we can get some quality wins in addition to the 'decent' one over Greensboro who is #84 in NET.
Really unfortunate we pissed away 2 big leads against Houston and FSU though. Win those 2 games and we're probably a Top 15 team right now. Especially on the road and at a neutral site.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:31 pm to BHMKyle
quote:
If you were a Top 25 team or even a "fringe" Top 25 team, you probably would have won those games.
So a fringe top 25 team should "probably" beat #15 at a neutral site and #24 on the road??
quote:
Look at Arkansas for example....
Texas - 74 NET
Western KY - 139 NET
Definitely the same, you're right. My bad man.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:33 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Tough to get a new roster all gelled together in a few months like Wade is trying to do there, though
Is it though?
Because the majority of competitive programs seem to do just fine with the one and dones. This is certainly not unique to LSU. Every major program in the country is “young”
This post was edited on 12/13/18 at 2:34 pm
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:34 pm to ILeaveAtHalftime
Adding a 1 and done to a roster is different than basically importing a new team like LSU did. Not a lot of veterans in that group.
Not an excuse, but understandable reason for losing close games to good teams away from home. Especially early.
Not an excuse, but understandable reason for losing close games to good teams away from home. Especially early.
This post was edited on 12/13/18 at 2:35 pm
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:35 pm to SummerOfGeorge
Then that has to be poor recruiting foresight or planning. Because in today’s climate, if your team has any talent, or any success whatsoever, you’re going to be turning the roster over quite frequently.
This post was edited on 12/13/18 at 2:36 pm
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:36 pm to ILeaveAtHalftime
quote:
Then that has to be poor recruiting foresight or planning. Because in today’s climate, if your team has any talent, or any success whatsoever, you’re going to be turning the roster over quite frequently.
Definitely, but its only year 2 for Wade, so it kind of makes sense.
If it was year 4 or 5 I think the excuse of having a bunch of young kids is much less acceptable......because it means you are at fault for not also having some vets.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:38 pm to Not Cooper
quote:
Definitely the same, you're right. My bad man.
You totally looked over his point about a better win in Indiana
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:42 pm to SummerOfGeorge
I really dont like calling this team young, if anything it's really just familiarity in playing with one another.
Yes there's the freshmen - Reid, Williams, Smart and Days. But we still have seniors in Kavell Bigby-Williams & Daryl Edwards. We have juniors in Skylar Mays and Marlon Taylor. We have a VERY experienced sophomore in Tremont Waters.
The biggest issue just seems to be learning who is best at what and playing with one another. KBW is playing for first year here (transfer, but practiced all last season). Edwards was formerly a JUCO, so only 2nd year here. Taylor is a JUCO and 1st year here. Obviously it's the freshmen 1st years here.
There seems to be no real rotation right now. Wade just makes a substitution every 30 seconds to minute 1 by 1. We still have no idea who our starting group really is. Waters has been so bad you almost have to take him out. Reid has been so up and down it's hard to keep him a starter. Williams hasn't added the value they really wanted at least offensively. Days has stepped up but then he get sin foul trouble last night. KBW has been on the best players but almost doesnt even play last night. just a constant shuffling of the guard basically trying to figure out guys, from a very talented group no less, who can play at a high level consistently.
Yes there's the freshmen - Reid, Williams, Smart and Days. But we still have seniors in Kavell Bigby-Williams & Daryl Edwards. We have juniors in Skylar Mays and Marlon Taylor. We have a VERY experienced sophomore in Tremont Waters.
The biggest issue just seems to be learning who is best at what and playing with one another. KBW is playing for first year here (transfer, but practiced all last season). Edwards was formerly a JUCO, so only 2nd year here. Taylor is a JUCO and 1st year here. Obviously it's the freshmen 1st years here.
There seems to be no real rotation right now. Wade just makes a substitution every 30 seconds to minute 1 by 1. We still have no idea who our starting group really is. Waters has been so bad you almost have to take him out. Reid has been so up and down it's hard to keep him a starter. Williams hasn't added the value they really wanted at least offensively. Days has stepped up but then he get sin foul trouble last night. KBW has been on the best players but almost doesnt even play last night. just a constant shuffling of the guard basically trying to figure out guys, from a very talented group no less, who can play at a high level consistently.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:44 pm to thunderbird1100
Yea, all of that sounds INCREDIBLY familiar to last season for us. Very frustrating, because you see the talent and team potential in spurts but you can't seem to capture it for an entire game or games. And nobody seems quite sure how to play together or comfortably together.
This post was edited on 12/13/18 at 2:45 pm
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:47 pm to ILeaveAtHalftime
quote:
Because the majority of competitive programs seem to do just fine with the one and dones.
Duke and Kentucky are the major one and done factories. Not the "majority". Go look at the roster of just about any top 10 team. They aren't all 5 star freshmen.
Recruiting rankings over the last 3 years (majority of the roster):
LSU
2016 - 51
2017 - 17
2018 - 4
Duke
2016 - 1
2017 - 1
2018 - 1
Kentucky
2016 - 2
2017 - 2
2018 - 2
Why on earth do you people put us in the same class as those two programs?
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:51 pm to rockiee
quote:
You totally looked over his point about a better win in Indiana
You're right. I did. I'll admit I stopped reading and immediately hit reply when he compared FSU/Houston to Texas/WKY lol.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:55 pm to Not Cooper
quote:
Why on earth do you people put us in the same class as those two programs?
Perhaps I mischaracterized my point a little and over-generalized. Just tired of hearing every single season that our team is either young, inexperienced, unfamiliar, or some combination of the three. College is only four years long at most for 90% of these guys. Roster turnover is the name of the game in CBB from year to year.
I’m merely commenting that other programs seem to be able to absorb this reality better than LSU has this decade. Not just the blue bloods, but most other perennial tournament teams too.
This post was edited on 12/13/18 at 2:56 pm
Posted on 12/13/18 at 2:56 pm to Not Cooper
quote:
I'll admit I stopped reading and immediately hit reply when he compared FSU/Houston to Texas/WKY lol.
Don't forget Oklahoma st as well. LSU and Arkansas are not far apart. Arkansas has the better win but also has the worse loss.
Posted on 12/13/18 at 3:00 pm to rockiee
And neither of you have wins over the worst Arizona team of the decade AND the worst Wichita team of the last 6 years.
So suck it hatas!
So suck it hatas!
Posted on 12/13/18 at 3:05 pm to SummerOfGeorge
Jokes on you, this is my 7th favorite team
Posted on 12/13/18 at 3:09 pm to ILeaveAtHalftime
quote:
Perhaps I mischaracterized my point a little and over-generalized. Just tired of hearing every single season that our team is either young, inexperienced, unfamiliar, or some combination of the three.
I agree with you there, but it has been true the first two years under CWW. We have 3 guys on the roster that contributed at all last year, and 1 of those guys is playing much worse than he did last year. Once CWW gets this stabilized and we can return 3-4 starters instead of 1-2, then we can stop with the young/inexperienced argument.
For example, we SHOULD only lose Reid/KBW from our major contributors this year. That means we'll return 3-4 starters next year, and add guys like Aundre Hyatt and Courtese Cooper who are already with the team but sitting out a year. So "experience" excuses should be out the window next year.
This post was edited on 12/13/18 at 3:17 pm
Posted on 12/14/18 at 9:32 am to Not Cooper
quote:
So a fringe top 25 team should "probably" beat #15 at a neutral site and #24 on the road??
A Top 25 team shouldn't be 0-3 against the KenPom Top 65. i think that notion should be widely accepted.
I notice you conveniently left off the loss to Oklahoma State. I wonder why?
quote:
Texas - 74 NET
Western KY - 139 NET
Definitely the same, you're right. My bad man.
You forgot to include Arkansas' win over KenPom #25 Indiana, so you're right.... not at all the same. Arkansas actually has an impressive win this season while LSU does not.
And since you decide to switch over to NET rankings.... which are not at all close to being accurate yet (will take a few more weeks).... why not list out LSU's NET ranking and opponent losses
NET #40 LSU...
Lost to NET #11 Houston
Lost to NET #30 Florida State
Lost to NET #74 Oklahoma State
So tell me again how LSU is a Top 25 team yet has a ranking of #40 in the system you decided to use and has losses to teams ranked #30 and #74 with no big wins to speak of?
Can you explain because I'm having a tough time understanding that faulty logic.
This post was edited on 12/14/18 at 9:33 am
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