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re: Bogus National Title claims: Alabama claims 18 but most are questionable
Posted on 12/6/22 at 7:36 pm to Chicken
Posted on 12/6/22 at 7:36 pm to Chicken
The UPI poll held as much credibility as the AP. Also, true national champions are listed on the NCAA overall NC trophy that list truly recognized NC’s. It goes back to 1957. When UGA won in 2021 they were the 14th team to ever win multiple NC’s. Your premise that number 1 vs number 2 is somehow definitive proof of who the national champ was is full of holes. Those rankings were still heavily influenced by human opinion. Why not just go back to the start of the CFP? Bad take OP
1
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:07 am to Chicken
End of debate
This article was from when Bama CLAIMED 12.
The "preacher's son"
Former Alabama sports information director Wayne Atcheson, shown here in 2000 with one of the books on the Crimson Tide that he wrote, started the claim of 12 national championships for Alabama. (The Birmingham News)
Wayne Atcheson, the son of a small-town preacher, loves history and his Alabama football. These days, he enjoys serving as director of the Billy Graham Library in Charlotte.
What you might not know about Atcheson is his contribution to Alabama football history.
He is the reason Alabama's media guide claims 12 national titles. He is the reason Alabama fans wear "got twelve?" T-shirts. He is the reason some fans can already start marketing bumper stickers for a 13th national championship, a presumptive move that isn't the first presumptive move in the university's national title count.
Because before Alabama got 12, it only got six.
Atcheson is the former Alabama sports information director who added five pre-Bear Bryant national titles to the team's media guide in the 1980s. Those changes still resonate today with one burning question: Just how many national championships does Alabama have, anyway?
"They can rightfully claim 12," Atcheson said, although others disagree.
The NCAA record book recognizes Alabama with seven "consensus" national championships -- the six by Bryant and 1992. According to this list, "consensus" means a championship bestowed since 1950 by any, but not necessarily all, of the following: the Associated Press, United Press International, Football Writers Association of America, National Football Foundation/College Football Hall of Fame, USA Today/CNN or USA Today/ESPN.
On a separate list in the record book, the NCAA compares how "national poll champions" have fared in bowl games since 1900. That list gives Alabama nine national titles, including 1925 and 1926 but leaving off 1930, '34 and '41.
College Football Data Warehouse, an online history of the sport, recognizes Alabama with 11 -- all except the most controversial one, in 1941. The SEC follows the NCAA approach by starting its count at 1950 and recognizes Alabama with seven.
So how did an SID from the Ray Perkins era -- a period with zero SEC titles, much less any national titles -- shape such a core belief that many Alabama supporters today accept as gospel?
"I've talked to university officials about it. You're about the first reporter to ever ask me about it," said Atcheson, Alabama's SID from 1983 to '87 and later associate director of the Tide Pride donor program.
"I want to say the right thing here. I made the change because Coach Bryant had these 25 years and six national championships and they were emphasized so much. It was on all the stationery. And when I got there, it was a matter of seeing there were five others (before Bryant) and we should put them all together. It was as simple as that."
Atcheson said that in the 1983 media guide, he added the five pre-Bryant national titles now listed -- 1925, 1926, 1930, 1934 and 1941. Taylor Watson, curator at the Bryant Museum in Tuscaloosa, said it was actually the 1986 media guide.
This much is certain: The 1982 media guide, the last for Bryant, lists 1934 as the only pre-Bryant national championship, adding it in a footnote of Alabama's SEC history. In the year-by-year results in the '82 media guide, only Bryant's six national titles were listed.
Atcheson and Watson said it's important to put Alabama's claim of 12 in context because other schools have added debated championships, too.
"I tried to make Alabama football look the best it could look and just make it as great as it could possibly be," Atcheson said. "I was a competitor myself with the other schools, and what they bragged about and boasted about, I wanted people to know the best about my school."
Asked why 12 is the right number, Watson replied: "I don't know that it is the right number. But that's the great thing about college football. I hope we never have a playoff. I'll be going to my grave arguing that we should have won a national championship in 1966."
The Crimson Tide went 11-0 in '66, when Michigan State and Notre Dame shared the mythical title after tying each other. It's a lost championship that's as much a part of Alabama lore as its claim that it's going for No. 13 this week in Pasadena.
AL.com: Read it and weep, you Bama bandwagon riders
This article was from when Bama CLAIMED 12.
The "preacher's son"
Former Alabama sports information director Wayne Atcheson, shown here in 2000 with one of the books on the Crimson Tide that he wrote, started the claim of 12 national championships for Alabama. (The Birmingham News)
Wayne Atcheson, the son of a small-town preacher, loves history and his Alabama football. These days, he enjoys serving as director of the Billy Graham Library in Charlotte.
What you might not know about Atcheson is his contribution to Alabama football history.
He is the reason Alabama's media guide claims 12 national titles. He is the reason Alabama fans wear "got twelve?" T-shirts. He is the reason some fans can already start marketing bumper stickers for a 13th national championship, a presumptive move that isn't the first presumptive move in the university's national title count.
Because before Alabama got 12, it only got six.
Atcheson is the former Alabama sports information director who added five pre-Bear Bryant national titles to the team's media guide in the 1980s. Those changes still resonate today with one burning question: Just how many national championships does Alabama have, anyway?
"They can rightfully claim 12," Atcheson said, although others disagree.
The NCAA record book recognizes Alabama with seven "consensus" national championships -- the six by Bryant and 1992. According to this list, "consensus" means a championship bestowed since 1950 by any, but not necessarily all, of the following: the Associated Press, United Press International, Football Writers Association of America, National Football Foundation/College Football Hall of Fame, USA Today/CNN or USA Today/ESPN.
On a separate list in the record book, the NCAA compares how "national poll champions" have fared in bowl games since 1900. That list gives Alabama nine national titles, including 1925 and 1926 but leaving off 1930, '34 and '41.
College Football Data Warehouse, an online history of the sport, recognizes Alabama with 11 -- all except the most controversial one, in 1941. The SEC follows the NCAA approach by starting its count at 1950 and recognizes Alabama with seven.
So how did an SID from the Ray Perkins era -- a period with zero SEC titles, much less any national titles -- shape such a core belief that many Alabama supporters today accept as gospel?
"I've talked to university officials about it. You're about the first reporter to ever ask me about it," said Atcheson, Alabama's SID from 1983 to '87 and later associate director of the Tide Pride donor program.
"I want to say the right thing here. I made the change because Coach Bryant had these 25 years and six national championships and they were emphasized so much. It was on all the stationery. And when I got there, it was a matter of seeing there were five others (before Bryant) and we should put them all together. It was as simple as that."
Atcheson said that in the 1983 media guide, he added the five pre-Bryant national titles now listed -- 1925, 1926, 1930, 1934 and 1941. Taylor Watson, curator at the Bryant Museum in Tuscaloosa, said it was actually the 1986 media guide.
This much is certain: The 1982 media guide, the last for Bryant, lists 1934 as the only pre-Bryant national championship, adding it in a footnote of Alabama's SEC history. In the year-by-year results in the '82 media guide, only Bryant's six national titles were listed.
Atcheson and Watson said it's important to put Alabama's claim of 12 in context because other schools have added debated championships, too.
"I tried to make Alabama football look the best it could look and just make it as great as it could possibly be," Atcheson said. "I was a competitor myself with the other schools, and what they bragged about and boasted about, I wanted people to know the best about my school."
Asked why 12 is the right number, Watson replied: "I don't know that it is the right number. But that's the great thing about college football. I hope we never have a playoff. I'll be going to my grave arguing that we should have won a national championship in 1966."
The Crimson Tide went 11-0 in '66, when Michigan State and Notre Dame shared the mythical title after tying each other. It's a lost championship that's as much a part of Alabama lore as its claim that it's going for No. 13 this week in Pasadena.
AL.com: Read it and weep, you Bama bandwagon riders
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:09 am to TValley
That’s a lot of effort and worry to argue that Alabama has less than it claims but more than anyone else. 
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:11 am to GADAWG2017
The LSU team that lost 2 games is the biggest national title fraud that I can remember
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:15 am to CapstoneGrad06
quote:
That’s a lot of effort and worry to argue that Alabama has less than it claims but more than anyone else.
Especially since him and his Vols retroactively claimed titles as well.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:17 am to BLG
quote:
The LSU team that lost 2 games is the biggest national title fraud that I can remember
Would love to hear your champ for that year.
Lemme guess….Alabama.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:24 am to dstone12
I don't think it's that, just the incredible luck LSU had.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:43 am to MetroAtlantaGatorFan
Yes, but you never know what blg is going to say. Actually, yes you do. LOL.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:44 am to dstone12
They clearly had the best resume to be in the title game after all the craziness.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 8:46 am to MetroAtlantaGatorFan
quote:
I don't think it's that, just the incredible luck LSU had.
LSU lost to two 8-5 teams in 2007, including a loss in their final regular season game (in vaunted Tiger Stadium). Some national champion.
Other two-loss national champions include Alabama in 1941, which LSU fans, and many others, dispute. What does that say about the Bayou Bengals?
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:08 am to Tornado Alley
41 is the only one that shouldn’t be claimed- but it makes up for 66 so it’s justified in the count.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:10 am to Tornado Alley
quote:
LSU lost to two 8-5 teams in 2007, including a loss in their final regular season game (in vaunted Tiger Stadium). Some national champion.
Other two-loss national champions include Alabama in 1941, which LSU fans, and many others, dispute. What does that say about the Bayou Bengals?
Right, but they still had the best resume by far to play OSU in the title game. Destroyed VT 48-7 earlier in the season (who finished in the top 10) when Glenn Dorsey was healthy. Also beat the Vols in the SEC title game with a true freshman at backup.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:11 am to dstone12
Also I'm not trying to single out LSU when it comes to luck either. We certainly needed plenty in 96 and 06.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:19 am to TValley
quote:
Atcheson is the former Alabama sports information director who added five pre-Bear Bryant national titles to the team's media guide in the 1980s.
Yep, Coach Bryant did not want to claim the early title (only wanted the standard polls) but Alabama won them
Even the ncaa agrees with three of the early ones
25, 26, 30
LINK
Not even the ncaa agrees with you
quote:
College Football Data Warehouse, an online history of the sport, recognizes Alabama with 11 -- all except the most controversial one, in 1941. The SEC follows the NCAA approach by starting its count at 1950 and recognizes Alabama with seven.
Actually if you look it says 28 (and Alabama won 3 more since they stopped listing them, so 31)
But Alabama is humble and only claims 18
You are really an idiot....
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:43 am to TideFaninFl
quote:
Coach Bryant
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:54 am to Tornado Alley
Other than 1984 BYU, the only other fraudulent national champion by virtue of the AP and UPI is 1960 Minnesota. They were crowned national champions with an 8-1 record. They would lose their bowl which made it seem like there was a two-loss national champion for 1960.
Missouri originally finished 10-1 but later 11-0 after it was found that Kansas used an ineligible player.
Washington, which beat Minnesota in the Rose Bowl, finished 10-1-0.
Mississippi finished 10-0-1.
Missouri originally finished 10-1 but later 11-0 after it was found that Kansas used an ineligible player.
Washington, which beat Minnesota in the Rose Bowl, finished 10-1-0.
Mississippi finished 10-0-1.
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:55 am to WilliamTaylor21
Well he did make LSU his bitch.....
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:57 am to TideFaninFl
On an completely unrelated note....damn there's some posters that I haven't seen in ages. 2GOAT thread outside of ATPB 
This post was edited on 12/21/22 at 9:57 am
Posted on 12/21/22 at 9:58 am to CapstoneGrad06
quote:I linked one article. No work at all.
That’s a lot of effort and worry to argue that Alabama has less than it claims but more than anyone else.
Notre Dame has more LEGITIMATE NCs than Bama.
This post was edited on 12/21/22 at 10:03 am
Posted on 12/21/22 at 10:01 am to TideFaninFl
quote:STFU, bandwagon rider.
Not even the ncaa agrees with you
quote:
The NCAA record book recognizes Alabama with seven "consensus" national championships -- the six by Bryant and 1992. According to this list, "consensus" means a championship bestowed since 1950 by any, but not necessarily all, of the following: the Associated Press, United Press International, Football Writers Association of America, National Football Foundation/College Football Hall of Fame, USA Today/CNN or USA Today/ESPN.
The NCAA record book was changed. WHEN??? After Saban's butt buddy Mark Emmert became NCAA president.
7+6+18
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