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re: As the jar cracks - Johnny Manziel's downfall is upon us
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:40 am to crimsonette12
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:40 am to crimsonette12
quote:
If AJ did half of the crap that JF did I would be absolutely mortified to have him as our QB
And you Bama fans have the audacity to call JFF a douche because he likes to sit front row at sports games and hangs out with Drake.
This post was edited on 8/14/13 at 11:44 am
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Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:41 am to RT1941
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:41 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Plenty of Bama players get into worse shenanigans than JFF, but they're not under the same microscope.
Examples? Of current Bama players.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:41 am to elvisleft
quote:Why publically acknowledge some shite Joe Schadd and ESPN is throwing out? A&M hired the same lawyers AU hired, so it's obvious they are lookin into it - but there's absolutely no point in A&M addressing this when they haven't even been formally notified by the NCAA.
Auburn said they were looking into it. Then Auburn said Cam was suspended. Then they said he wasn't. Then they said they were clean.
All that took several weeks, of course. But A&M hasn't even acknowledged the issue.
BTW, the whole Cam Newton saga took a whole lot longer than "several weeks", start to finish was well over a fricking year.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:42 am to crimsonette12
quote:
If AJ did half of the crap that JF did I would be absolutely mortified to have him as our QB.
Lies.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:43 am to RT1941
The scenario I described took several weeks.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:47 am to JakeMongoose
ESPN has a few brokers saying JFF signed the stuff. They can't show the stuff though and they aren't doing an interview on TV with these guys. They also have absolutely no records showing payment.
Authenticating some Manziel sigs on a few items proves nothing. I have a signed Manziel pic of my own that is authenticated. So what? If there is no proven payment it means NOTHING just as it means nothing to the other college athletes who have autos out there you can purchase on the web. Signing autos is within the rules, even if you sign 50,000 of them.
It also isn't Johnny's job to disprove a negative. There is no evidence of Uncle Nate being paid either other than some broker saying he asked for money. Even showing him setting up an auto session means nothing. There has to be PAYMENT proven for it to mean anything.
Circumstantial evidence is not enough, nor is hearsay.
Authenticating some Manziel sigs on a few items proves nothing. I have a signed Manziel pic of my own that is authenticated. So what? If there is no proven payment it means NOTHING just as it means nothing to the other college athletes who have autos out there you can purchase on the web. Signing autos is within the rules, even if you sign 50,000 of them.
It also isn't Johnny's job to disprove a negative. There is no evidence of Uncle Nate being paid either other than some broker saying he asked for money. Even showing him setting up an auto session means nothing. There has to be PAYMENT proven for it to mean anything.
Circumstantial evidence is not enough, nor is hearsay.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:48 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:We have our own true, hardcore thugs, not pretenders like other players.
And let's not pretend like your program is a bastion of moral goodness for football players. Plenty of Bama players get into worse shenanigans than JFF, but they're not under the same microscope. Could Johnny be smarter? Yeah, and I wish to God that he would. But at the end of the day he's mostly a dumb kid who parties too hard and is surrounded by enablers. I'm not about to shed a tear in sympathy for the rich little brat, or try to convince you to "please, please walk a day in his shoes," but to insinuate that Aggies everywhere should be "mortified," is asinine.
Honestly, if you want to consistantly field a competitive team in this conference, you better mix in a lot of kids that were born to fight and won't back down to anyone. You want that edge that the street gives them, you want a kid that has had to struggle to survive.
You want a few 4.0 GPA guys that walk a straight line too. But, I want badasses like Rolando McClain, Dre Kirkpatrick, Courtney Upshaw on my defense any day. Those kind of players won't ever give up, lay down, or quit on the field it's just not in their blood.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:58 am to aggressor
New Business Insider Article on the motives of the Autograph Brokers:
LINK
LINK
quote:
The timing of that claim is crucial to the autograph scandal because it came less than a month after autograph dealers say Manziel signed thousands of items for them, according to Darren Rovell and Justine Gubar of ESPN.com.. Many of those items ended up on eBay. That is, until Manziel's law firm reached out to eBay and informed the auction site that many items on the site were violating Manziel's trademark claim. One dealer told Bruce Feldman of CBSSports.com that approximately 500 dealers had Manziel memorabilia pulled from eBay because they were using the phrase "Johnny Football" in the description, likely to maximize search hits. Those dealers also had their accounts suspended for two weeks because of the trademark infringement.
quote:
But if revenge is the motive, why aren't the dealers working with the NCAA, such is the case with one broker that told "Outside the Lines" that he paid Manziel $7,500 to autograph items? It may be that they want to hurt Manziel, but at the same time they don't want to scare away other top athletes. There is already evidence that other top college football stars have signed items for autograph dealers. It is one thing to lose out on Manziel. It is something else entirely to lose out on all the players, which could put the dealers out of business
Posted on 8/14/13 at 11:59 am to aggressor
quote:
Authenticating some Manziel sigs on a few items proves nothing
If over 4,400 is a few, then okay.
quote:
Signing autos is within the rules, even if you sign 50,000 of them.
There is no problem with signing 50,000 items for individual fans. There's probably not even a problem with signing 50,000 (or in this case 4,400 and counting) for autograph brokers. But there might be a problem when Uncle Nate says next time it is going to cost you. Does it pays the smell test that JFF did all this because he's a swell guy? Not really. Can the NCAA prove that he or Uncle Nate got paid? Remains to be seen.
quote:
It also isn't Johnny's job to disprove a negative.
No, but it is job to comply with the NCAA investigation. If he lies to them, that's a bad thing and bad things will happen.
quote:
Circumstantial evidence is not enough, nor is hearsay.
Were this a court of law, you'd be correct. This not a court of law and the NCAA is not bound by the same rules though.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:21 pm to 3andOut
quote:
I am more worried about A&M playing him if more evidence comes out before the season and thus the NCAA putting the program as a whole on probation for a year, just as an example.
As of right now that is not the case because the University feels as if they have nothing to confirm the allegations. But that could change as the season approaches.
Just from the experience with Cam, I always felt like our compliance director was working closely with the NCAA. I just felt confident that the right thing would be done - that the university is more important than one person or one season, and no one was going to risk it IF there was any doubt.
It's easy for us to wonder and worry about doing the right thing, but I guess you just have to trust your compliance people. And stop listening to people who don't know what they're talking about, including the media.
Everyone who plays you this year naturally wants Manziel to not play, even the ones who say they don't. Doesn't matter one way or the other to me, but it sickens me to see the feeding frenzy taking place.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:23 pm to JakeMongoose
So random broker that may have had his account suspended because of Johnny's trademark says, "He signed 4,400 autos" so that makes it true? Ok, well show them. Where are they? Where is the money you paid him for this? Where is the money you paid Uncle Nate?
A few brokers that have a reason to hold a grudge against Johnny accusing him of breaking the rules without evidence doesn't hold water. All that has emerged is a picture of Johnny signing about 10 pics and a "video" that no one is able to see outside of an ESPN reporter with a National Enquirer reputation and the broker who has it won't cooperate with the NCAA.
There is also no evidence that Johnny isn't cooperating with the NCAA. None.
Just because Rovell can keep finding brokers that won't cooperate with the NCAA, won't go on camera, and won't do any type of interview where they have to answer to any line of real questions doesn't make it any more factual. What is a fact is that 500 brokers had their EBay business shut down for 2 weeks because of Johnny's copyright in January. That isn't under dispute.
A few brokers that have a reason to hold a grudge against Johnny accusing him of breaking the rules without evidence doesn't hold water. All that has emerged is a picture of Johnny signing about 10 pics and a "video" that no one is able to see outside of an ESPN reporter with a National Enquirer reputation and the broker who has it won't cooperate with the NCAA.
There is also no evidence that Johnny isn't cooperating with the NCAA. None.
Just because Rovell can keep finding brokers that won't cooperate with the NCAA, won't go on camera, and won't do any type of interview where they have to answer to any line of real questions doesn't make it any more factual. What is a fact is that 500 brokers had their EBay business shut down for 2 weeks because of Johnny's copyright in January. That isn't under dispute.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:23 pm to tampajoe
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:34 pm to aggressor
quote:
Circumstantial evidence is not enough, nor is hearsay.
False
That's like saying in MLB that the players MUST test positive for PEDs to suspend them. That's not the case. If there is enough circumstantial evidence the ncaa will act and JFF will be in the sideline for some time during the year.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:36 pm to Maroon Flash
quote:
ESPN Getting Called Out
I think the ones calling out should be called out. From your link:
quote:
When ESPN started this story the narrative was that Manziel had accepted a “five-figure” sum to sign autographs. A day later the sum of money was changed to 7,500 from the original report of “five-figures.”
Wrong. The "five-figure" was from the Ft. Lauderdale signing. The $7500 was from the Connecticut signing.
So now there are 6 sessions:
quote:
The Freistat signings, combined with four sessions previously reported by "Outside the Lines," would make six signings for three brokers in three states in less than a month for Manziel. Sources said he signed his name more than 4,400 times.
That ESPN knows of. We don't know what the NCAA knows.
I don't think the Aggies will go "all in" and play him. I think they give him a 5 game suspension at the start of the season and hope that's enough for the NCAA.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:41 pm to Vegas Bengal
quote:
Wrong. The "five-figure" was from the Ft. Lauderdale signing. The $7500 was from the Connecticut signing.
There have been some many of these signings, I'm having a tough time keeping track. Which one was the one where Uncle Nate said the free ride was over, next time going to cost them? Was that the same one JFF was heard to have said that if anyone asked, he never did any autograph sessions with that broker? Or was that after?
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:42 pm to DRE06
I would call myself a shitty person and douchebag if I sat with an awful a rapper as drake. His music disgusts me 
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:44 pm to GatorReb
It is true the NCAA can do whatever they want, technically. That just hasn't been their MO in more recent years. You don't suspend the Heisman Trophy winner and ruin the biggest CFB game of the year on circumstantial evidence. Johnny and A&M are lawyered up as well and they have a lot of sympathy in the press and the public to their side of the case.
I also don't really see the point of bringing up more and more of these brokers that won't cooperate with the NCAA and won't show any evidence to back up their claims. Until they have something to show or are willing to be interviewed by someone besides Rovell or Schaad who have been widely discredited in the past it is very weak. You would also think that if Rovell or Schaad had any integrity at all they would be asking "who else do you have or know of that has signed autos?"
Let's also not forget that some of the brokers accusing Manziel are convicted criminals.
I also don't really see the point of bringing up more and more of these brokers that won't cooperate with the NCAA and won't show any evidence to back up their claims. Until they have something to show or are willing to be interviewed by someone besides Rovell or Schaad who have been widely discredited in the past it is very weak. You would also think that if Rovell or Schaad had any integrity at all they would be asking "who else do you have or know of that has signed autos?"
Let's also not forget that some of the brokers accusing Manziel are convicted criminals.
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:46 pm to aggressor
doesn't JFF have a record himself? so what is your point..They are convicted criminals so they are lying?
Posted on 8/14/13 at 12:48 pm to JakeMongoose
Don't worry about tracking which signing Johnny was paid for, the story changes every time as well. The last thing you want to do is actually dive into the story from the brokers because it doesn't add up. Johnny still hasn't "bought new rims" for the first supposed $7500. Facts don't matter here, it's only what some convicted criminal that lost his business for 2 weeks because of Johnny says without evidence to back it up.
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