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re: An honest observation. Does Bama really matter?
Posted on 7/17/08 at 1:56 pm to AHM21
Posted on 7/17/08 at 1:56 pm to AHM21
most of us on here have learned BT4LSU just spews his own twisted version of the truth. his 'facts' have been disproven time and time again. As soon as anyone points out his errors, he'll start with the personal insults 
u just have to read his posts for entertainment value 
u just have to read his posts for entertainment value 
2
Posted on 7/17/08 at 2:00 pm to bamaatlsu
Yea, I love how he sits here and talks about Alabama being a top 10 team in 2005. Like I said, Shula relied on defense and Prothro.
Prothro was hurt in the 4th quarter of the Florida game. From that point forward, Alabama relied on defense and barely beat Ole Miss, Tennessee, and struggled with Mississippi State.
Safe to say, Alabama wasn't even a top 15 team once Prothro went down.
Prothro was hurt in the 4th quarter of the Florida game. From that point forward, Alabama relied on defense and barely beat Ole Miss, Tennessee, and struggled with Mississippi State.
Safe to say, Alabama wasn't even a top 15 team once Prothro went down.
Posted on 7/17/08 at 2:03 pm to BT4LSU
quote:
BT4LSU
quote:
Come November...and again, I'm not kidding here.....LSU will destoy Alabama. It may be their worst loss in modern history.
Posted on 7/17/08 at 2:12 pm to RolTydRol
we all got 'em 
Posted on 7/17/08 at 8:11 pm to RollTide MJ
Roll Tide MJ:
who pissed in your cheerios this morning?
No one.
More MJ....
<<you my friend are one of the type of fans that really gives LSU fans a bad name. and i don't care what some bama fan has said or what they say over on tidesports or wherever else>>
Ok, MJ... an honest question. Think about it before you bust out your emotional ego. What have I said in the last two posts that you have any way of proving me wrong?
Why do I give LSU fans a bad name for saying that Bama has not been a real factor, was not a factor after the LSU game, and they won't be a factor this year? I have my opinion. I ALWAYS substanciate that opinion with a lot of facts.
A majority of the time I'm right, Like I was when I told every VT fan they simply did not match up to LSU, and they are walking into total destruction. I also, much to the chagrin of many Bama fans, told everyone that Bma would be lucky to go 7-5. And no matter what you want to say about the LSU game, I was right and you know it--- you were in fact lucky to go 7-5.
I'm on an LSU board, NOT a Bama board. I'm not screaming Bama sucks... I simply saying Bama is not a factor- either this year or next year. I am also saying LSU has been ahead of Bama for many many years now. Is that true or false?
Look at the records. Be realistic.
who pissed in your cheerios this morning?
No one.
More MJ....
<<you my friend are one of the type of fans that really gives LSU fans a bad name. and i don't care what some bama fan has said or what they say over on tidesports or wherever else>>
Ok, MJ... an honest question. Think about it before you bust out your emotional ego. What have I said in the last two posts that you have any way of proving me wrong?
Why do I give LSU fans a bad name for saying that Bama has not been a real factor, was not a factor after the LSU game, and they won't be a factor this year? I have my opinion. I ALWAYS substanciate that opinion with a lot of facts.
A majority of the time I'm right, Like I was when I told every VT fan they simply did not match up to LSU, and they are walking into total destruction. I also, much to the chagrin of many Bama fans, told everyone that Bma would be lucky to go 7-5. And no matter what you want to say about the LSU game, I was right and you know it--- you were in fact lucky to go 7-5.
I'm on an LSU board, NOT a Bama board. I'm not screaming Bama sucks... I simply saying Bama is not a factor- either this year or next year. I am also saying LSU has been ahead of Bama for many many years now. Is that true or false?
Look at the records. Be realistic.
This post was edited on 7/18/08 at 4:26 am
Posted on 7/18/08 at 4:03 am to BT4LSU
MJ On Les Miles...
<<that les miles will never coach lsu to anything less than 10 wins a season. <<to that my friend i think i will have to give you the delusional fan of the day award>>
Delusion? LSU now plays 13 games a year, as anyone in the SEC with a .500 record is almost guaranteed to play 13 games a year, and chances are LSU won;t lose 4 games in a year.
Think about this. Look at LSU's schedule the next few years. I expect LSU, with 3 or 4 crip opponets, along with an Ole Miss, MSU, probable down (for now) teams like Arkansas and Alabama, and others to go at least 11-2 or 10-3 just about every year. Those are 8 ganes that are close to guaranteed wins the next couple years.
Based on the talent, do you agree or disagree? Tell me why you disagree.
Lets look at this year. Sure we could lose to Auburn, UGA, and Florida. We PROBABLY won't lose the other games. On a worst case scenerio,we play an ACC opponet in a bowl game.
Sounds like 9-10 wins to me.
Honestly, knowing the LSU -Bama series, and the way it has been the last 25 years, why am I saying something that isn't true?
I would expect LSU to rip just about any Big 10, ACC or Notre Dame type. That gives us 10 wins.
If we go 8-4, again with 3 directional foes, we should go 9-4. A 8-4 team in 2006 is very similar to a 6-5 team in 1988.
Think about it. Then... tell me based on the LSU
situation now, next year, the next recruiting class coming in... tell me if Miles isn't going to win 10 games.
Again, given the structure of the schedule,
I again tell you even a bad Bama team should go at least 7-5... even with a losing record in the SEC.
<<that les miles will never coach lsu to anything less than 10 wins a season. <<to that my friend i think i will have to give you the delusional fan of the day award>>
Delusion? LSU now plays 13 games a year, as anyone in the SEC with a .500 record is almost guaranteed to play 13 games a year, and chances are LSU won;t lose 4 games in a year.
Think about this. Look at LSU's schedule the next few years. I expect LSU, with 3 or 4 crip opponets, along with an Ole Miss, MSU, probable down (for now) teams like Arkansas and Alabama, and others to go at least 11-2 or 10-3 just about every year. Those are 8 ganes that are close to guaranteed wins the next couple years.
Based on the talent, do you agree or disagree? Tell me why you disagree.
Lets look at this year. Sure we could lose to Auburn, UGA, and Florida. We PROBABLY won't lose the other games. On a worst case scenerio,we play an ACC opponet in a bowl game.
Sounds like 9-10 wins to me.
Honestly, knowing the LSU -Bama series, and the way it has been the last 25 years, why am I saying something that isn't true?
I would expect LSU to rip just about any Big 10, ACC or Notre Dame type. That gives us 10 wins.
If we go 8-4, again with 3 directional foes, we should go 9-4. A 8-4 team in 2006 is very similar to a 6-5 team in 1988.
Think about it. Then... tell me based on the LSU
situation now, next year, the next recruiting class coming in... tell me if Miles isn't going to win 10 games.
Again, given the structure of the schedule,
I again tell you even a bad Bama team should go at least 7-5... even with a losing record in the SEC.
Posted on 7/18/08 at 4:10 am to BT4LSU
More MJ....
<<there are a lot of rational LSU fans on this board and to them i give lots of respect>>
<<yes, lsu has been very good in recent years. yes, bama has been inconsistent in recent years. but, you want to sit here and act as though alabama will never beat lsu again>>
Here we go again-- I never said that. I said LSU will beat Bama this year, and next year. LSU is simply way ahead in the experience AND talent curve at this time. The emotion will not ebb for Tiger fans because of Saban, On the other hand, the emotion of an ex-LSU at Bama will eventually die down on your side as he transitions. It'll be more LSU emotion down the line.
--------------------
More MJ... <<i am not saying that alabama will win or lose in tiger stadium this year because there has not been one down played in the 2008 season yet. you may win by 10 or you might lose by 10>>
Again, not trying to flame, but really--[b]do you honestly think you have a snowball chance in hell in beating LSU this year, given the above? And knowing that LSU returns like 17 starters next year, how you plan on beating LSU with a your totally inexperienced team?
Again, this indicates more delusion on your side of the fence than me.
<<there are a lot of rational LSU fans on this board and to them i give lots of respect>>
<<yes, lsu has been very good in recent years. yes, bama has been inconsistent in recent years. but, you want to sit here and act as though alabama will never beat lsu again>>
Here we go again-- I never said that. I said LSU will beat Bama this year, and next year. LSU is simply way ahead in the experience AND talent curve at this time. The emotion will not ebb for Tiger fans because of Saban, On the other hand, the emotion of an ex-LSU at Bama will eventually die down on your side as he transitions. It'll be more LSU emotion down the line.
--------------------
More MJ... <<i am not saying that alabama will win or lose in tiger stadium this year because there has not been one down played in the 2008 season yet. you may win by 10 or you might lose by 10>>
Again, not trying to flame, but really--[b]do you honestly think you have a snowball chance in hell in beating LSU this year, given the above? And knowing that LSU returns like 17 starters next year, how you plan on beating LSU with a your totally inexperienced team?
Again, this indicates more delusion on your side of the fence than me.
This post was edited on 7/18/08 at 4:12 am
Posted on 7/18/08 at 4:14 am to BT4LSU
Another MJ rant saying I'm badmouthing...>
<<but, i know that none of this will get through to you one bit and you will instead use your big tough guy internet typing skills and spout back to me that bama sucks, bama has been irrelevant, the bear is dead, and blah blah blah>>,
No...I don't need to be a big tough internet guy. Do you deny your team currently has sucked for a long time? Do you deny the Bear is dead, and since even before he left, going from current back, LSU leads the series? Again, where have I stated an untruth> This is like talking to a wall.
-------------------
Ok, one more example.
Do you think Bama was relevent with these following records over EIGHT of the last ELEVEN years?
A little dose of reality.
2007: 7-6
2006: 6-7
2004: 6-6
2003: 4-9
2001: 7-5
2000: 3-8
1998: 7-5
1997: 4-7
In this 11 year stretch, you had three decent years. Let's look at your relevence then.
----
In 2005, you lost to Auburn and LSU, and you were not... repeat NOT... a factor at the end of the year. You ended up in the Cotton Bowl. Blame Shula if you must.
-----
In 2002, you were on probation.
You were ineligible. In other words...It didn't matter.
-----
On 1999 you won the SEC. Props.
---------------------------------------------------
So-- over 11 years..ELEVEN..perhaps one (1) season???
Now, given all the proofs, why do you think I'm badmouthing Bama? Or is it that you can't handle the truth?
Again.... just the facts.
<<but, i know that none of this will get through to you one bit and you will instead use your big tough guy internet typing skills and spout back to me that bama sucks, bama has been irrelevant, the bear is dead, and blah blah blah>>,
No...I don't need to be a big tough internet guy. Do you deny your team currently has sucked for a long time? Do you deny the Bear is dead, and since even before he left, going from current back, LSU leads the series? Again, where have I stated an untruth> This is like talking to a wall.
-------------------
Ok, one more example.
Do you think Bama was relevent with these following records over EIGHT of the last ELEVEN years?
A little dose of reality.
2007: 7-6
2006: 6-7
2004: 6-6
2003: 4-9
2001: 7-5
2000: 3-8
1998: 7-5
1997: 4-7
In this 11 year stretch, you had three decent years. Let's look at your relevence then.
----
In 2005, you lost to Auburn and LSU, and you were not... repeat NOT... a factor at the end of the year. You ended up in the Cotton Bowl. Blame Shula if you must.
-----
In 2002, you were on probation.
You were ineligible. In other words...It didn't matter.
-----
On 1999 you won the SEC. Props.
---------------------------------------------------
So-- over 11 years..ELEVEN..perhaps one (1) season???
Now, given all the proofs, why do you think I'm badmouthing Bama? Or is it that you can't handle the truth?
Again.... just the facts.
This post was edited on 7/18/08 at 4:37 am
Posted on 7/18/08 at 4:27 am to BT4LSU
And in conclusion....
<< bring all your stats, all your downing remarks and comebacks, and all your bold fonts, but the only facts that remain are that it's not football season yet, no downs have been played, no players have been tested, no touchdown passes have been thrown, and not one point has been scored by anyone>>
And that is exactly why I a have a reasonable opinion of Bama. You've formed it with years
of hard, cold facts.
Look-- I want Bama to be good, the SEC needs a good Bama. But to think you'll pass LSU anytime soon-- there is no basis whatsoever for that opinion. And that does not mean we won't lose to you every now and then. We've lost to Arkansas three times these last 10 years, and Ole Miss twice. I know better than that... but it appears you think you're better than those teams, despite the facts.
Again think about it.
Most Bama fans state because LSU sent this starter or that guy to the pros, and they have no idea whose behind them. I give you many, MANY reasons to believe LSU will stay on top for several years. To call that a slam on Bama, or to say you're not a factor in the SEC, based on nearly a generation-- honestly---is laughable.
You've been to the SEC title game less than LSU, Auburn and Arkansas, and exactly once more than Mississippi State has in the last 10 years. You've had 8 losing or 5 loss seasons, as many or more than all the times I just mentioned.
Now, tell me how I insulted you or Bama.
Again-- where have I not stated the truth.
---------------------------------
Being on our board and having your fans rant on our board will usually get a response. I believe my opinions are not only valid, they
serve as a brutal reminder to all Bama fans the
current state of affairs in the SEC.
So one last time--Give us an honest to God reason why, and perhaps 1) you would understand we're not slamming you, this is what Bama is NOW; and 2) you woud understand why most LSU fans have an opinion-- with a LOT of reasonable evidence-- that nothing is going to change.
BTW-- the term........
"Because we're Bama!!" ...........
NO LONGER APPLIES.
So take a little advice- stop bitching.
or EARN IT.
<< bring all your stats, all your downing remarks and comebacks, and all your bold fonts, but the only facts that remain are that it's not football season yet, no downs have been played, no players have been tested, no touchdown passes have been thrown, and not one point has been scored by anyone>>
And that is exactly why I a have a reasonable opinion of Bama. You've formed it with years
of hard, cold facts.
Look-- I want Bama to be good, the SEC needs a good Bama. But to think you'll pass LSU anytime soon-- there is no basis whatsoever for that opinion. And that does not mean we won't lose to you every now and then. We've lost to Arkansas three times these last 10 years, and Ole Miss twice. I know better than that... but it appears you think you're better than those teams, despite the facts.
Again think about it.
Most Bama fans state because LSU sent this starter or that guy to the pros, and they have no idea whose behind them. I give you many, MANY reasons to believe LSU will stay on top for several years. To call that a slam on Bama, or to say you're not a factor in the SEC, based on nearly a generation-- honestly---is laughable.
You've been to the SEC title game less than LSU, Auburn and Arkansas, and exactly once more than Mississippi State has in the last 10 years. You've had 8 losing or 5 loss seasons, as many or more than all the times I just mentioned.
Now, tell me how I insulted you or Bama.
Again-- where have I not stated the truth.
---------------------------------
Being on our board and having your fans rant on our board will usually get a response. I believe my opinions are not only valid, they
serve as a brutal reminder to all Bama fans the
current state of affairs in the SEC.
So one last time--Give us an honest to God reason why, and perhaps 1) you would understand we're not slamming you, this is what Bama is NOW; and 2) you woud understand why most LSU fans have an opinion-- with a LOT of reasonable evidence-- that nothing is going to change.
BTW-- the term........
"Because we're Bama!!" ...........
NO LONGER APPLIES.
So take a little advice- stop bitching.
or EARN IT.
This post was edited on 7/18/08 at 4:36 am
Posted on 7/18/08 at 5:20 am to BT4LSU
You can't repeal the business cycle. Programs, countries, hell everything has their ups and downs.
Bama has been down, but is coming back. LSU is up, and could have easily lost 5 games in 07.
Bama should have won the game last year, but for a crazy late 4th quarter fumble. I am not saying that some Bama fans are not delusional, but if you don't think they have turned the corner,.....
Bama has been down, but is coming back. LSU is up, and could have easily lost 5 games in 07.
Bama should have won the game last year, but for a crazy late 4th quarter fumble. I am not saying that some Bama fans are not delusional, but if you don't think they have turned the corner,.....
Posted on 7/18/08 at 6:47 am to pdunn
quote:
Bama should have won the game last year, but for a crazy late 4th quarter fumble. I am not saying that some Bama fans are not delusional, but if you don't think they have turned the corner,.....
Incorrect.
That said, the idea that any program is guaranteed elite status is absurd, especially an SEC team. My M.O. is to be grateful for the present because you never know what the future will bring. I find the present more fulfilling that way.
Posted on 7/18/08 at 7:08 am to pdunn
<<LSU is up, and could have easily lost 5 games in 07>>
Sure. And UF could have lost to UT, UGA,SC and
Vandy, all games either decided in OT or by 5 points or less. They went 5-0.
And LSU could have lost to Arizona State,Florida, uburn Bama in 2005. Games decided either in OT or by 4 points are less. We went 4-0.
And LSU could have lost to Tennessee, Ole Miss and Arkansas in 2006, all games decided either
by OT or 5 points or less. We won all three.
LSU played 7 top 20 teams, and went 5-2, could have easily lost 5 games, but only lose two....
and those were in TRIPLE OVERTIME.
DO you see the obvious now?
LSU WINS those games all the time.
Now, flip the coin. Bama usually LOSES these
games. Now add the main ingrediant:
Saban once again proved he could play not to lose offense in the 4th quarter.
<<Bama should have won the game last year, but for a crazy late 4th quarter fumble>>
Wrong. For two obvious reasons. The first is listed above.
Second--the game was tied. Bama was going nowhere, and LSU had totally dominated the second half, and the game, save for some freak plays. As usual, Saban was playing not to lose.
Think otherwise? Go to TigerSports.net and review the last 20 minutes of that game. Bama had 30
THIRTY..... yards of total offense. Look at the stats, and specifically the play by play. Sure LSU could have lost that gave. Or the other five.
As usual, they did not.
----------------------------------------------
<
Sure. And UF could have lost to UT, UGA,SC and
Vandy, all games either decided in OT or by 5 points or less. They went 5-0.
And LSU could have lost to Arizona State,Florida, uburn Bama in 2005. Games decided either in OT or by 4 points are less. We went 4-0.
And LSU could have lost to Tennessee, Ole Miss and Arkansas in 2006, all games decided either
by OT or 5 points or less. We won all three.
LSU played 7 top 20 teams, and went 5-2, could have easily lost 5 games, but only lose two....
and those were in TRIPLE OVERTIME.
DO you see the obvious now?
LSU WINS those games all the time.
Now, flip the coin. Bama usually LOSES these
games. Now add the main ingrediant:
Saban once again proved he could play not to lose offense in the 4th quarter.
<<Bama should have won the game last year, but for a crazy late 4th quarter fumble>>
Wrong. For two obvious reasons. The first is listed above.
Second--the game was tied. Bama was going nowhere, and LSU had totally dominated the second half, and the game, save for some freak plays. As usual, Saban was playing not to lose.
Think otherwise? Go to TigerSports.net and review the last 20 minutes of that game. Bama had 30
THIRTY..... yards of total offense. Look at the stats, and specifically the play by play. Sure LSU could have lost that gave. Or the other five.
As usual, they did not.
----------------------------------------------
<
Posted on 7/18/08 at 7:30 am to BT4LSU
More Dunn...
<I am not saying that some Bama fans are not delusional, but if you don't think they have turned the corner,.....>>
I'm trying to be rational, and not to flame.
Thnk about what I'm saying.
Please tell me why they've turned the corner.
Again, is it because they hired Saban?
Think about it.
Or it because they won the mythical recruiting class title? What did that prove?
Or is it because of "process"????
Have you bothered to look what's happening to them in the offseason?
----------------------------------------------
Saban. as usual, for the 15th time in 16 years, lost 3 games or more (in this case, 5 games),
and was out of the Top 25 by the 8th game.
The sad thing was.. he had a very talented (but thin) team. He should have gone at least 8-4 with that talent, and I bet Shula would have. Instead,
Bama went 7-5 and despite how close they were....
they went 7-5... and just as easily could have gone 5-7.
Need more proof? I'm looking at the 2007 preseason guides and find that many agreed last year. For example,both Danny Sheridan, Phil Steele picked Bama as darkhorse NC contenders, and Vegas had the over under on Bama at 9 wins.
They said Bama had talent.
Although it was thin...they did have talent.
They went 7-5.
Saban squandered the talent.
And that recruiting class? 32 kids, a 3.72 average by Rivals? You do know that they completely oversigned the class (32 kids) that already 6 have have not qualified or are seeking other alternatives, and that Shula had better players 2 years ago at the skill positions (Parker, Protho, Hall, Caldwell on offense and
McCain, Hall, Castille on defense than they do now? Or even next year?
Moreso....Should we compare the Rival ranking between LSU and Bama over the last 5 years?
The fact that UF, LSU, UGA UT, and Auburn all
have close to the same CUMULATIVE average for over 100 players.. all seasoned with game experience?
We've already dispelled that myth completely.
-----------------------------------------
But it's Saban's discipline, right?
And how many Bama players have been arrested so far this year??? 10???
And after we won the NC in 2003, should we talk about what happened to stars like Damien James,
et al???
-------------------------------
Again.... objectively, think about it. Look at Bama's tendencies. Look at the coaches Saban is up against, and the offensive problems Saban faces with his overload defense. Look how he plays not to lose, and the gambling styles of the LSUs, Auburns, and Floridas. Look at the talent
Bama got, and then look at how much more all the other teams still have.
Here is what I see.
Saban is in a bad spot For Saban, he is the wrong coach at the wrong time, a hasty hire with possible serious repercussions. He's a very good coach who has been dealt a bad hand, but that does not matter. He is expected to win immediately, and win big immediately. He simply
cannot, given the current superpowers already established in the SEC. He'll tell every Bama
big buck supporter or media guru to piss off,
and he'll not get the benefit of the doubt.
Bama is also in a bad spot. They need to win now, the players Saban had aren't the ones that he needs to be sucessful, and that means starting over-- just to get to the level he was at LSU-- not just the 2 SEC titles and the NC-- but to be where he always is-- at the average three losses per season Saban teams. Sure, Saban could break out and eventually win a NC-- he did at LSU-- but look at the perfect set of circumstances he had in Baton Rouge. NONE exist currently in Tuscaloosa.
In the meantime, despite ALL of this...the SEC continues to evolve. UF, LSU and Auburn all have gone to the spread. UGA is cashing in on a great offensive coaching mind.
And to close the door on this obvious point...
How many SEC teams have better offensive minds than Saban, or his OCs? And honestly-- does his
overload really even match up against ANY TEAM running the spread offense?
Had Rich Rodriguez or even Petrino shown up at Bama, I'd be a helluva lot more worried than I am now.
Now, tell me about that corner.
Because, I've just shown you why it appears to be a very long, straight highway. Most pundits should have figured it out by now.
Again, there no hate here. Just objective analysis. The "bubbagumps" that came to this board screaming superiority came to US..and not vice versa.
Back then I gave many reasons why Bama would be lucky to go 7-5. Look it up if you care. And now
you can see what i happening- it's all falling apart, right in front everyone's eyes.
Again...no offense-- but this is simply too easy to see. This is a terrible matchup, Saban and Bama.
Bama is going to become a complete train wreck, and very soon.
Just remember I told you so.
<I am not saying that some Bama fans are not delusional, but if you don't think they have turned the corner,.....>>
I'm trying to be rational, and not to flame.
Thnk about what I'm saying.
Please tell me why they've turned the corner.
Again, is it because they hired Saban?
Think about it.
Or it because they won the mythical recruiting class title? What did that prove?
Or is it because of "process"????
Have you bothered to look what's happening to them in the offseason?
----------------------------------------------
Saban. as usual, for the 15th time in 16 years, lost 3 games or more (in this case, 5 games),
and was out of the Top 25 by the 8th game.
The sad thing was.. he had a very talented (but thin) team. He should have gone at least 8-4 with that talent, and I bet Shula would have. Instead,
Bama went 7-5 and despite how close they were....
they went 7-5... and just as easily could have gone 5-7.
Need more proof? I'm looking at the 2007 preseason guides and find that many agreed last year. For example,both Danny Sheridan, Phil Steele picked Bama as darkhorse NC contenders, and Vegas had the over under on Bama at 9 wins.
They said Bama had talent.
Although it was thin...they did have talent.
They went 7-5.
Saban squandered the talent.
And that recruiting class? 32 kids, a 3.72 average by Rivals? You do know that they completely oversigned the class (32 kids) that already 6 have have not qualified or are seeking other alternatives, and that Shula had better players 2 years ago at the skill positions (Parker, Protho, Hall, Caldwell on offense and
McCain, Hall, Castille on defense than they do now? Or even next year?
Moreso....Should we compare the Rival ranking between LSU and Bama over the last 5 years?
The fact that UF, LSU, UGA UT, and Auburn all
have close to the same CUMULATIVE average for over 100 players.. all seasoned with game experience?
We've already dispelled that myth completely.
-----------------------------------------
But it's Saban's discipline, right?
And how many Bama players have been arrested so far this year??? 10???
And after we won the NC in 2003, should we talk about what happened to stars like Damien James,
et al???
-------------------------------
Again.... objectively, think about it. Look at Bama's tendencies. Look at the coaches Saban is up against, and the offensive problems Saban faces with his overload defense. Look how he plays not to lose, and the gambling styles of the LSUs, Auburns, and Floridas. Look at the talent
Bama got, and then look at how much more all the other teams still have.
Here is what I see.
Saban is in a bad spot For Saban, he is the wrong coach at the wrong time, a hasty hire with possible serious repercussions. He's a very good coach who has been dealt a bad hand, but that does not matter. He is expected to win immediately, and win big immediately. He simply
cannot, given the current superpowers already established in the SEC. He'll tell every Bama
big buck supporter or media guru to piss off,
and he'll not get the benefit of the doubt.
Bama is also in a bad spot. They need to win now, the players Saban had aren't the ones that he needs to be sucessful, and that means starting over-- just to get to the level he was at LSU-- not just the 2 SEC titles and the NC-- but to be where he always is-- at the average three losses per season Saban teams. Sure, Saban could break out and eventually win a NC-- he did at LSU-- but look at the perfect set of circumstances he had in Baton Rouge. NONE exist currently in Tuscaloosa.
In the meantime, despite ALL of this...the SEC continues to evolve. UF, LSU and Auburn all have gone to the spread. UGA is cashing in on a great offensive coaching mind.
And to close the door on this obvious point...
How many SEC teams have better offensive minds than Saban, or his OCs? And honestly-- does his
overload really even match up against ANY TEAM running the spread offense?
Had Rich Rodriguez or even Petrino shown up at Bama, I'd be a helluva lot more worried than I am now.
Now, tell me about that corner.
Because, I've just shown you why it appears to be a very long, straight highway. Most pundits should have figured it out by now.
Again, there no hate here. Just objective analysis. The "bubbagumps" that came to this board screaming superiority came to US..and not vice versa.
Back then I gave many reasons why Bama would be lucky to go 7-5. Look it up if you care. And now
you can see what i happening- it's all falling apart, right in front everyone's eyes.
Again...no offense-- but this is simply too easy to see. This is a terrible matchup, Saban and Bama.
Bama is going to become a complete train wreck, and very soon.
Just remember I told you so.
Posted on 7/18/08 at 8:21 am to BT4LSU
BT4, couple of questions for you. 1) About turning the corner, take off the purple glasses for a sec and tell me, was Saban an upgrade over Shula? 2) Is recruiting the #11, #10 and #1 b2b2b better than #30, #49, #15, and #18? 3) Will this influx of better talent at all positions, coaching at all positions, and a winning attitude matter?
To me, that looks as if we have started to turn a corner. I will also man up and say that we have a chance in BR this year. I know it will be loud and obnoxious, but it will go "death"ly quiet if your frosh or ivy league qb throws a pick six. It will stay quiet if your coach thinks his best option is kicking to one of the best return men in the league again. I am not predicting a win but I am saying we have a chance. Due to mistakes from you and a few plays from our guys we had a chance last year, and if you were really honest, if the catch that Caddell made is not overturned we aren't having the same conversation today.
I know, here comes the ifs and buts, and I agree with that, just saying is all. September can't get here soon enough. RTR
To me, that looks as if we have started to turn a corner. I will also man up and say that we have a chance in BR this year. I know it will be loud and obnoxious, but it will go "death"ly quiet if your frosh or ivy league qb throws a pick six. It will stay quiet if your coach thinks his best option is kicking to one of the best return men in the league again. I am not predicting a win but I am saying we have a chance. Due to mistakes from you and a few plays from our guys we had a chance last year, and if you were really honest, if the catch that Caddell made is not overturned we aren't having the same conversation today.
I know, here comes the ifs and buts, and I agree with that, just saying is all. September can't get here soon enough. RTR
Posted on 7/18/08 at 5:04 pm to KPCrimson
KPCrimson
BT4, couple of questions for you. 1) About turning the corner, take off the purple glasses for a sec and tell me, was Saban an upgrade over Shula?
Once again, read my post and learn.
My honest, unbiased opinion? Saban is a much netter organizer and recruiter. He's a little better defensiovely but not as good offensively.
The whole picture to date isn't that clear....so it might be a little too early to decide... again, correct me if I am wrong as I review the facts TO DATE.
Go ahead, read on. As you do. you may stop laughing when you see the facts.
----------------------------------------------
Let's start with that recruiting comment ...
<<2) Is recruiting the #11, #10 and #1 b2b2b better than #30, #49, #15, and #18?
Apples to oranges. Saban has had 2 classes at
Bama. Only fair to compare Shula's last 2 classses.
But whose ranking to believe???
Let's say RIVALS.
LINK
WOW. It appears not only did Shula go 10-2 with
few skolls in 2006, he also had a #11 and #18 class thereafter.
Not bad.
Or... could RIVALS BE WRONG???
Hmmmm.......
Saban SUPPOSEDLY has a #10 class in 2007, and Shula had #11 in 2005, but... the TOTAL POINTS WERE HIGHER (snicker) FOR SHULA.
2127 to Saban 1895.....
Hmmm. it looks like Shula's #11 class was 232
points higher than Saban's 2007 class.
OH DAMN!! How'd THAT happen????
------------------------------------------
But lets give ol Nick 15 months and see what he can do... a #1 class right?????
RIGHT???
Nope.
Now Saban signed 32 this year, but hell, he's already lost 7 of them. So make it 25 with the loss of 5 four star players, and 2 three star players.
Let's assume (since Rivals scoring system is so stupid) that a 5 star gets 200 points, a 4 star gets 100 points and a 3 star gets, hell, I don;t know, I guess 42 points.
That's the only way I can get close to the
number Bama ended up with in February (2836)
I came up with 2836 this way....
3 five stars x 200= 600 points
19 four stars X 100= 1900 points; and
8 three stars X 42 = 336 for a total of 2836
But wait....
Now lets subtract those 5 four stars (-500) and 2
three stars... 86 -- thus the current number is
initial value 2836
less adjusted -586... equalling
===============>>>>>>>>> 2256 points
again.... IF (big if) those wonderful numbers at Rivals are correct...
---------------------------------------------
And just how many points did that #18 class of Shulas have-- accoring to Rivals????
That would be 1426.
So let's add them up.
Shula 2005 and 2006
ACCORDING TO RIVALS....is 1426 plus 2127 for a total of 3553 points.
Saban would be 1895 plus 2256 or 3151 poins.
That number BTW, drops Bama's 2008 class from #1....all the way to #8...
Which means... Saban has had a #11 and #8 class.
Shula had a #11 and a #18 class.
And Saban's #8 class continues to drop.
Again... take off your CRIMSON glasses...
and think about what I have been posting.
There not a lot of difference there.
---------------------------------------------
KP then stated...
Will this influx of better talent at all positions,
Well, we just proved it's not that much, right? Again--who has the glasses on now?
------------------------------------------
<<Will this influx of better coaching at all positions>>
Huh? 4 of your new assistants have yet to coach a GAME!How do you know that? Because of what Saban did at LSU? Can you ignore the end of the season, or the assistant coaches who got the hell out of Bama.... after one year???
Since it appears this is a LOT closer than some Crimson eyeglass-wearing people think, let's zero in on the hard line :
WINS.
Victories...Saban won 6 regular season games. NOT an improvement over Shula's last year,
a one game improvement over two years ago.
Remember Shula had less skollys. And he went 10-2 one year. Most of those kids were still on the team Saban's first year. Even Sheridan, Finebaum and Steele ALL THOUGHT Saban had at least as much talent as LSU did in 2001, and all had Bama as a dark horse for the NC last year.
Yet Saban went 6-6. Saban has yet to do
ANYTHING at Bama. Shula at least went 10-2 once.
[b]Saban also exceeded that figure ONCE in 5 years at LSU (8-4, 10-3, 8-5 13-1, 9-3).
Still talking about glasses? Thought not.
These are facts, KP.
Shula has done more.
Slight advantage to Shula to date when it comes to W's, but honestly not fair to Saban, just like the recruiting numbers were unfair to Shula.
---------------------------------------------
<<Will this influx of a winning attitude matter?>>
Ok see the last comment.It's too early to judge what Saban will do, despite what you THINK he's going to do.
So after 2009 honestly ask YOURSELF these three questions:
1. Does Bama in FACT have a better winning record?
[b]Or was it all Saban's smoke and mirrors???
2. Does Bama in FACT have a better attitude?
Or did Saban know he could not win and bought himself time?
3. Did Saban win more than 6 games, like Shula did both his last two years, and/or won at least 10, like Shula did in 2005 when Bama played in it's only New Year game in the new millenium?
-----------------------------------------------
Like I said....
"I see a train wreck a'comin'...."
-----------------------------------------------
MEMEAUX:
STOP COMPARING SABAN'S DAYS AT LSU TO
YOUR CURRENT SITUATION.
IT SIMPLY DOES NOT APPLY.
Now......
Once again........
.......WHO'S WEARING GLASSES?
BT4, couple of questions for you. 1) About turning the corner, take off the purple glasses for a sec and tell me, was Saban an upgrade over Shula?
Once again, read my post and learn.
My honest, unbiased opinion? Saban is a much netter organizer and recruiter. He's a little better defensiovely but not as good offensively.
The whole picture to date isn't that clear....so it might be a little too early to decide... again, correct me if I am wrong as I review the facts TO DATE.
Go ahead, read on. As you do. you may stop laughing when you see the facts.
----------------------------------------------
Let's start with that recruiting comment ...
<<2) Is recruiting the #11, #10 and #1 b2b2b better than #30, #49, #15, and #18?
Apples to oranges. Saban has had 2 classes at
Bama. Only fair to compare Shula's last 2 classses.
But whose ranking to believe???
Let's say RIVALS.
LINK
WOW. It appears not only did Shula go 10-2 with
few skolls in 2006, he also had a #11 and #18 class thereafter.
Not bad.
Or... could RIVALS BE WRONG???
Hmmmm.......
Saban SUPPOSEDLY has a #10 class in 2007, and Shula had #11 in 2005, but... the TOTAL POINTS WERE HIGHER (snicker) FOR SHULA.
2127 to Saban 1895.....
Hmmm. it looks like Shula's #11 class was 232
points higher than Saban's 2007 class.
OH DAMN!! How'd THAT happen????
------------------------------------------
But lets give ol Nick 15 months and see what he can do... a #1 class right?????
RIGHT???
Nope.
Now Saban signed 32 this year, but hell, he's already lost 7 of them. So make it 25 with the loss of 5 four star players, and 2 three star players.
Let's assume (since Rivals scoring system is so stupid) that a 5 star gets 200 points, a 4 star gets 100 points and a 3 star gets, hell, I don;t know, I guess 42 points.
That's the only way I can get close to the
number Bama ended up with in February (2836)
I came up with 2836 this way....
3 five stars x 200= 600 points
19 four stars X 100= 1900 points; and
8 three stars X 42 = 336 for a total of 2836
But wait....
Now lets subtract those 5 four stars (-500) and 2
three stars... 86 -- thus the current number is
initial value 2836
less adjusted -586... equalling
===============>>>>>>>>> 2256 points
again.... IF (big if) those wonderful numbers at Rivals are correct...
---------------------------------------------
And just how many points did that #18 class of Shulas have-- accoring to Rivals????
That would be 1426.
So let's add them up.
Shula 2005 and 2006
ACCORDING TO RIVALS....is 1426 plus 2127 for a total of 3553 points.
Saban would be 1895 plus 2256 or 3151 poins.
That number BTW, drops Bama's 2008 class from #1....all the way to #8...
Which means... Saban has had a #11 and #8 class.
Shula had a #11 and a #18 class.
And Saban's #8 class continues to drop.
Again... take off your CRIMSON glasses...
and think about what I have been posting.
There not a lot of difference there.
---------------------------------------------
KP then stated...
Will this influx of better talent at all positions,
Well, we just proved it's not that much, right? Again--who has the glasses on now?
------------------------------------------
<<Will this influx of better coaching at all positions>>
Huh? 4 of your new assistants have yet to coach a GAME!How do you know that? Because of what Saban did at LSU? Can you ignore the end of the season, or the assistant coaches who got the hell out of Bama.... after one year???
Since it appears this is a LOT closer than some Crimson eyeglass-wearing people think, let's zero in on the hard line :
WINS.
Victories...Saban won 6 regular season games. NOT an improvement over Shula's last year,
a one game improvement over two years ago.
Remember Shula had less skollys. And he went 10-2 one year. Most of those kids were still on the team Saban's first year. Even Sheridan, Finebaum and Steele ALL THOUGHT Saban had at least as much talent as LSU did in 2001, and all had Bama as a dark horse for the NC last year.
Yet Saban went 6-6. Saban has yet to do
ANYTHING at Bama. Shula at least went 10-2 once.
[b]Saban also exceeded that figure ONCE in 5 years at LSU (8-4, 10-3, 8-5 13-1, 9-3).
Still talking about glasses? Thought not.
These are facts, KP.
Shula has done more.
Slight advantage to Shula to date when it comes to W's, but honestly not fair to Saban, just like the recruiting numbers were unfair to Shula.
---------------------------------------------
<<Will this influx of a winning attitude matter?>>
Ok see the last comment.It's too early to judge what Saban will do, despite what you THINK he's going to do.
So after 2009 honestly ask YOURSELF these three questions:
1. Does Bama in FACT have a better winning record?
[b]Or was it all Saban's smoke and mirrors???
2. Does Bama in FACT have a better attitude?
Or did Saban know he could not win and bought himself time?
3. Did Saban win more than 6 games, like Shula did both his last two years, and/or won at least 10, like Shula did in 2005 when Bama played in it's only New Year game in the new millenium?
-----------------------------------------------
Like I said....
"I see a train wreck a'comin'...."
-----------------------------------------------
MEMEAUX:
STOP COMPARING SABAN'S DAYS AT LSU TO
YOUR CURRENT SITUATION.
IT SIMPLY DOES NOT APPLY.
Now......
Once again........
.......WHO'S WEARING GLASSES?
This post was edited on 7/18/08 at 5:11 pm
Posted on 7/18/08 at 5:13 pm to bamaatlsu
most of us on here have learned BT4LSU just spews his own twisted version of the truth. his 'facts' have been disproven time and time again.
According to your own posts, I was exactly one (1) game off in 30 years , and I corrected you when YOU distorted the facts.
Again... twll me why I'm wrong. You tell me I'm slamming Bama... yet 99% if what I say is true!
If you want to dream...dream big... B@LSU.
According to your own posts, I was exactly one (1) game off in 30 years , and I corrected you when YOU distorted the facts.
Again... twll me why I'm wrong. You tell me I'm slamming Bama... yet 99% if what I say is true!
If you want to dream...dream big... B@LSU.
Posted on 7/18/08 at 5:14 pm to BT4LSU
quote:
That number BTW, drops Bama's 2008 class from #1....all the way to #11, orexactly 2 POINTS ahead of LSU (2134)...
Which means... Saban has had a #10 and #11 class.
Shula had a #11 and a #18 class.
Posted on 7/18/08 at 5:17 pm to BT4LSU
quote:
The sad thing was.. he had a very talented (but thin) team. He should have gone at least 8-4 with that talent, and I bet Shula would have.
Though I think Bama is much better off with Saban for obvious reasons, I agree that Saban did an aweful coaching job last year and Shula would have won more games. Or Shula would have won just as many without the refs winning the Arky game (and maybe Ole Miss).
Posted on 7/18/08 at 5:22 pm to KPCrimson
KP's gem here
<<To me, that looks as if we have started to turn a corner. I will also man up and say that we have a chance in BR this year. I know it will be loud and obnoxious, but it will go "death"ly quiet if your frosh or ivy league qb throws a pick six. It will stay quiet if your coach thinks his best option is kicking to one of the best return men in the league again. I am not predicting a win but I am saying we have a chance. Due to mistakes from you and a few plays from our guys we had a chance last year,
Nail, meet hammer.
It won't happen in Tiger Stadium.
But I'm laughing at this one:
<<and if you were really honest, if the catch that Caddell made>>
Easily overturned, because it was NOT a catch. Are you in denial on that too?
we aren't having the same conversation today.
ROTFLMAO!!!!Are you serious? My dear God, not only are you saying it was a catch... are you also saying you would have gotten a score, and ten stopped LSU?
MEMEAUX:
You had thirty (30) yards in the fourth quarter. You did virtually NOTHING on like 20 other plays...over like 20 minutes of the game! Look it up!! Honestly... what makes you think you would have even gotten a FG because you "ALMOST" converted on one play???
<<I know, here comes the ifs and buts>>
Uhhhhh.... no. There are no IFs.
There are only FACTS.
<<September can't get here soon enough>>
Wow!!! We can agree!!!
<<RTR>>
On second thought...scratch that.
:lol:
<<To me, that looks as if we have started to turn a corner. I will also man up and say that we have a chance in BR this year. I know it will be loud and obnoxious, but it will go "death"ly quiet if your frosh or ivy league qb throws a pick six. It will stay quiet if your coach thinks his best option is kicking to one of the best return men in the league again. I am not predicting a win but I am saying we have a chance. Due to mistakes from you and a few plays from our guys we had a chance last year,
Nail, meet hammer.
It won't happen in Tiger Stadium.
But I'm laughing at this one:
<<and if you were really honest, if the catch that Caddell made>>
Easily overturned, because it was NOT a catch. Are you in denial on that too?
we aren't having the same conversation today.
ROTFLMAO!!!!Are you serious? My dear God, not only are you saying it was a catch... are you also saying you would have gotten a score, and ten stopped LSU?
MEMEAUX:
You had thirty (30) yards in the fourth quarter. You did virtually NOTHING on like 20 other plays...over like 20 minutes of the game! Look it up!! Honestly... what makes you think you would have even gotten a FG because you "ALMOST" converted on one play???
<<I know, here comes the ifs and buts>>
Uhhhhh.... no. There are no IFs.
There are only FACTS.
<<September can't get here soon enough>>
Wow!!! We can agree!!!
<<RTR>>
On second thought...scratch that.
:lol:Posted on 7/18/08 at 6:33 pm to BT4LSU
Wow BT4 your drivel makes my head hurt. Enough already. First of all, you said yourself it was laughable, which it is, to think Saban and Shula are in the same league as far as coaching goes. Again, I ask, if Les leaves and all that is left is Saban or Shula. You can sit there with a straight face and say you don't know? Second, since you are so good at pointing out how many players Saban had leave, let me tell you this...last years class even after the losses had 3/5 stars, 14/4 stars, 7/3stars, and 1/2star for an average ranking of 3.76. There were only two other teams that rated higher than that, I think. I have neither the time nor the energy to look and see what players the other teams lost due to grades, etc.(I'm sure you will tell me though) By the way, ALL of LSU's players ALWAYS make it through right?
About Caddell's cath, whatever dude, you and everyone else in the world knows that it could have gone either way. There is even a new Caddell Rule, if you will, this year put in place for crap like that. If you don't believe me look it up (I will wait for you to say ULM or something again and I will post it for you).
To answer your question about the catch. No I am not saying we would have scored but, I believe at that time we were ahead by one score. A first down there gives us the ball for a few more minutes keeping the ball out of LSU's hands. Who knows what happens then. Secondly, are you trying to say it would have been impossible to stop you. Hmmmmm, I believe it took every play available for you to score, it was 4th down right when your guy made a great play to tie it up. Lastly, who cares? It's over. One of the best games of the year happened in T'Town last year and you came out on top. Congrats! I do like how you hit all of your points of how the Nail will meet a hammer or whatever, and that won't happen in Death Valley this year, without even trying to defend that you have a frosh and ivy league qb that have really never played (Don't talk to me about how they will be seasoned then. Will our "crappy" recruiting classes not be also with all of the road trips we have prior to that? Very poor argument from you). You guys have one of the best teams in the country except for the qb position (The field general). Again, what happens when things go "Death"ly quiet due to a mistake by them. There's no chance a frosh could get rattled right? None. Puuhhhhhllllleeeeeaaaaassssseee. I don't care how good they are, even Tim "The Superman" Tebow made mistakes his first year and I don't see either of your qbs being Superman yet.
Ok BT4 tear it apart. Finish my drivel with more of your own.
About Caddell's cath, whatever dude, you and everyone else in the world knows that it could have gone either way. There is even a new Caddell Rule, if you will, this year put in place for crap like that. If you don't believe me look it up (I will wait for you to say ULM or something again and I will post it for you).
To answer your question about the catch. No I am not saying we would have scored but, I believe at that time we were ahead by one score. A first down there gives us the ball for a few more minutes keeping the ball out of LSU's hands. Who knows what happens then. Secondly, are you trying to say it would have been impossible to stop you. Hmmmmm, I believe it took every play available for you to score, it was 4th down right when your guy made a great play to tie it up. Lastly, who cares? It's over. One of the best games of the year happened in T'Town last year and you came out on top. Congrats! I do like how you hit all of your points of how the Nail will meet a hammer or whatever, and that won't happen in Death Valley this year, without even trying to defend that you have a frosh and ivy league qb that have really never played (Don't talk to me about how they will be seasoned then. Will our "crappy" recruiting classes not be also with all of the road trips we have prior to that? Very poor argument from you). You guys have one of the best teams in the country except for the qb position (The field general). Again, what happens when things go "Death"ly quiet due to a mistake by them. There's no chance a frosh could get rattled right? None. Puuhhhhhllllleeeeeaaaaassssseee. I don't care how good they are, even Tim "The Superman" Tebow made mistakes his first year and I don't see either of your qbs being Superman yet.
Ok BT4 tear it apart. Finish my drivel with more of your own.
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