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College Football Rankings Issues
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:44 pm
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:44 pm
With all the hate that the CFP committee is getting for perceived SEC biases, I wanted to point out that the same was said for the BCS ranking system. And yet, the AP poll, Coaches Poll, BCS, and CFP rankings for week 13 have nearly identical top 15 teams with just a flip between a couple spots. As with any ranking system, there will be flaws because we are talking about groups of 18-22 year olds playing football in various environmental conditions week in and week out against each other. The rarity of a team having consistent execution week in and week out has been proven year in and year out.
Therefore, ranking teams that all have inconsistent performances is impossible to perfect. Whether we opt for a computer-based objectified ranking system that takes statistics and wins/losses and generates rankings that have no subjective component or we do the opposite and take a committee of humans to watch all football games and make subjective opinions on each team and their deserved rankings.
The fact of the matter is, regardless which ranking system we opt to use in the future, there will be large groups of people voicing opposition because they do not agree with the ranking system. The SEC has been dominant against other conferences or when compared to other conferences over the last 20 years or so. 12 of last 15 National Champions are SEC teams. 9 of those 12 champions beat a contender from another conference. 2 of the 3 times the SEC did not win the national title, they had the team that placed runner-up. At the beginning of this season, NFL rosters contained 339 former SEC players compared to the next best conference, B10, with 253. 5 of the top 10 individual college programs with the most talent in NFL were SEC teams, next best being ACC/BIG10 both with 2 teams (Miami, Florida St/Ohio State, Penn State). ( LINK)
These two metrics, National Championships and NFL player production, illustrate that the SEC is objectively the best conference by continually producing the most talent across the board.
Lets also look at interconference records since 1998:
Against ACC:
Pac12 29-11 (72.5%)
Big10 54-39 (58.06%)
SEC 123-89 (58.01%)
BIG12 33-34 (49.25%)
Against Big12:
SEC 54-41 (56.84%)
ACC 34-33 (50.74%)
Big10 41-49 (45.55%)
Pac12 46-61 (42.99%)
Against Big10:
SEC 55-40 (57.89%)
BIG12 49-41 (54.44%)
Pac12 73-62 (54.07%)
ACC 39-54 (41.93%)
Against Pac12:
SEC 24-18 (57.14%)
Big12 61-46 (57.00%)
Big10 62-73 (45.92%)
ACC 11-29 (27.5%)
Against SEC:
Big12 41-54 (43.15%)
Pac12 18-24 (42.85%)
Big10 40-55 (42.10%)
ACC 89-123 (41.98%)
( LINK)
No single active conference has a winning record against the SEC since 1998. Only one conference has a significantly better winning percentage against another conference than the SEC (PAC12 against ACC). This demonstrates the dominance of the SEC against other conferences over the last ~25 years.
I don't see an SEC bias, I see the SEC is truly the better conference with better teams. This leads to some SEC teams to lose more games but still be better teams than their similarly ranked counter parts in other conferences with less losses (LSU v USC or Alabama v Clemson in week 13 rankings). Maybe the BCS was not as biased or flawed as people thought, maybe there has never been a bias and its just that the SEC is legitimately be the better conference for the last 15-25 years straight.
I am excited for the expansion of the CFP to 12 teams. At 12 teams, however, there will still be complaints about which team deserves that 12th spot. There will never be unilateral agreement on the top 25 rankings regardless of what ranking system or method is utilized. But hopefully once the Rose Bowl allows us to go to the expanded playoff, people will remain content with this system for longer than 8-9 years.
Therefore, ranking teams that all have inconsistent performances is impossible to perfect. Whether we opt for a computer-based objectified ranking system that takes statistics and wins/losses and generates rankings that have no subjective component or we do the opposite and take a committee of humans to watch all football games and make subjective opinions on each team and their deserved rankings.
The fact of the matter is, regardless which ranking system we opt to use in the future, there will be large groups of people voicing opposition because they do not agree with the ranking system. The SEC has been dominant against other conferences or when compared to other conferences over the last 20 years or so. 12 of last 15 National Champions are SEC teams. 9 of those 12 champions beat a contender from another conference. 2 of the 3 times the SEC did not win the national title, they had the team that placed runner-up. At the beginning of this season, NFL rosters contained 339 former SEC players compared to the next best conference, B10, with 253. 5 of the top 10 individual college programs with the most talent in NFL were SEC teams, next best being ACC/BIG10 both with 2 teams (Miami, Florida St/Ohio State, Penn State). ( LINK)
These two metrics, National Championships and NFL player production, illustrate that the SEC is objectively the best conference by continually producing the most talent across the board.
Lets also look at interconference records since 1998:
Against ACC:
Pac12 29-11 (72.5%)
Big10 54-39 (58.06%)
SEC 123-89 (58.01%)
BIG12 33-34 (49.25%)
Against Big12:
SEC 54-41 (56.84%)
ACC 34-33 (50.74%)
Big10 41-49 (45.55%)
Pac12 46-61 (42.99%)
Against Big10:
SEC 55-40 (57.89%)
BIG12 49-41 (54.44%)
Pac12 73-62 (54.07%)
ACC 39-54 (41.93%)
Against Pac12:
SEC 24-18 (57.14%)
Big12 61-46 (57.00%)
Big10 62-73 (45.92%)
ACC 11-29 (27.5%)
Against SEC:
Big12 41-54 (43.15%)
Pac12 18-24 (42.85%)
Big10 40-55 (42.10%)
ACC 89-123 (41.98%)
( LINK)
No single active conference has a winning record against the SEC since 1998. Only one conference has a significantly better winning percentage against another conference than the SEC (PAC12 against ACC). This demonstrates the dominance of the SEC against other conferences over the last ~25 years.
I don't see an SEC bias, I see the SEC is truly the better conference with better teams. This leads to some SEC teams to lose more games but still be better teams than their similarly ranked counter parts in other conferences with less losses (LSU v USC or Alabama v Clemson in week 13 rankings). Maybe the BCS was not as biased or flawed as people thought, maybe there has never been a bias and its just that the SEC is legitimately be the better conference for the last 15-25 years straight.
I am excited for the expansion of the CFP to 12 teams. At 12 teams, however, there will still be complaints about which team deserves that 12th spot. There will never be unilateral agreement on the top 25 rankings regardless of what ranking system or method is utilized. But hopefully once the Rose Bowl allows us to go to the expanded playoff, people will remain content with this system for longer than 8-9 years.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:48 pm to bayougolf98
You sound insecure as frick to me.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:54 pm to bayougolf98
quote:
The fact of the matter is, regardless which ranking system we opt to use in the future, there will be large groups of people voicing opposition because they do not agree with the ranking system.
Otherwise known as: the people just outside the final rankings. Now it's teams 5 and 6. In the very near future it'll be teams 13 and 14. Neither have much of a case and should've won more games.
quote:
I am excited for the expansion of the CFP to 12 teams
why? It's going to kill the best regular season in sports where games actually mean a whole hell of a lot currently.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 1:04 pm to cajunbama
quote:You got your tickets for he citrus bowl yet boy?
cuckbama
OP- ain't no body have time to read all that shite.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 2:02 pm to bayougolf98
Ain’t nobody reading that
Posted on 11/23/22 at 2:17 pm to bayougolf98
Those stats can be skewed by higher-ranked SEC teams vs lower-ranked teams.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 2:18 pm to bayougolf98
I read it. In the preface you state what I have said all along - the poll is right and we don't need this stupid committee (unless they ever have one with former coaches). The committee is wishy washy and totally contradicts itself week to week. Abolish this ridiculous system.
Thanks for the analysis on the division comparisons. I would have thought % versus Big Ten would have been greater but I am good with the satisfaction of knowing Ohio State has a huge losing record versus SEC.
No, hell no to expansion. The four team playoff has proven that there are less than four worthy teams rather than more. Nobody wants to see two and three loss teams qualify to play for a championship. It will weaken the achievement and make the regular season less meaningful.
Thanks for the analysis on the division comparisons. I would have thought % versus Big Ten would have been greater but I am good with the satisfaction of knowing Ohio State has a huge losing record versus SEC.
No, hell no to expansion. The four team playoff has proven that there are less than four worthy teams rather than more. Nobody wants to see two and three loss teams qualify to play for a championship. It will weaken the achievement and make the regular season less meaningful.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 2:23 pm to BuckI
Works two ways no? Your team doesn't represent well in that stat with SEC.
This post was edited on 11/23/22 at 3:30 pm
Posted on 11/23/22 at 2:27 pm to cajunbama
quote:
cajunbama
quote:
I sound insecure as frick.
FIFY
Posted on 11/23/22 at 3:08 pm to bayougolf98
SEC "bias" is for a reason.
Well over half of the Nat. Championships in the last 20 years were won by SEC teams. Almost all of the rest had an SEC team playing for the title.
The SEC has a much greater number of players drafted/1st round drafted to the NFL than any other conference.
The SEC ACTUALLY is the toughest conference and it isn't close. So SEC teams should get preferential treatment.
Well over half of the Nat. Championships in the last 20 years were won by SEC teams. Almost all of the rest had an SEC team playing for the title.
The SEC has a much greater number of players drafted/1st round drafted to the NFL than any other conference.
The SEC ACTUALLY is the toughest conference and it isn't close. So SEC teams should get preferential treatment.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 5:46 pm to WG_Dawg
If 2 loss teams are being ranked over 1 loss teams then it would seem the games don’t mean all that much.
At least with the expanded playoffs (anything is better than 4) those teams will get a chance
At least with the expanded playoffs (anything is better than 4) those teams will get a chance
Posted on 11/23/22 at 5:47 pm to Jumpinjack
It would seem LSU and bama fans do want to see 2 loss teams in the playoffs. At least lsu fans - not sure about bama
Posted on 11/23/22 at 5:50 pm to justaniceguy
F no, f no from Bama.
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