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Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:35 pm to goldennugget
quote:I don't think a Christian can rightly praise/promote sex that occurs outside of marriage, but it doesn't mean we should be bigoted or seek to have our religious beliefs codified into law.
You are right but at the same time it is irresponsible for Christians to praise/promote deviant behavior that is at ends with God's will.
quote:Certainly Christians aren't to encourage sinning, but we aren't Jesus who has the power to forgive in the way he does. We are commanded to love people with the sacrificial love of Christ. We are told to examine the sin in our own lives as opposed to engaging in the self righteous behavior of condemning others for their sin.
The best comparison would be the woman at the well, who was being ostracized from her town for being a prostitute. Jesus condemned those judging her, then told her her sins are forgiven and go and sin no more.
Jesus forgave her sins, but told her to stop at the same time.
Also, I don't think it was the woman at the well he told that to. It was when he told the pharisees that he who was without sin could cast the first stone at another adulterer.
quote:I think you need to do a deeper evaluation of the text on this teaching.
Too many atheists and pro gay Christians forget the part of that parable where Jesus said go and sin no more.
This post was edited on 2/10/14 at 4:37 pm
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:37 pm to goldennugget
quote:
Jesus condemned those judging her
quote:
Be forgiving, but aim to get them to repent and change their ways.
Well, I can't "aim to get them to repent" in a non-judgmental way so how about I just let the gays do their thing and treat them as I would treat anyone else?
I'll let God be the judge. All he asks of you is to forgive and be forgiven and share your love with others. I suck at all three of those items but I am fully cognizant of how much and how often I fall short.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:39 pm to boXerrumble
quote:
SportsCenter ?@SportsCenter 1m
BREAKING: Missouri DE Michael Sam, SEC co-Defensive Player of the Year, says he is gay; could become first openly gay NFL player.
Wow...
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:41 pm to WDE24
quote:
We are told to examine the sin in our own lives as opposed to engaging in the self righteous behavior of condemning others for their sin.
I'm reminded of the speck and plank parable.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:42 pm to mcneil912
quote:
He would kick your arse
Or lick it.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:44 pm to WDE24
Great post. I bookmarked for reference.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:44 pm to goldennugget
quote:
praise/promote
quote:
but aim to get them to repent and change their ways.
You realize these aren't the same thing I hope.
Atheist or Christian, the whole point is to let others live theirs lives as they see fit, and to do the same.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:47 pm to Duke
Matthew 7:3-5
3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:49 pm to cas4t
For the assist.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:54 pm to Duke
There's quite a few people in this thread who should read those verses.
This post was edited on 2/10/14 at 4:55 pm
Posted on 2/10/14 at 4:58 pm to cas4t
It all fairness, from a former devout Christian I can say that the "do not judge" thing is incorrectly thrown around. It does NOT mean that you aren't supposed to call what you believe to be sin, sin.
As a Christian, if you genuinely believe that a gay person's soul hangs in the balance, how cruel to do have to be to NOT say something?. No, you are no supposed to be mean, cruel or "judgemental" in the sense that many Christians are towards gays but this idea that all religious people should just fully accept it and tell gay people their lives are fine is just silly.
I have no problem with Christians, in the context of friendship, love, etc. telling people they disagree with their lifestyle and what they believe the truth is. I have no problem with that, because when done correctly it is done out of genuine love for you. The problem is that so many "Christians" treat gays as lesser people and put that sin up on a pedestal. Mainstream Christianity has made homosexuality out to be the ultimate evil and that really hurts the cause.
In the end, I don't care if someone is gay but if a christian lovingly tries to do what they see as a kindness, I'm not going to get upset about it. A number of people in this thread however are the wrong kind of "Christian".
As a Christian, if you genuinely believe that a gay person's soul hangs in the balance, how cruel to do have to be to NOT say something?. No, you are no supposed to be mean, cruel or "judgemental" in the sense that many Christians are towards gays but this idea that all religious people should just fully accept it and tell gay people their lives are fine is just silly.
I have no problem with Christians, in the context of friendship, love, etc. telling people they disagree with their lifestyle and what they believe the truth is. I have no problem with that, because when done correctly it is done out of genuine love for you. The problem is that so many "Christians" treat gays as lesser people and put that sin up on a pedestal. Mainstream Christianity has made homosexuality out to be the ultimate evil and that really hurts the cause.
In the end, I don't care if someone is gay but if a christian lovingly tries to do what they see as a kindness, I'm not going to get upset about it. A number of people in this thread however are the wrong kind of "Christian".
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:01 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
Mainstream Christianity has made homosexuality out to be the ultimate evil and that really hurts the cause.
I don't think it is so much that as that's an issue that fills the seats and the donation bucket. Giving the message the people want to hear is a lucrative business. Ask the Fox News. Or MSNBC if they were actually successful.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:03 pm to Roger Klarvin
I agree with every bit of that. But I personally don't believe homosexuals are hell-bound. I believe that Christianity has been skewed over time and that the Bible has been revised to appease those in power.
I think God created homosexuals, and they have the same opportunity as anyone at making it to Heaven.
I think God created homosexuals, and they have the same opportunity as anyone at making it to Heaven.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:03 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
As a Christian, if you genuinely believe that a gay person's soul hangs in the balance
No more than the soul of someone who chronically masturbates.
quote:
how cruel to do have to be to NOT say something?.
ATTENTION:
All chronic masturbators!
I love you and would like you to stop fapping.
God loves you and would like you to stop.
I feel better now.
But I still need to go to Confession.
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:04 pm to Roger Klarvin
I don't see the need to hold a press conference. They have gay players in the sec and nfl right now. No team is gonna turn a player that can help them win away because they are gay
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:04 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
A number of people in this thread however are the wrong kind of "Christian".
AKA Southern Baptists
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:04 pm to Roger Klarvin
Agree with your post. Tim Keller answered a question on this in a town hall type thing. The video is likely still on youtube or somewhere. Essentially he begins by reminding the audience that we are taught through the story of the good samaritan to love our neighbor and that everyone is essentially our neighbor.
He then talks about two different problems he sees in the Christian church in how they relate to gay people. One problem is churches that ignore or completely read out of the Bible the clear teachings that homosexuality is a sin. They do this in a misguided attempt to love their gay neighbors.
The opposite problem, and the one more posters seem to have encountered, are churches/Christians that place such a strong importance on the texts declaring homosexuality as sin that they elevate it above other sins and relate to gay people like a self-righteous pharisee.
ETA: Much of the problem centers around political groups that need to stir up controversy to generate income.
He then talks about two different problems he sees in the Christian church in how they relate to gay people. One problem is churches that ignore or completely read out of the Bible the clear teachings that homosexuality is a sin. They do this in a misguided attempt to love their gay neighbors.
The opposite problem, and the one more posters seem to have encountered, are churches/Christians that place such a strong importance on the texts declaring homosexuality as sin that they elevate it above other sins and relate to gay people like a self-righteous pharisee.
ETA: Much of the problem centers around political groups that need to stir up controversy to generate income.
This post was edited on 2/10/14 at 5:07 pm
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:05 pm to cas4t
Posted on 2/10/14 at 5:06 pm to WDE24
quote:
ETA: Much of the problem centers around political groups that need to stir up controversy to generate income.
Indeed.
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