re: Is Saban a just above average coach propped by the best players in CFB?

Anyone could win with a bunch of 5* on the roster. You have to get them though

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Well, he also won bigly at LSU, so there's that. National titles at 2 different D-1 schools, and there's only 2 that have done that...Saban and Meyer. Very exclusive list.

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I'm not saying Saban isn't a damn good coach, obviously he is or his teams would not have had the success they've had.

I'm kinda digging into what are the primary reasons of his and his teams' successes. He has perfected his system. It took him a few years to get it down, but he has it down now.

Yes, he did. But how much of a role did recruiting play a role in their climb to success?

Saban became the coach at LSU in Nov 1999. He didn't inherit a roster of star players.

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In November 1999, LSU named Nick Saban as their 31st head football coach.[24] In 2000, the Tigers went 8–4 and won the Peach Bowl. The season was somewhat marred by several lopsided losses, including a 34–17 loss to the Auburn Tigers, a 13–10 loss to the UAB Blazers, and a 41–9 loss to the Florida Gators.

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The 2002 season opened with high expectations, but a 26–8 loss at the hands of Virginia Tech raised serious questions about their outlook. However, the Tigers would rebound to win their next six straight, but after a mid-season injury to quarterback Matt Mauck, LSU lost four of its last six games to close the season, including a 21–20 loss at Arkansas, which knocked the Tigers out of the SEC Championship Game, and forced them to share the SEC West Division title with the Razorbacks. LSU also suffered a 35–20 loss to Texas in the Cotton Bowl Classic, and finished 8–5.

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Team recruiting rankings on 247 are screwy before 2000.

LSU Team Rankings (According to 247)

2000 #21
2001 #2
2002 #21 (weird)
2003 #3 (National Championship)
2004 #4

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I'm one of the biggest homers on here, and hate that Saban left LSU. WTS, when he's called the GOAT, it is 100% correct. He eats, sleeps, and lives football. His attention to detail is like no other, and his demand for excellence in his players is what makes them so good. Of course he has many of the best players in the country to work with, but he also coaches to get the absolute most out of them.

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Most college coaches are like this. You think other coaches don't demand attention to detail or hard work and demand excellence?

Yeah, most top college coaches just kinda hang out in the office during practices... jeez, dude...

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Change your handle to "I am stupid". Saban is just not a great recruiter. He's a master executive. He has laser sharp focus. He would be successful at a CEO. He's incredibly detail oriented. He has contingency plans for his contingency plans. He organizes, prepares, plans better than anyone else in the game. Oh yeah, long before he was a head coach, he was considered a defensive guru.

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We can point to some holes this year. And like I said in another post. All coaches are like this at this level.

This Bama team with younger inexperienced talent brings that defense down on par with other programs. Bama has allowed teams to score points equal to other defenses.

Ole Miss scored 31 on Bama.
Ole Miss scored 31 on Arkansas.

I guess it's anecdotal, but the Bama defense allowed Ole Miss to score the same number of points that Arkansas did.

Why is this not a typical "Bama Defense" this year? Their performance level is on par with lesser defenses.

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Change your handle to "I am stupid".

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Good grief...

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If you look at your coach and can honestly say you think he couldn’t do better with your roster you can disparage his coaching ability. I don’t see another team that wouldn’t “trade up” in an instant given the chance.

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Not the intention of this thread.

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Recruiting skills are a massive component of the best coach title. Saban is fantastic.

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Yes, that's what this thread is about. I should've said recruits in the title rather than players.

And yes, Saban is an amazing recruiter. We know this.

I guess the essense of my question is:

We'll take LSU for example. They have talent.

Look at the LSU roster and make a copy team of it every year so its the exact same players and talent. Let Coach O coach one and let Saban coach those same players every year. (We can use any team if you want)

Does Saban still have the success?

Think about the old IROC race. All cars are exactly the same. Let's say all teams in the SEC are exactly the same every year, or close to it. Does Saban still win as much? Take recruiting and talent level out and use only coaching and scheming. Is he still this good?

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He very well may have won a Super Bowl if the Dolphins hd picked up Drew Brees. But then you know this and choose to ignore it. Like I said Saban's success has made you and your argument irrational.

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So what you're saying is Saban needs the elite talent to win? It's not all about coaching?

That is what this thread is about.

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However Coach Saban did leave Miami for a better job, just like he left LSU for a better job.

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You saying the Dolphins job was a better gig than LSU?

Why say something like that? You know it's not true.

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So what you're saying is Saban needs the elite talent to win

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Numbnuts, in the NFL you need an elite QB to win a Super Bowls.

In college Saban won NCs with McElroy and Coker. Do you see what I am saying now.

College football is 80-90 percent recruiting. Miles proved that. Saban is a great recruiter and at least a very good coach but I think he's great. His teams are always well prepared.