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re: A&M fans (regarding Texas)
Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:21 pm to Big12fan
Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:21 pm to Big12fan
quote:
A reasonable but rare post in this thread. There is no reason that both A&M and UT cannot recruit in the top 10 yearly. Looking at the most recent recruiting classes, it appears that both OU & OSU had below average recruiting in Texas. TCU on the other hand did well. Tech did surprisingly well. A&M & UT's classes were both great.
OU also signed in 2011 what Stoops claimed was his greatest class ever. Granted, Brandon Williams transferred to the good guys, but a lot of that high quality Texas talent will always be there.
But on the whole I agree, I think that the move to the SEC will be great for A&M, and great for tu once the game comes back, but it will really hurt the Okie States of the world.
Hopefully, it will consolidate the talent to the bigger programs. Scholarship limits really affect people's ability to create depth. Kids knowing they won't play right away is a factor. RGIII wouldn't play receiver at tu, so he went to Baylor. fricking Baylor. My thinking is that talent will center around A&M, tu, OU, and LSU, even in spite of poor playing time if things play out properly.
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Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:25 pm to TeLeFaWx
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Maybe this example makes sense, Jeff Fuller. Aggie Legacy, and long time Sooner commit until Sherman came. Why?
Fuller knew he'd be nothing more than a blocker in Franchione's offense.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:34 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:
And I still don't understand why you seem so certain that we'll be throwing the ball 50 times a game.
From reading about what they have told players they have recruited. They showed Kohl Stewart film of the Houston offense, and how similar it is to what they did at his high school.
I don't understand how you are so sure we aren't, and why you have such a problem that I prefer Sherman's offense to Sumlin's? Seriously, you say you are jaded by a decade of Aggie football, are you so single minded that everything is either perfect or imperfect? Sherman's 3rd quarter collapses were horrible, and that loss to tu was embarrassing and got him fired. Does that mean no rational person can like a single thing he did? Does that mean I can't look at Sumlin's offense, where he ran it 100 times less a year than Sherman and not think they are going to open it up more? Or the fact that Kliff Kingsbury is the offensive coordinator? Or that in all the FBS Houston threw the ball 682 times last year? The next closest was Tech at 600? In 2009 they threw it 747 times? The next closest was Tech at 669? Does the fact that A&M finished 5th and 7th in those years in total offense, yet threw the ball almost 200 times less, and run it 100 times more concern me?
Also the fact that Sumlin runs a single back clinic.
Not having a leading blocker to me is idiotic in the SEC. I have seen Sherman's offense, it was a west coast pro style offense that implemented a lot of spread. I like it more than Houston/Tech's offense. Sorry that makes you so mad.
This post was edited on 2/13/12 at 2:43 pm
Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:41 pm to CGSC Lobotomy
quote:
Fuller knew he'd be nothing more than a blocker in Franchione's offense.
So recruits will choose a school because they know they wouldn't be utilized? Weird.
So by the same line of thinking, do schools recruit players they know will be utilized in their scheme? And if they do do that, has it ever been a problem when a team, with limited numbers of scholarships, overloads on a certain type of player? Could recruiting a lot of slot receivers ever be a poor decision? Is it ever a reasonable priority to strike a sense of balance?
Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:44 pm to TeLeFaWx
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Does that mean no rational person can like a single thing he did?
Never said this
quote:
Sherman's offense to Sumlin's
You haven't seen Sumlin's offense at A&M yet, but okay. I liked the style of offense we had under Sherman, but he was a terrible playcaller.
quote:
Also the fact that Sumlin runs a single back clinic.
Not having a leading blocker to me is idiotic in the SEC.
Bama runs a one back offense. It's obviously nothing close to a spread, but that's a pretty dumb qualification to use.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 2:53 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:
You haven't seen Sumlin's offense at A&M yet, but okay. I liked the style of offense we had under Sherman, but he was a terrible playcaller.
I think his play calling was poor, but I like the style of offense as well. I much prefer it to Sumlin's offense at Houston. If Sumlin threw the ball 50 times less a year, his offense would still lead the nation in pass attempts. So what exactly do you think the offense is turning in to? What do you have to go on? Although I've never seen Sumlin's offense at A&M, he is bringing over his offensive coordinator. I shouldn't have to defend my rationale there.
quote:
Bama runs a one back offense. It's obviously nothing close to a spread, but that's a pretty dumb qualification to use.
Sorry sorry. Running a single back spread offense is dumb to me. Handing the ball off after it is snapped back in the shotgun to a back standing still with lineman in naturally wider splits doesn't seem like it will work in the SEC.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:00 pm to TeLeFaWx
If they run the exact same offense and are putting it up like Houston did last year, I'll agree with you for sure. I'll just wait to see it. He's run several different types of offenses.
Bama, Florida, Auburn and State all seem to hand off out of the gun quite a bit, though I don't think they use the really wide splits like Mizzou does. Using the really wide splits would piss me off as well because of the talent we have on the line.
I'm mostly playing devil's advocate because I don't know what will happen, and I don't think it would shock anyone if he's fired in 3 years. I by no means think he's some savior like idiots on TA do.
Bama, Florida, Auburn and State all seem to hand off out of the gun quite a bit, though I don't think they use the really wide splits like Mizzou does. Using the really wide splits would piss me off as well because of the talent we have on the line.
I'm mostly playing devil's advocate because I don't know what will happen, and I don't think it would shock anyone if he's fired in 3 years. I by no means think he's some savior like idiots on TA do.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:12 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
All of those schools hand off out of the gun, and seem to have a threat of the run from the QB, so if the linebacker isn't spying in some instance, and purely playing man on the running back, the zone read is based off the defensive end, correct? If your QB is immobile, throw that wrinkle out. In fact, if your QB isn't Tim Tebow or Cam Newton, you probably aren't going to win much. And Tebow even lost like 4 games his first season at it.
Houston's offense never really impressed me. My biggest problem with the Houston offense is that it utilizes mismatches that I don't think will be there in the SEC. In fact it is completely predicated on that. More so in the red zone. Even in Sherman's early years, we went 5 wide in the red zone and were stomped on. If we are doing this Houston offense, and we don't have the ability to run the option in the red zone, we simply won't be successful. What do I hope?
I hope we at least see the current incarnation of the Okie State offense, where the diamond formation and the pistol are used. But to my knowledge, Houston never ran any of that when it was putting up 70 on Tulane.
Houston's offense never really impressed me. My biggest problem with the Houston offense is that it utilizes mismatches that I don't think will be there in the SEC. In fact it is completely predicated on that. More so in the red zone. Even in Sherman's early years, we went 5 wide in the red zone and were stomped on. If we are doing this Houston offense, and we don't have the ability to run the option in the red zone, we simply won't be successful. What do I hope?
I hope we at least see the current incarnation of the Okie State offense, where the diamond formation and the pistol are used. But to my knowledge, Houston never ran any of that when it was putting up 70 on Tulane.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:18 pm to TeLeFaWx
We do have plenty of mobile QBs, though none are close to the level of Tebow or Newton obviously. Kingsbury coached under Holgorsen, and Holgorsen was at UH under Sumlin, so it wouldn't surprise me to see something like Ok State or West Virginia (as mentioned earlier). I'm just ready for the spring to start so we can see it.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:26 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
The SEC is not a substitute for a quality athletic program. Old Miss, Miss St., Vandy ect... aren't dominating recruiting even though they are in the SEC.
LSU spent a long time being average until they got Saban and followed it up with Miles. Bama had a dry stretch until they got Saban. Florida went from the 60s until Spurrier and Meyer.
If aTm made the right hire with Sumlin and if he can win they will recruit better. If aTm continues to win 5 to 7 games a year then the recruiting will be about the same.
LSU spent a long time being average until they got Saban and followed it up with Miles. Bama had a dry stretch until they got Saban. Florida went from the 60s until Spurrier and Meyer.
If aTm made the right hire with Sumlin and if he can win they will recruit better. If aTm continues to win 5 to 7 games a year then the recruiting will be about the same.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:27 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:
We do have plenty of mobile QBs, though none are close to the level of Tebow or Newton obviously. Kingsbury coached under Holgorsen, and Holgorsen was at UH under Sumlin, so it wouldn't surprise me to see something like Ok State or West Virginia (as mentioned earlier). I'm just ready for the spring to start so we can see it.
I only guess time will tell, but even if we pile together a few wins here and there, if the system is that chronically unbalanced, it will leave the cupboard bare when we start over again. That is my greatest fear. Having lack of depth if we ever return to a balanced offense. Thank God for the miracle of Jeff Fuller and Ryan Swope, or Fran's option offense would have destroyed even more.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:43 pm to UT755LN
quote:
The SEC is not a substitute for a quality athletic program. Old Miss, Miss St., Vandy ect... aren't dominating recruiting even though they are in the SEC.
This is where I think the argument is interesting, it is a relatively new phenomenon. When was the last time current high school prospects remember a time when the SEC wasn't dominant? Current high school juniors were in elementary school when Vince Young beat USC. They basically don't remember the half decade before that when the Big XII South was pretty much unanimously considered best division in college football year in and year out. They are all in the Internet Generation. ESPN, video games, Tebow, Cam Newton, Honey Badger, these topics of discussion are permeating nationally at a rate that has never existed prior to right now. It will be interesting to see if the SEC's dominance continues. You would like to believe things are cyclical, but at some point the SEC's dominance could sort of become a self fulfilling prophecy. Vanderbilt might not be better than Baylor or Iowa State, but they might be given the benefit of the doubt because of perceived ability.
It is interesting. The wild card in this is all the Mexicans. In less than a decade, there will be more last names that end in EZ in Texas than anything else. It will be interesting to see how the population shift and wealth shift among people that traditionally have no loyalty or legacies to collegiate athletics affects college football.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 3:55 pm to TeLeFaWx
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The wild card in this is all the Mexicans.
Most of the t-shirt sips are illegal Mexicans...shite!
Posted on 2/13/12 at 4:15 pm to CGSC Lobotomy
And their alumni are increasingly Asian and Indian. They are cornering too many demographics.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 4:26 pm to TeLeFaWx
Better get that cricket team started in Austin
Posted on 2/13/12 at 5:14 pm to CGSC Lobotomy
quote:
Most of the t-shirt sips are illegal Mexicans...shite!
Posted on 2/13/12 at 5:43 pm to texasaggie08
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I think once we actually start playing GAMES in the SEC we'll be able to truly judge the level of media coverage, for better or worse.
If you live in Texas, whether you love or hate A&M, you will be watching A&M football in the SEC. Its funny seeing tu and Gaylor fans try to say how A&M is now dead to them, and they aren't the least bit interested in A&M or SEC football......riiiight. Every single one of those households will be tuned in to A&M-Florida at Kyle Field in September, and everyone in the local and national media will take notice too.
Do Big 12 and Texas fans in particular STILL try to sell the ridiculous notion that A&M is selling out academics and going to a sh#### academic conference? That one always made me laugh out loud considering the current Big 12 conference was literally no better academically than the SEC even before the 2 teams left.
It's funny to me that all of Texas's arrogant talk about not lowering itself to the level of SEC academics was a bunch of bull####. Look at the fact that Texas is perfectly content in adding TCU which wouldn't quite be in the top half of the SEC academically and they say good riddance to 2 of their best schools academically. With the addition of the 2 schools the SEC is clearly a stronger league academically than the Big 12.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 5:47 pm to Govt Tide
I haven't heard it recently. It was just the kind of speak they use to make excuses, similar to how the B1G looks down on academics and the recruiting tactics in the SEC
Posted on 2/13/12 at 5:55 pm to Govt Tide
The fanhood in the state of Texas is a strange dynamic.
It's very hard to explain, and much different than where you're from. 15 years ago, you might have heard the same elitist talk from Aggies.
In all reality, it is just an emotional response, and the justifications come later. You have to realize that maybe 40% of current tu fans don't remember a time when OU wasn't in their conference, when they ever lost to A&M in consecutive years, and they couldn't care less about academics, since they never went to the school. In fact the Thanksgiving game, as opposed to the Red River Shootout, is nothing someone other than an actual Aggie or a Texas Ex would actually participate in. When the State Fair is in Dallas, it consumes the town. It is an event the whole city can take part in. The A&M/tu game, even though it belongs to the State of Texas, never involved the same amount of people.
The average tu fan just likes to degrade A&M as a little brother, and little brother did something to trump them, and they don't like it. It is as simple as that. The academics argument is just unfamiliarity. Honestly, the average Big XII fan probably couldn't tell you all the teams in the SEC. It just isn't a part of the discussion for folks, and unfamiliarity breeds ignorance.
It's very hard to explain, and much different than where you're from. 15 years ago, you might have heard the same elitist talk from Aggies.
In all reality, it is just an emotional response, and the justifications come later. You have to realize that maybe 40% of current tu fans don't remember a time when OU wasn't in their conference, when they ever lost to A&M in consecutive years, and they couldn't care less about academics, since they never went to the school. In fact the Thanksgiving game, as opposed to the Red River Shootout, is nothing someone other than an actual Aggie or a Texas Ex would actually participate in. When the State Fair is in Dallas, it consumes the town. It is an event the whole city can take part in. The A&M/tu game, even though it belongs to the State of Texas, never involved the same amount of people.
The average tu fan just likes to degrade A&M as a little brother, and little brother did something to trump them, and they don't like it. It is as simple as that. The academics argument is just unfamiliarity. Honestly, the average Big XII fan probably couldn't tell you all the teams in the SEC. It just isn't a part of the discussion for folks, and unfamiliarity breeds ignorance.
Posted on 2/13/12 at 9:24 pm to TeLeFaWx
quote:
Honestly, the average Big XII fan probably couldn't tell you all the teams in the SEC
The average Big XII fan couldn't tell you all of the teams in the Big XII back when it actually had 12 teams.
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