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reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
And with the loss to Ole Miss today, Beiser has clearly put the team on the cutting block. They'll need some help at this point. Some bubble teams to lose early in their respective tournaments. I haven't taken a look to see what others have done.

I can't put my finger on it, but there is a disturbing trend of Beiser's teams just flopping at the end of each season.

I couldn't disagree more about having started Ash. Do what got you there. Would have been different if they had a spot wrapped up. They didn't. So do what got you there. What kind of message does that send to the rest of the team? Maybe that the UF series wasn't that important. Or that UF wasn't that good. Regardless, that game 1 is completely different if Cantlebury starts and gives you those 5 scoreless innings to start the game. Who knows how many more innings he could have given you. Even after that, you're not going to leave a reliever in to give up run after run. They would have had the luxury of bringing someone in quicker than if you're trying to stretch out the starter.


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Cantleberry had allowed 23 earned runs in his previous six appearances. I still don't have a problem with changing it up on Friday night. Hindsight is what it is but there was nothing guaranteed with a Cantleberry start against what is still a very good offensive Florida line up. Scoring 7 total runs vs that pitching staff was the real issue IMO.
This post was edited on 5/21 at 11:17 pm


reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Ahhhhh went back just far enough to include the LSU start that was admittedly bad. We will agree to disagree. And it's not hindsight. Beiser started a pitcher who had 1 start before that instead of a guy who would have the same number of starts as Sikemma had he started the UF game.

7 runs is a huge issue and I am dumbfounded on why Beiser's teams just sputter out at the end of each season. There were definitely some headscratching decisions but it's not like I imagine their plate approach changes.

Oh well. Out of our hands. Hopefully it's enough to impress the selection committee.


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
quote:

Ahhhhh went back just far enough to include the LSU start that was admittedly bad


He allowed 15 earned runs in 18 and 2/3s innings of work after getting his dick stomped by LSU. That isn't admittedly bad?
This post was edited on 5/23 at 2:59 pm


reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
3 earned runs in 5.1 against a top 10 UGA isn't a bad outing.

2 earned runs in 6 innings against a down SC is ok.

2 earned runs in 3.2 innings against a top 25 UT is meh but doesn't justify starting a non starter.

Then brought him back against UT in relief and he gave up 3 after getting 2 outs, which is not good at all but is that his fault or Beiser?

5 runs in 3 innings against the number one of the best offenses in the nation isn't very good but not as bad as the LSU start. This is the only poor start out of the bunch.

Gave up 0 earned runs in 4 innings against UF which is outstanding.

I think you're going to extremes to defend Beiser when it's not needed. Beiser is solid but still has some learning to do himself. Either he shite the bed by starting Ash or he shite the bed by only starting Ash once before the UF game.


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
quote:

3 earned runs in 5.1 against a top 10 UGA isn't a bad outing.

2 earned runs in 6 innings against a down SC is ok.

2 earned runs in 3.2 innings against a top 25 UT is meh but doesn't justify starting a non starter.

Then brought him back against UT in relief and he gave up 3 after getting 2 outs, which is not good at all but is that his fault or Beiser?

5 runs in 3 innings against the number one of the best offenses in the nation isn't very good but not as bad as the LSU start. This is the only poor start out of the bunch.


That's a 7.45 ERA over those appearances. His WHIP was almost 2. Ash had a 4.26 ERA in his last 5 conference appearances entering the UF start with a WHIP of 1.1. He was also coming off 5 innings of 3 hit shutout ball vs Vandy.

Beiser went with the same strategy with Ash vs OM in the SECT and he handed a 4 inning shutout over to Cantleberry, who promptly gave up the lead.

quote:

I think you're going to extremes to defend Beiser when it's not needed.
Pointing out that Beiser went with what was clearly the hotter hand down the stretch on a Friday night start isn't going to extremes.
This post was edited on 5/24 at 8:06 am


reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
You and Beiser would pull Flaherty or Mikolas in the last series of the season when you need to win the series and you'd start Gant. No worries. Gant isn't bad. But if he was a better option or a "hotter hand" as you say, he would have started more than one game all season.

We can keep throwing number out all day long

The numbers that prove it was the wrong decision:
Cantlebury 0.00 ERA, 0 hits, 8 K's
Ash 9.00 ERA, 7 hits and 4 K's

Did Ash have a hotter hand? He had a EXCELLENT game against Vandy but in the 2 games before that he had an ERA of like 16.87.

Stat geeks can turn numbers anyway they want. You don't know that Ash wouldn't have had a 21.00 ERA if he started those games that Cantlebury started. At the end of the day, one was the Friday night starter all season and the other just had to do spot duties (and did a pretty solid job all season at it more times than not).

Go ahead and spin more numbers. I'll just leave it at I disagree.

On another note...a couple of sources have Mizzou in and a couple have us out. That is better than just a day ago.


reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
I'd be curious to know your thoughts on not starting Sikemma against OM. You're in a situation where you have to know you need at least 1 win to get to the NCAA tourney and avoid the bubble but you don't start your best pitcher who is one of the top amateur players in the nation. Mizzou wasn't going to win the SECT so what is the thought process of not giving yourself the best shot at getting that 1 win?


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20
navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
quote:

You and Beiser would pull Flaherty or Mikolas in the last series of the season


Lol. This is asinine, but I'll play along. If either had an ERA over 7 and BAA over .350 for the previous month of appearances, you wouldn't consider it?

quote:

At the end of the day, one was the Friday night starter all season


Cantleberry wasn't a true Friday night SEC starter. He was a sacrificial anode that went 2-4 in conference play.
The play was to win with the #1 and #2 vs the opposing- #2 and #3 starters on Saturdays and Sundays. You were questioning that move at the beginning of the season. That's what "got them there". Not going 2-10 on Friday night.

quote:

Stat geeks can turn numbers anyway they want.


I accept your surrender.

quote:

I'd be curious to know your thoughts on not starting Sikemma against OM


On 3 days rest after 113 pitches? No, I don't start TJ.
This post was edited on 5/25 at 9:09 am


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Instead of just being Reedus's biggest fan, why don't you join the discussion, Sandy?


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reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
I agree with you that we sacrificed Friday nights. But if Ash gave us a better chance to win by starting then Beiser was a fool for not starting him all year.

As for surrender, if you think that's what this is all about, well then congrats I guess?

If you're going to change the rotation the last weekend of the season, he should have started TJ on Thursday and game 1 of the SECt. That would have given you your best chance to insure at least 1 win.

Now I surrender. We can just go on forever because you think one way and I think another and I ain't changing your mind and you're not changing mine.

In other good news...more and more are predicting Mizzou in the tourney.


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
quote:

Beiser was a fool for not starting him all year.


Stop moving the goalposts. This discussion was about a late season role change based on Cantleberry's performance over the last month of the season.

quote:

As for surrender, if you think that's what this is all about, well then congrats I guess?


Calling someone a stat geek because you choose to be obtuse to a lack of performance is surrending.

quote:

he should have started TJ on Thursday and game 1 of the SECt

You would have bitched about that for not "doing what got them there" because of your incredible hindsight.
This post was edited on 5/27 at 6:44 am


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Why don't you join the conversation instead of just down voting posts, Sandy? Please, underwhelm us with your lack of knowledge.


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Silent bats keep them out of the post season.


the808bass
Louisville Fan
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
62619 posts
 Online 

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Looked better for a lot of the season.
Mizzoued it.


navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Alabama was the only team picked to finish beneath them in the SEC by the coaches pre season. It was a solid year but they wasted a great body of work by the pitching staff.

The staff finished the year ranked(nationally) 7th in ERA, 8th in hits allowed/9, 16th in Ks/9, and 25th in WHIP.

Scoring 7 total runs on a Florida squad that allowed over 6 a game in SEC play was a deal breaker.
This post was edited on 5/27 at 2:20 pm


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21
reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
quote:

Silent bats keep them out of the post season.



That is such an oversimplification. Yes, for supposedly being a hitting guru, it's frustrating to see the bats go dead. But the bats were hardly the only thing that prevented them from going.


reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
I know most don't follow the baseball team but I really have a hard time putting my finger on the Bieser hire. The strengths of his teams have been pitching. Most of the top pitching he's had the last 3 years he inherited. The team has done some things that make you think he's heading in the right direction. But then there are so many things that make you scratch your head and wonder.

It will be interesting to see the progression of Bieser and Mizzou and Vitello in Tennessee. Like it or not, there will always be comparisons drawn. Tennessee in the tourney as a 2 seed this year. Beat #15 Ole Miss 2 of 3 in the last weekend. He didn't think he was smarter than the game and threw his best starter in the first game and set the tone. His team didn't implode and scored 18 runs in those 3 games.


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20
navynuke
Missouri Fan
Member since Jun 2016
3982 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Lol. They lost 3 of the last 4 by one run and lost the fourth in a 2-0 shutout. After taking a 1-0 lead vs OM they got the lead off batter on base 4 times and never got him past 2nd. 8 total runs scored and 24 left on base. Clearly the fault of the pitching staff.

This post was edited on 5/28 at 11:26 am


reedus23
St. Louis
Member since Sep 2011
24815 posts

re: MU baseball enters the Top 25
Not the pitching staff simpleton. Bieser's management of the staff.

I could probably list off 10 things that led to them not making the tourney and yes, before you get your panties in a wad, the offense is on that list.

1. Disappearing bats. And this has been a repetitive problem under Bieser who is supposedly a hitting guru

2. Scheduling a weak as frick noncon schedule. Yes, that is on Bieser as well.

3. 3rd grade level defense on occasions. Misner dropping a routine flyball at first base late in a game when we had the lead comes to mind.

4. Passed balls. I like his bat, but McDaniel's technique behind the plate is horrible and contributed to 2 or 3 losses alone.

5. Bieser's in game calls. Whether it's when to run, when to bunt, when to hit and run.

6. Bieser's managment of the pitching staff at times is perplexing. Not throwing TJ in game 1 against UF and in the SECt is just one example. He's left guys in that should have been pulled and pulled guys when they were sailing.

7. Losing LaPlante. Glad this isn't in any kind of order otherwise this would be higher up the list. He was likely our #2 in the rotation. The staff itself was a plus on the team, but losing him was huge.

8. I lied and came up with 7 reasons that led to not making the tourney. You can feel free to take a simplistic view and blame the bats and you wouldn't be wrong, you would simply be ignoring all of the other things that have led to Mizzou not making the tourney in any of Bieser's first 3 years at Mizzou.
This post was edited on 5/28 at 7:44 pm


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