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re: Buccees Mascot Coaching Edition (Former Jet Tracking)
Posted on 10/20/22 at 9:51 am to Poker Dough
Posted on 10/20/22 at 9:51 am to Poker Dough
quote:
I don't need my football coach to be my moral compass. But frick Freeze just because he doesn't win shite.
Do you want to actually use some facts to back that claim? It's factually nonsense:
1) Three straight jobs wherein he took over losing (or .500) programs and immediately posted winning seasons in year #1. At Liberty he took over a program that had only just been made an FBS school the year prior to Freeze taking over.
2) Took an Ole Miss team that had won 2 games the season before he was hired and 4 games the season before that (ie: 6 combined wins in the two seasons prior to his arrival) to a 28-point Sugar Bowl dismantling of a 10-win Oklahoma State team within his fourth year on the job. This was the first time that Ole Miss had appeared in the Sugar Bowl since 1970.
3) Led Ole Miss to their highest National ranking in 50 years in back to back seasons (#3 in both 2014 and 2015).
4) Is 6-2 in Bowl games overall (3-1 at Ole Miss with one win vacated, 3-0 at Liberty).
5) Is currently 6-1 with a 1-point loss to a Top 15 ranked Wake Forest team...while playing his third string quarterback for most of the season. Their starter broke his hand on like the first drive of their season and hasn't played since. I don't think people understand how difficult this is.
The rebuttals that people try to paint against Hugh Freeze's actual coaching accomplishments border on the absurd. It's a consistent history of taking over slop, and immediately turning it into a highly competitive program. At all three of his stops he has done this at NON-ELITE football programs. He hasn't been doing this at schools wherein anyone can just come in and start winning (ie: these programs are normally cellar-dwellers).
What do you actually have to say to support your opposing claim? If you're going to say something dumb like "yeah well he cheated and Ole Miss still didn't beat Alabama during their peak of dominance for the SEC Title!" then you're going to have to come up with something smarter than that.
2
Posted on 10/20/22 at 9:52 am to jvilletiger25
It's Corch Irvin Mayas. Go Gata
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:03 am to metafour
If he is an outstanding coach, why hasn't any other program kicked the tires on him?
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:04 am to metafour
We fired Gus who has done everything Freeze did, and more. Without a cheating scandal...going public
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:05 am to CorchJay
And furthermore re: Freeze:
I hold zero interest in whether or not he is hired (he's not my first or second choice), and I have zero problems if anyone wants to say "I don't like his off-field issues and I'm worried that he'd do something stupid and get us in trouble". That is a reasonable take and is perfectly acceptable.
What isn't really acceptable is discounting his actual on-field football accomplishments with no logical explanation or actual reasonable backing. To say "he doesn't win shite" about a coach who literally ONLY WINS WHEREVER HE GOES is beyond madness.
By the way, removing all of his vacated wins and then going "see? look at his record, he sucks!" is an insincere argument. They still won those games. The fact that they were vacated doesn't magically remove them from his coaching capability. Anyone with a brain knows that you could easily vacate the same number of wins from Saban, Meyer, Smart, or any of these other elite coaches who commit the same crimes and have committed the same crimes. The only difference is that the NCAA didn't have the balls to investigate because they make a lot of people a lot of money.
Using the NCAA as some sort of "fair arbiter" to try to paint Freeze as a bad coach is really really dumb.
I hold zero interest in whether or not he is hired (he's not my first or second choice), and I have zero problems if anyone wants to say "I don't like his off-field issues and I'm worried that he'd do something stupid and get us in trouble". That is a reasonable take and is perfectly acceptable.
What isn't really acceptable is discounting his actual on-field football accomplishments with no logical explanation or actual reasonable backing. To say "he doesn't win shite" about a coach who literally ONLY WINS WHEREVER HE GOES is beyond madness.
By the way, removing all of his vacated wins and then going "see? look at his record, he sucks!" is an insincere argument. They still won those games. The fact that they were vacated doesn't magically remove them from his coaching capability. Anyone with a brain knows that you could easily vacate the same number of wins from Saban, Meyer, Smart, or any of these other elite coaches who commit the same crimes and have committed the same crimes. The only difference is that the NCAA didn't have the balls to investigate because they make a lot of people a lot of money.
Using the NCAA as some sort of "fair arbiter" to try to paint Freeze as a bad coach is really really dumb.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:11 am to Poker Dough
quote:
We fired Gus who has done everything Freeze did, and more. Without a cheating scandal...going public
Auburn is 10x the football program that Ole Miss is. How dumb are you, seriously? Gene fricking Chizik won a National Title here. Do you understand that?
Auburn has played or should have played for a National Title in every decade at least once going back to the 1980's. When in the last time that Ole Miss was a threat to play for a National Title? THAT IS A BOTTOM DWEELLER SEC PROGRAM. HELLO!
How is this a point that is not easily understandable? The records at these two schools are not 1:1!
Use your head, man. Why is it that we are even able to discuss poaching Lane Kiffin from Ole Miss today even though his team is ranked in the Top 10? Has there ever been a time in history when the opposite discussion could be had (ie: Ole Miss poaching an Auburn coach)? During Malzahn's peak years at Auburn, do you think Ole Miss could interest him in coming there instead if they hypothetically had an opening?
You are either very low on football knowledge or you are being wilfully ignorant. There is no other expalnation.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:13 am to metafour
To ignore it for the sake of your argument is unreasonable. What conference titles has he won, anywhere?
To assume he did this well at one place means he will do better elsewhere is baseless.
I generally agree with almost everything you say on here and respect your opinions, including this one even though I don't agree with it. Agree to disagree?
As far as Chizik goes, look how things were without Cam. Having the most unstoppable college football player anyone has ever seen, and the best freshman RB we've ever had made his job easier.
To assume he did this well at one place means he will do better elsewhere is baseless.
I generally agree with almost everything you say on here and respect your opinions, including this one even though I don't agree with it. Agree to disagree?
As far as Chizik goes, look how things were without Cam. Having the most unstoppable college football player anyone has ever seen, and the best freshman RB we've ever had made his job easier.
This post was edited on 10/20/22 at 10:18 am
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:17 am to Poker Dough
quote:
If he is an outstanding coach, why hasn't any other program kicked the tires on him?
Outside of top 15 schools, I would imagine any kind of buy out he has a Liberty would matter, obviously, in combination with his other issues.
As far as top 15, any person would say the Venables hire and Kelly hire made more sense. I guess you could debate about Oregon.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:23 am to Poker Dough
quote:
To assume he did this well at one place means he will do better elsewhere is baseless.
He did it in the same exact DIVISION within the same exact CONFERENCE at a school that is located one-State over from us. All the while at a school that is historically nowhere near us in terms of resources or capabilities. He has already proven that he can compete with and be a thorn in the rear to Darth Vader sitting across our state from us (ie: our chief rival). By the way, he also already has the backing of the #1 most wealthy Auburn booster (Freeze is Jimmy Rane's guy). Freeze already knows the Auburn power structure and he's a natural schmoozer - this is important at Auburn and shouldn't be taken lightly.
So while obviously there is no such thing as a "guaranteed result"; Freeze has about everything you want in terms of proven capability for Auburn. The question with him is more or less just if he can do it without doing something dumb off the field. This is a reasonable question and I've already alluded to that.
Out of any possible candidates, he is actually the guy that would probably offer the most-likely immediate turnaround for this program - for those reasons I just listed above. People who know coaching and the SEC KNOW that Freeze would very likely win big at Auburn.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:25 am to metafour
I would be interested to hear who you're top candidates are and why. Not to be a dick either, but because you might could end up convincing me Freeze is ok if he got hired, so I'm curious as to who you feel is better after your strong testimony on Freeze haha.
I've always wondered why, if Rane has always wanted Freeze, why not hire him 2 years ago? Why all the Steele nonsense?
I've always wondered why, if Rane has always wanted Freeze, why not hire him 2 years ago? Why all the Steele nonsense?
This post was edited on 10/20/22 at 10:29 am
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:40 am to Pettifogger
quote:I read that as Corch saying that the perception on this board would be anyone other than those two would be bad hires.quote:Surprised to hear that coming from you
But I still stand by what I said anyone named coach other then Prime or Lane will be considered bad hires.
Pretty sure Corch's list is a little longer than just those two names.
BTW, my best AU buddy, who is not a message board guy, texted me an al.com article supporting Harsin getting another year. I asked him if finishing 4-8 this year and in the bottom half of the SEC in recruiting on ESD would would justify Harsin's dismissal, and he said "Absolutely, that would mean the program has totally collapsed."
So even amongst the 'patient' fans, there is a tipping point. Many of us here have already passed it, but I think there will be a groundswell of support for a new HC barring a miraculous turnaround.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:42 am to Poker Dough
quote:
I would be interested to hear who you're top candidates are and why.
I too, interested. But I have a twist: metafour DOESNT GET TO USE HIS CAPS LOCK to make his argument.
Some say it can’t be done.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:44 am to Poker Dough
Preferable indeed
Posted on 10/20/22 at 10:52 am to kung fu kenny
It isn’t your place to judge, do you claim to know the man’s heart? That’s up to God and God alone.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 11:03 am to Luke
Posted on 10/20/22 at 11:03 am to Luke
quote:This is true.
It isn’t your place to judge, do you claim to know the man’s heart? That’s up to God and God alone.
But it isn't up to God and God alone whom we hire to be the next head coach at Auburn. We have to look at the facts and make our best guess as to his worthiness.
As metafour has argued so passionately, Freezus has had some success every where he's coached, and could be successful at AU. However, he has also shown egregious examples of extraordinarily bad judgement every where he's coached, and could just as easily do something similar at AU if hired.
In my opinion, the potential for future success is greatly outweighed by the likelihood of continued poor decision making, both personally and professionally. Freezus will always be a non-starter for me.
Posted on 10/20/22 at 11:05 am to Poker Dough
quote:Big difference in why both those guys got fired. One was for shite off the field, the other was for shite on the field.
We fired Gus who has done everything Freeze did, and more. Without a cheating scandal...going public
Posted on 10/20/22 at 11:05 am to pdfield34
quote:
I guess you could debate about Oregon.
Would you though? The Lanning hire is looking like it might pan out (so far).
Other than the 49-3 dismembering by UGA, Lanning has his work cut out for him
Posted on 10/20/22 at 11:07 am to greygoose
We also waited way to long to do it compared to Ole Miss
Posted on 10/20/22 at 11:19 am to Poker Dough
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