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re: OT: Alabama Coronavirus Thread (see link in OP for case numbers and death totals in AL)
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:06 pm to VirgilCaine
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:06 pm to VirgilCaine
quote:
Could it be that many rational and reasonable adults are looking around, assessing their own risk level, and proceeding accordingly?
It could. It could also be a lot of irrational and unreasonable people are looking around and saying frick it, I'll do what I want, and frick you if you question it.
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Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:10 pm to The Spleen
I stay 6 feet away from people, so I’m doing what I want. I don’t go out to eat, I don’t go to concerts. I go to the grocery store or lumber yard and that’s about it. Nothing has changed for me. I just feel awful for the people who are losing everything. It should be up to them whether they are open or not.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:10 pm to Cobrasize
quote:
Universal healthcare is garbage.
So is profit driven healthcare. At least universal provides health coverage when events out of one's control causes them to lose their job.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:11 pm to The Spleen
If you are dependent on government, you are controlled by the government. That is socialism/communism in politically correct verbiage.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:12 pm to The Spleen
Plenty of us don’t want the government to control our lives
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:12 pm to phil4bama
quote:
If you are dependent on government, you are controlled by the government.
I'll be sure to tell all the seniors on Medicare and drawing social security that.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:14 pm to Cobrasize
quote:
Plenty of us don’t want the government to control our lives
I know. Plenty of us also don't want greedy health insurance companies controlling our lives, but we all can't get what we want.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:15 pm to Cobrasize
quote:
Plenty of us don’t want the government to control our lives
Exactly which aspect of your life is the government controlling under a single payer system of healthcare insurance?
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:15 pm to The Spleen
So your healthcare provider is controlling your life? 
Might need to get a new provider
Might need to get a new providerPosted on 5/14/20 at 2:16 pm to The Spleen
quote:
So is profit driven healthcare. At least universal provides health coverage when events out of one's control causes them to lose their job.
I agree with you about 80% on for profit healthcare and I'm in the industry. The major problem with for profit healthcare is that it's not for the profit of the practitioner (for the most part). It's for the profit of the mega-corporate oligopolies we have created: big pharma, CVS/Walgreens, PBM's, the handful of insurance giants like AETNA, the handful of hospital corporations, etc. They are the entities that have made the dollar more important than patient care.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:18 pm to Robot Santa
quote:
Exactly which aspect of your life is the government controlling under a single payer system of healthcare insurance?
They’ll control when or what procedures you can have. You’ll have long lines for everything. There’s a reason people come to the U.S to get things done.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:20 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I'll be sure to tell all the seniors on Medicare and drawing social security that.
Yeah I wouldn't call Medicare or SS "socialism". The gov has not taken control of the means of production. They're poorly run pensions that taxpayers have paid into during their careers.
Certainly you (Spleen) can understand the skepticism many have with the idea of paying into a system that disproportionately favors those who have not paid into it as much? Call it a "social safety net" or call it the nanny state, I think many Americans bristle against this concept if they are employed full time and don't draw on the benefit. Not to mention the macro societal/psychological structures it builds - our nation, for better or worse, is built on self determination and risk taking. What happens if we dull that blade?
That being said, I could be convinced on Yang's "Freedom Dividend" concept. I'd need to see a balanced federal government budget beforehand
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:20 pm to Cobrasize
quote:
An infectious disease expert who spent his life studying deadly viruses, including Ebola, thinks he caught coronavirus via his eyes.
Dr. Joseph Fair believes he contracted the virus on a plane to New Orleans where he took all the precautions but passengers were 'packed in like sardines'.
LINK
Guess now we need to wear masks and goggles
This post was edited on 5/14/20 at 2:24 pm
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:21 pm to phil4bama
Spleen, what else do you call it? If you are dependent on someone/something for your subsistence and your healthcare, you are by definition, controlled by them. I'm not arguing against Medicare and SS per say, but just because it is socially responsible doesn't change the fact that you are indentured to them.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:23 pm to The Spleen
quote:
It could. It could also be a lot of irrational and unreasonable people are looking around and saying frick it, I'll do what I want, and frick you if you question it.
I guess we shall see which side had the right of it then. Once the momentum starts for reopening (already begun), it's going to grow until everything is wide open.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:26 pm to VirgilCaine
quote:
Certainly you (Spleen) can understand the skepticism many have with the idea of paying into a system that disproportionately favors those who have not paid into it as much?
Not really. I live a comfortable life that I'm very grateful for. I don't really care that someone less fortunate may get more benefits than I might. It's not worth my time or energy to concern myself with that. It comes across as trying to prevent the less fortunate from enjoying the same privilege I have, and I think everyone should be able to enjoy that.
That's not saying I think the government should provide that for everyone. I've been down on my luck in life and needed a helping hand up. I was fortunate to have parents with enough wealth to provide that helping hand. Not everyone has that, so what's the harm in the government providing it? Doesn't affect me in the least.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:31 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I've been down on my luck in life and needed a helping hand up. I was fortunate to have parents with enough wealth to provide that helping hand
Plenty of us are successful and didn’t depend on anyone to give us help. We worked our asses off and did it on our own. The opportunity to be successful is out there for everyone, it just depends on how much you are willing to put in.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:36 pm to Cobrasize
quote:
Plenty of us are successful and didn’t depend on anyone to give us help. We worked our asses off and did it on our own. The opportunity to be successful is out there for everyone, it just depends on how much you are willing to put in.
Not sure what that has to do with my post, but congrats I guess.
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:42 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I've been down on my luck in life and needed a helping hand up
This is something I think everyone should spend time processing. You are not a complete construction of your own will and effort. There are more variables than that, and one of those is that others had to help you along the way.
I'll just have to respectfully disagree with the remainder of your post. I was fortunate to have caring parents with some level of affluence, but they cut myself, and my siblings off completely when we left the house. It created a lot of wailing/gnashing of teeth, however the preparation for life outside of their home was invaluable. I think there are times when the most loving thing we can do is ask people to walk the hard road (which they may have brought onto themselves) and learn some very tough lessons.
This could lead into a larger conversation about the role of government vs the role of other social institutions in the day-to-day operations of our communities, but that may derail this thread even further.
Again -
Posted on 5/14/20 at 2:42 pm to The Spleen
You made it seem like the only way to be successful was to get help or handouts. That’s just not true.
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