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re: Aggy Board OT Discussion Thread
Posted on 8/21/15 at 4:59 pm to AgBQ00
Posted on 8/21/15 at 4:59 pm to AgBQ00
Tell you one thing, when I was on active duty in the Army, playing dumb wouldn't fly as a defense. They would get you for dereliction of duty if you didn't do what you should have in carrying out your assigned tasks
Maintaining plausible deniability may work for a football coach or a politician. But man, good luck selling that at a court martial.
Maintaining plausible deniability may work for a football coach or a politician. But man, good luck selling that at a court martial.
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Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:03 pm to PikeBishop
Baylor almost has to fire him to keep their squeaky clean bible school image. We all know they aren't pure as the driven snow but they can't let public perception be bad or it negates any value of a degree from there.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:31 pm to Agforlife
Bait - you may think we as Ags have an axe to grind so we're hammering you. Here's a national article from this afternoon - Yahoo! Sports by Pat Forde
The summation
The summation
quote:
On the eve of a promising season, this mess could cost Art Briles his job. The timing isn't good, but neither is Briles' handling of the affair. Removing him is something the school should consider, if it truly cares about an athletic reputation that still bears stains from earlier this century.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:43 pm to tmc94
I think a lot fewer questions have been answered than appears. But you're right it may just be my Baylor goggles.
critically analyzing the specific language of Petersen's release makes me curious, I've read some things saying that Ukwuachu's violent stuff and threatening/abusive behavior towards his then GF was not part of the official record at either Boise St, or the police, so Petersen could have told Briles about the incident officially part of his dismissal - his punching of a window and bloodying his hand, and not have told Briles Boise was concerned he was a danger to other human beings. Which, given what people believe Petersen has said, would be pretty shitty of him. I tend to wonder how clearly either of these guys really remember a 3 year old phone conversation.
To me, the group that most dropped the ball is Baylor judicial like I said early. They cleared a guy on a lower burden of proof, I've had personal experience with Baylor judicial, They were tools. but they were overzealous against me. It's ridiculous to me that their process would exonerate Ukwuachu. It's easy to point to this and say that Briles and co were pressuring, but thats just speculation. I don't think Briles or the DC's comments at media days were anything more than ignorant coachspeak.
critically analyzing the specific language of Petersen's release makes me curious, I've read some things saying that Ukwuachu's violent stuff and threatening/abusive behavior towards his then GF was not part of the official record at either Boise St, or the police, so Petersen could have told Briles about the incident officially part of his dismissal - his punching of a window and bloodying his hand, and not have told Briles Boise was concerned he was a danger to other human beings. Which, given what people believe Petersen has said, would be pretty shitty of him. I tend to wonder how clearly either of these guys really remember a 3 year old phone conversation.
To me, the group that most dropped the ball is Baylor judicial like I said early. They cleared a guy on a lower burden of proof, I've had personal experience with Baylor judicial, They were tools. but they were overzealous against me. It's ridiculous to me that their process would exonerate Ukwuachu. It's easy to point to this and say that Briles and co were pressuring, but thats just speculation. I don't think Briles or the DC's comments at media days were anything more than ignorant coachspeak.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:45 pm to BearBait09
quote:
BearBait09
This guy is sitting next to me at work pounding away on his keyboard.... its quite funny to watch. He saw my similar reaction when all the Manziel stuff surfaced and we were on a job together in 13' I was a little worried at first, I feel bad... this news has ruined his day.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:46 pm to BearBait09
quote:
so Petersen could have told Briles about the incident officially part of his dismissal - his punching of a window and bloodying his hand, and not have told Briles Boise was concerned he was a danger to other human beings
Why would Peterson go out of his way to contract Briles only to tell half the story? If he went out his way to contact him that means he did think the situation was serious.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:49 pm to cardboardboxer
probably because I'm grasping at straws. I just find the technically ambiguous nature of Petersen's release to be questionable.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:56 pm to cardboardboxer
I just heard on the radio that his sentence was handed down and he only has to serve 180 days in jail and something like ten years probation. The jury recommended 8 years behind bars. 
The legal system is a damn joke.
The legal system is a damn joke.
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 6:48 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 5:59 pm to BearBait09
definitely not saying Briles was pressuring necessarily. If it comes to light he did, he's gone no question.
But coaches have responsibilities beyond coaching football. These are student-athletes, not just athletes. When one of your players is charged with a very serious crime, it's your duty to investigate fully.
Put yourself in Briles' shoes. Can you even imagine not making further calls to Boise at this point? Can you imagine not asking the investigators what info was there? Can you imagine not asking the DA questions when the indictment came down? How can you, as a human being, possibly allow yourself to remain ignorant?
And I object to your use of "drop the ball." Drop the ball suggests shite happens but no big deal. It's akin to saying Enron dropped the ball on GAAP. You are belittling a very serious thing. The Baylor Title IX investigation was abhorrent and neglligible
release from Ken Starr
But coaches have responsibilities beyond coaching football. These are student-athletes, not just athletes. When one of your players is charged with a very serious crime, it's your duty to investigate fully.
Put yourself in Briles' shoes. Can you even imagine not making further calls to Boise at this point? Can you imagine not asking the investigators what info was there? Can you imagine not asking the DA questions when the indictment came down? How can you, as a human being, possibly allow yourself to remain ignorant?
And I object to your use of "drop the ball." Drop the ball suggests shite happens but no big deal. It's akin to saying Enron dropped the ball on GAAP. You are belittling a very serious thing. The Baylor Title IX investigation was abhorrent and neglligible
release from Ken Starr
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:02 pm to BearBait09
Did the judge just give this guy only 180 days in jail? For rape...that's it? Wow!
Like punching a surly bartender. Makes it look like rape doesn't seem to be much of a crime in Waco.
Like punching a surly bartender. Makes it look like rape doesn't seem to be much of a crime in Waco.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:16 pm to tmc94
Briles' official statement. Basically he just fired back and called Chris Petersen a liar. If this proves to be false, I have no doubt Briles will be shitcanned.
The last paragraph those has me wondering because that's directly refuted by news articles in May of 2013. Ukauachu was publicly booted from the Boise program LINK. I guess he means academically eligible
The last paragraph those has me wondering because that's directly refuted by news articles in May of 2013. Ukauachu was publicly booted from the Boise program LINK. I guess he means academically eligible
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:16 pm to Felonious Punk
quote:
just heard on the radio that his sentence was handed down and he only has to serve 180 days in jail and something like seven years probation. The jury recommended 8 years behind bars.
Just heard the same on the radio on my way home from work.
I am livid right now.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:17 pm to PikeBishop
It's truly despicable. My heart goes out to the former Baylor soccer player and her family. I'm sure this wasn't the justice they had in mind.
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 6:23 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:17 pm to tmc94
quote:
Put yourself in Briles' shoes. Can you even imagine not making further calls to Boise at this point?
You mean when Ukwuachu was accused of rape at Baylor?
We don't actually know if Briles was informed of the nature of the disciplinary action against Ukwuachu. I'm assuming he was, DI coach, you'd think he would find out, but Baylor is abnormally good at restricting information. Legally, it isn't appropriate for the coach to know why a student is in disciplinary review.
As dumb as this can sound, Ukwuachu is a defensive player, and probably has no actual interaction with Briles. Briles is all offense.
But if Briles truly wasn't aware of Ukwuachu's violence towards his girlfriend, and I'm starting to wonder if either Petersen or Briles was, why would he draw the conclusion he should re-review the player's time at Boise? The connection is obvious knowing everything, but in the moment, you don't know where you are blind. I'm still drawing back to the judicial review's exoneration of Ukwuachu. Why would Briles personally pursue more information if Baylor's body had cleared him. A criminal trial should never reach a guilty verdict on a case that was passed the lower burden of proof used by college judicial, unless, as happened here, the college judicial was grossly incompetent.
It looks so bad right now for everyone, Briles could be toast, but I would be shocked if the firings don't include a lot of people in Baylor's judicial department.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:18 pm to PikeBishop
quote:
Makes it look like rape doesn't seem to be much of a crime in Waco.
Waco is fricked up all around when it comes to the judicial system.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:18 pm to tmc94
Of course Briles knew the details. How could he NOT? Yeah, I'm biased against him, but none of his carefully selected words have the ring of truth to them.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:28 pm to TbirdSpur2010
The only way this works out for Briles and Petersen is if Petersen was never informed of the violence Ukwuachu did against his GF, which would mean Boise didn't tell him.
Can you imagine if Briles and Petersen both get free by blaming Boise? I mean this whole story sucks too much to laugh about, but...
Can you imagine if Briles and Petersen both get free by blaming Boise? I mean this whole story sucks too much to laugh about, but...
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:29 pm to BearBait09
quote:
You mean when Ukwuachu was accused of rape at Baylor?
yes, exactly
quote:
Legally, it isn't appropriate for the coach to know why a student is in disciplinary review.
Not really buying this but I'll allow it because it's fairly irrelevant. It only changes the timeline
quote:
But if Briles truly wasn't aware of Ukwuachu's violence towards his girlfriend, and I'm starting to wonder if either Petersen or Briles was, why would he draw the conclusion he should re-review the player's time at Boise?
When a player is indicted for rape, you wouldn't reach out to the previous school to get every ounce of detail you could? Seriously?
quote:
I'm still drawing back to the judicial review's exoneration of Ukwuachu.
We're past that. Fast forward to June 2014. The DA's office has now indicted your player. That's over a year ago. You'd just sit around waiting for the legal process to conclude?
I'd have called Petersen the first sniff I had of this. I'd tell him what happened and ask if there was anything relevant he might know. What was the real reason he was booted?
I'd call his high school coach again. I'd call his parents. I'd call other players on the team I trusted. I'd do every damn thing I could to make sure that I wasn't enabling a goddamn rapist.
Briles is under no obligation to renew his scholarship. Yet Briles chose to do so after his player was indicted for rape while doing zero to find out anything about it. How can that not shock and sadden you?
quote:
I would be shocked if the firings don't include a lot of people in Baylor's judicial department.
I think anyone in the Title IX department is absolutely toast. The legal group might as well pack their shite up tonight
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:34 pm to tmc94
The moral of the story in all of this Don't be a female student at Baylor and get involved with a football player. The system will let you down if it ever comes to something like that. Also don't ride a motorcycle in Waco because the pd is trigger happy and will head shot you if you get in a fisticuff
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 6:36 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 6:43 pm to AgBQ00
quote:
AgBQ00
You forgot don't be a religious zealot or Waco will let the Feds burn you up.
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