re: Just how bad was Jim McElwain's recruiting at Florida?

quote:

---

Difference is he did it without all of the upperclassman help to lean on because there was none

---

And that's why he left. He didn't feel appreciated at all and it started to show on the trails. Really bad.

But the millionaires can buy another coach and a here we go again......



Mullen isn't going to do better than Mcelwain with his current defensive coordinator, so we just have to wait until he's the excuse. You're on post now brother!

quote:

---

And that's why he left. He didn't feel appreciated at all and it started to show on the trails. Really bad.

---

Gators faithful don't want to admit it, but a lot of this is on us. McElwain was a goober, but he had early success when we've been awful since 2013. They wanted him to fix a four year problem in less than 2 and we ended up running off a decent coach.

That being said, he can't just mail it in, either. The hate he got for that was excusable. But winning ten years a season when we were averaging 5 before he got there is at the very least somewhat impressive.

quote:

---

Mullen isn't going to do better than Mcelwain with his current defensive coordinator, so we just have to wait until he's the excuse. You're on post now brother!

---

I have no idea right now what kind of product we're going to get. I can only be excited that Mullen looks like he wants to be here and actually goes after recruits. Whether or not he wll be sucessful is to be seen.

quote:

---

StrawsDrawnAtRandom

---

We'll see for sure. It's a game after all. Keep em straight over there and try to keep Grantham from throwing NFL schemes on those kids, and let them play. God knows y'all can frick up and haul top five classes.

quote:

---

We'll see for sure. It's a game after all. Keep em straight over there and try to keep Grantham from throwing NFL schemes on those kids, and let them play. God knows y'all can frick up and haul top five classes.

---

I just hope we can compete for the East again. Which, by my calculations shouldn't be very hard in the next few years outside of Georgia.

quote:

---

While Muschamp has moved on well from his time at Florida and the Gators are eager to move on from his successor, it only seems apropos this week to compare the short and shorter tenures of Muschamp and McElwain in Gainesville.

They were eerily similar.

Both had some degree of early success that was couched by concerns about the quarterback. After a 7-6 debut, Muschamp led Florida to an 11-2 finish and Sugar Bowl appearance in his second season, but fans wondered if Jeff Driskel could take his game to the next level. McElwain led Florida to back-to-back SEC East titles to start his tenure, but he rolled through four QBs in the process, leaving many concerned about the lack of progress at the position.Their ultimate demise began with a respectable start to their third season. Muschamp started 4-1 (with a loss to Miami) in 2013 before losing seven straight games to end the season. McElwain started 3-1 this fall (with a loss to Michigan) and would have been 4-1 if the game with Northern Colorado wasn’t cancelled by a hurricane. Now the Gators have lost four straight and could well end the season on a similar slide to that 2013 team.Injuries demolished both rosters in those disappointing seasons. Florida has at least 15 players out this week — not including the nine suspended players. Both Muschamp’s 2013 team and McElwain’s final team also used three quarterbacks while searching for answers.Under both Muschamp and McElwain, the Gators failed to finish a season higher than 96th nationally in yards per game — and it’s a safe bet to remain true this year as they rank 111th. The program cracked the top 70 in scoring offense just once these last seven years, in Muschamp’s final 2014 season. This season, the Gators are 113th out of 129 FBS teams in scoring offense (20.6 points per game).One main difference is that Muschamp’s defenses remained elite throughout his tenure while the Gators have now given up at least 42 points in back-to-back games while tumbling to 78th nationally in points allowed (28.4 per game).The other is that Muschamp, who had a better relationship with the athletic administration, was allowed to return for a fourth year despite that 4-8 debacle, going 6-5 in 2014. McElwain was shown the door at the first chance Florida had to part ways, barely making it halfway through his third season.

In the end, both coaches left the program with plenty of questions for their successor to answer.

The argument can be made that Muschamp left the roster in better shape than McElwain. The offensive line was in disarray, but Muschamp left the Gators with a stacked defense and QB Will Grier, who could well have been the answer to the program’s ongoing woes at the position if not for the PED suspension and ultimate transfer to West Virginia.

---

https://www.seccountry.com/florida/comparing-will-muschamps-and-jim-mcelwains-abbreviated-tenures-at-florida


Mac more like WM than Meyer

quote:

---

Honestly, to this point, other than winning the two East title on the back of Muschamp recruited defensive players, McElwain actually trails Muschamp in most areas.

McElwain and his defenders are quick to point out that he has won the SEC East in each of his first two seasons, as though that alone is considered to be a crowning achievement for a Florida head coach.

And while we are at it, lets be honest about those two East titles, they were won in a division mostly derided as the worst among those in the Power 5 Conferences.

Also, somehow what has gotten lost in the equation is that the Gators lost four games in each of those first two seasons.

Not only do the losses sting, but the rankings are just as hard to look at without a state of depression beginning to set in.

While the Meyer led Gators were ranked in the AP top 10 in 25 of his first 32 game weeks, under McElwain Florida has spent more time unranked (five weeks) than they have in the top 10 (four weeks).

Here midway through his third season McElwain has essentially built a top 20-30 type of program, with no clear path to the top 10 anytime soon.

Or, basically, it is in the same place as Muschamp left it.

Be honest, how many people reading this actually feel like Florida puts a better product on the field today than they did in Muschamp's final season?

That is what I thought.

It wasn't supposed to be this way though.

After the failed Muschamp era mercifully came to an end, then Florida Athletics Director Jeremy Foley vowed to return excitement back to Florida football with the hire of an offensive minded coach.

You know to whom I am referring.

---

quote:

---

It would be laughable if it wasn't so sad, but on average Florida is actually worse off offensively under the offensive minded McElwain than they were under the defensive minded Muschamp.

Total Offense ranking under Muschamp: 2011/#105, 2012/#103, 2013/#113, 2014/#93

Total Offense ranking under McElwain:2015/#111, 2016/#116, 2017/#102

On Saturday, for the 14th time in 32 games (44%) Florida was held to under three touchdowns in the McElwain era.

You can talk about suspensions and injuries being the cause all you want, but with the same players who are unavailable now, Florida only ranked #112 in offense last year.

Also, do you think a Spurrier or Meyer coached team, with those same players who took the field Saturday, would have been held to 16 points in a Homecoming game against a team like LSU?

Exactly.

Neither do I.

When it comes to offense, or lack of it, McElwain has actually out Muschamp'ed, Will Muschamp.

If that isn't bad enough, looking at the career arcs of McElwain and Muschamp with Florida, they are eerily similar.

Scarier still though is that in his third season Muschamp was sitting at 4-1 before a monumental 
slide began - which saw him finish 4-8.

---

quote:

---

In your first couple of seasons you can sell a prospect on a vision you have for the team and the promise that they can help fulfill it.

Three abysmal offensive years later, young men want - and need - to see results more than hear empty words.

In our weekly Recruit Reaction the feedback includes increased trepidation among offensive skill position players.

If Florida hasn't been able to climb out of the 100s in offensive production here in their third season, then when will they?

The present coaching staff sold the same bill of goods to Feleipe Franks, Jordan Scarlett, Freddie Swain, Tyrie Cleveland, Malik Davis, Malik Zaire, etc... The list goes on and on.

Something has to be done. There hasn't been a commitment since the start of the season and some of those who are currently committed are getting a bit antsy.

On Sunday, in gathering quotes for our Recruit Reaction piece, a current commit admitted that though he hasn't said it publicly, Florida's struggles on offense are concerning to him.

Three years in, blaming a lack of offensive production on a lack of players or playmakers starts to ring hollow.

If you are Jacob Copeland, who despite his commitment to Florida has already visited Alabama twice this season and will take visits this fall, when it comes to the Gators staff, do you trust what you hear or what you see?

---

quote:

---

Wm losing to gsu with 20+ starters out was bad.

---

quote:

---

Florida has pinned its problems on a slew of injuries. But that excuse doesn't work against Georgia Southern, which has won three in a row and played without 19 of 65 scholarship athletes.

The Gators were beaten soundly on both sides of the ball.

---

Yeah, TJ, I know you want to sing from the hills about how bad McElwain was, but Muschamp was single-handedly the catalyst for the decline in the program. McElwain was cleaning up his mess.

Just for reference, a question to Georgia fans:

If Kirby, 3 years from now after this monster haul of a clas, lost to an FCS -- is there any excuse feasible outside of your plane crashing as to why you should lose to an FCS?

quote:

---

Not with Kirby now.... But we barely survived somebody not worth remembering last year though

---

Muschamp losing on his third year with arguably one of the best recruiting classes we've ever had -- Jesus frick it's the highest rated recruiting class of all time fml.

He had the best recruiting class of all time and lost to an FCS in his third year. Agent Muschamp, you cruel slut.

quote:

---

Richt wasted scholarships and was poor in roster management.

---

I didn't really think HCs at this level could do it -- and didn't quite understand it because growing up (I was like 19 when I saw our first championship) Florida's roster was always stacked in one way or another.

Then I saw what Meyer left Muschamp -- but I never thought it was bad enough to excuse how Muschamp performed. What Muschamp left McElwain, though, was a complete unmitigated disaster on offense. On defense it looks incredible, but on offense it's literally nothing like I've ever seen -- even during the Zook era.

quote:

---

Catalyst for the declines of programs don't leave 7+ top NFL draft picks on their rosters.

---

I don't know if you know this -- but a ton of recruits (especially at QB) who didn't do anything at Florida had a lot of success in the NFL and other collegiate programs.

If you can't outmuscle an FCS who is missing 19 scholarship players on an already restricted scholarship basis three years after having arguably the greatest recruiting class of all time then you might just be a horrendous coach.

Oh, and remember that Georgia Southern beat the defensive guru without completing a single pass.

quote:

---

Gators faithful don't want to admit it, but a lot of this is on us.

---

McElwain was a terrible fit and Foley knew after the end of year 1 it wouldn't end well. He was not cut out to be the HC at a major college football school in more ways than one.

To make matters worse, in a period of a couple of years he was able to piss off two completely different administrations to the point where they wanted nothing to do with him. That is pretty hard to do and has nothing to do with Gator fans.

That 2010 class was great on paper. Outside of Powell(average for his hype) Riggs, Floyd, Easley, Shaw, Elam, Watkins, green, Burton and Taylor it had no adequate QB, 1 good OL, 2 avg WRs, etc. Hell a 3rd of it transferred without doing a thing.

Heres that all time class:

Ropo: has an average career for his ranking.
Easley: stud
Floyd:stud
Elam: stud
Shaw: transferred
Dunkley: transferred
Chaz Green: competent starter
Watkins: stud
Martin: transferred
Christian:transferred
Dowling:transferred
Silberman: below average starter
Brown: average contributor
Taylor: didn't start til his SR year
Leon Orr: average starter at best
Riggs: stud
Coxson: Transferred
Patton: didn't start til his last year
Trail:transferred
Dunbar: good starter
Ball: good role player
Haden: transferred
McFarland: transferred
Burton: good h back
Ajagbe: role player
Kitchens: role player
Clark:transferred
Murphy: average at best QB.