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re: What does Saban need to accomplish going forward to be considered the GOAT?
Posted on 1/10/12 at 6:57 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
Posted on 1/10/12 at 6:57 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Sure it is. Tubberville was forced out because AU thought a change was needed. Bryant would have been treated with the utmost respect, but a losing season in 1971 and there was definitely a possibility bama would have asked him to step down behind the scenes.
It's not the same. People though Joe Paterno should step down about 10 years ago, but that doesn't mean he was going to be fired.
Thinking the game has passed someone buy doesn't at all equate to trying to run him out of town.
This post was edited on 1/10/12 at 6:59 pm
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Posted on 1/10/12 at 6:59 pm to crimsonsaint
quote:
Likewise take your jealousy and lies of Alabama, BB, and their NCs somewhere else. There ain't a person on this earth that doubts Bear's and Alabama's accomplishments during his tenure.
I am not doubting any of his accomplishments. I am stating facts. Not sure what you disagree with, but it is the truth that there were 4 title years where bama likely had the best team in the country and were the legit champs and two when they were not under Bryant. In each of those two years, the poll that awarded the title changed their way of voting due to a mistake in naming bama champion.
And if you disagree Bryant was considering retirement and people in power at bama thought it might be time for a change after the 1970 season, you need to learn bama's history a bit better.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:01 pm to ohiovol
quote:
It's not the same. People though Joe Paterno should step down about 10 years ago, but that doesn't mean he was going to be fired.
If you do not think there was a possibility of bama asking Bryant to step down (behind the scenes, not publicy) if Bama had a losing season in 1971, you are wrong. It has been documented in many places that many people including Bryant himself thought it may be time to call it quits.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:03 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
If you do not think there was a possibility of bama asking Bryant to step down (behind the scenes, not publicy) if Bama had a losing season in 1971, you are wrong. It has been documented in many places that many people including Bryant himself thought it may be time to call it quits.
That's a pretty big 'if' in this hypothetical situation. And were going to ask him to step down or were they going give him the choice of resigning or being fired? Because there's a big difference.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:04 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
But then Bryant did something many coaches would never consider doing. He changed his philosophy. He changed how his offense played the game and dominated the next decade because of it.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:06 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Bama fans that know the history, feel free to chime in.
This was a transitional phase for Bryant. In fairness, though, it was less a matter of fear that he would step down or be forced out, but more a fear that he had burned out and would choose to retire.
Rival coaches were using these rumors to negatively recruit against Alabama during these days, actually.
But then Bryant installed the wishbone.
This post was edited on 1/10/12 at 7:07 pm
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:06 pm to ohiovol
quote:
That's a pretty big 'if' in this hypothetical situation. And were going to ask him to step down or were they going give him the choice of resigning or being fired? Because there's a big difference
I do not know. This is a hypothetical discussion. I am just saying Bryant himself along with the powerbrokers at Alabama were thinking it may be time for a change after the 1970 season. A change that did not involve Bryant as HC any longer. But in 1971, Bama did not have a losing season, they integrated, switched to the wishbone and launched a decade of dominance.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:08 pm to TideSaint
quote:
But then Bryant did something many coaches would never consider doing. He changed his philosophy.
Yep. I am not being critical of Bryant. If anything I am crediting him for re-evaluating everything, changing, then dominating.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:11 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
I do not know. This is a hypothetical discussion. I am just saying Bryant himself along with the powerbrokers at Alabama were thinking it may be time for a change after the 1970 season. A change that did not involve Bryant as HC any longer. But in 1971, Bama did not have a losing season, they integrated, switched to the wishbone and launched a decade of dominance.
This is what you said:
quote:
Bama was very close to firing him or forcing his retirement.
I find that hard to believe. May he have considered stepping down? Sure. But I doubt they were about to fire a coach with the kind of success he had after two bad seasons. Especially if those were supposed to be transition years, anyways (which I don't know well enough to say they were).
Even if some people wanted to, I would think it would take a bit more than that to make it happen.
This post was edited on 1/10/12 at 7:14 pm
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:11 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Yep. I am not being critical of Bryant. If anything I am crediting him for re-evaluating everything, changing, then dominating.
Oh, I see what you're doing, and I don't fault it. I haven't seen you actually criticize Bryant once in this thread.
In fact, Alabama's position in the late 60s was one that would have claimed many a lesser man, especially given the success he'd had prior to that point. In retrospect, the fact that he was able to reinvent himself and go on to even greater heights was nothing short of astounding.
I think that period alone and the adversity that was overcome qualifies Bryant for at least a little respect.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:19 pm to ohiovol
quote:
I find that hard to believe. May he have considered stepping down? Sure. But I doubt they were about to fire a coach with the kind of success he had after two bad seasons. Especially if those were supposed to be transition years, anyways (which I don't know well enough to say they were).
Even if some people wanted to, I would think it would take a bit more than that to make it happen.
It was three disappointing seasons. Bama was favored to win another NC in 1968. 1971 would have made 4 dissapointing seasons in a row.
It is somewhat of a symantics game we are playing here so, I'm just going to leave it as is. When I say forced to retire or step down, I believe it would have been more of a mutual decision, but I believe Bryant would have certainly been uder pressure to step down or retire if 1971 had been a 4th season in a row that was considered a dissappointment. He might have, he might not have. He might have agreed, he might have disagreed. However you are kidding yourself if you do not think SOME would have put pressure on him to "consider" it.
ETA: I re-read what you quoted. I agree, very close to asking/forcing Bryant to step down or retire (even behind the scenes) was too strong a statement earlier.
This post was edited on 1/10/12 at 7:25 pm
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:22 pm to cyde
quote:
I think that period alone and the adversity that was overcome qualifies Bryant for at least a little respect.
Yep. The fact Saban is getting into the discussion of "how much more does he need to do" is pretty amazing at is it.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:25 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
It was three disappointing seasons. Bama was favored to win another NC in 1968. 1971 would have made 4 dissapointing seasons in a row.
It is somewhat of a symantics game we are playing here so, I'm just going to leave it as is. When I say forced to retire or step down, I believe it would have been more of a mutual decision, but I believe Bryant would have certainly been uder pressure to step down or retire if 1971 had been a 4th season in a row that was considered a dissappointment. He might have, he might not have. He might have agreed, he might have disagreed. However you are kidding yourself if you do not think SOME would have put pressure on him to "consider" it.
ETA: I re-read what you quoted. I agree, very close to asking/forcing Bryant to step down or retire (even behind the scenes) was too strong a statement earlier.
I could see that. He quit in the early 80's when he didn't think he could do it anymore. If he didn't think he could do it in the early 70's, he probably would have quit then.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:25 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Yep. The fact Saban is getting into the discussion of "how much more does he need to do" is pretty amazing at is it.
Agree.
Saban's record speaks for itself, but you have to consider all that Bryant had to do to sustain his success. While it certainly isn't impossible, I'd like to reserve judgement until Saban's career comes to a close.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:39 pm to TideSaint
Finebaum said no matter what saban does that he can't replace the bear. I would agree.
Posted on 1/10/12 at 7:42 pm to TideSaint
Saban has 3 NCs at Alabama 
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