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Posted on 8/29/22 at 1:50 pm to lsufball19
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I bet they didn't when they started practicing
They are self employed. Every new client would be judging them on their appearance.
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Right or wrong, human nature is very real. You can think it's wrong to judge people based on appearances, but it happens in every walk of life and is ingrained in human nature for the vast majority of people. And if you know all that and chose to go against the grain, you can't act outraged that someone didn't take you seriously based on your appearance
Appearance is too broad of a term. That includes race. And I don't suspect that you are saying it is OK to hire someone based on race.
Dan Mullen wears tennis shoes. Should a hiring committee make a judgment to pay him 6 or 7 figures based on his style of shoes? How about his hair style? Style of transportation.
We are already in agreement to disagree.
I disagree to hire based on the grounds of appearance or style. I'm looking for merit and a fit towards common goals.
Posted on 8/29/22 at 1:54 pm to meansonny
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Every new client would be judging them on their appearance.
Yes, but they have a track record of doing their jobs well. A guy hanging his shingle or trying to work for a firm right out of law school doesn't. How many client do you think would want to hire a lawyer "who looks like a hippie" if he had no resume attached to his name? That's a rhetorical question
Again, this has nothing to do with someone's ability to perform a job well, but to act like people don't male judgments based on first impressions and appearances is just being willfully obtuse
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Dan Mullen wears tennis shoes. Should a hiring committee make a judgment to pay him 6 or 7 figures based on his style of shoes? How about his hair style? Style of transportation.
We are already in agreement to disagree.
Do you think Dan Mullen wore high tops with a suit in his first interview as a head coach? Or do you think he started dressing like that after being a head coach for a long time?
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I disagree to hire based on the grounds of appearance or style.
When you have interviewed for a job in person, did you show up in jeans, t-shirt, flip flops, and baseball cap? If not, why?
This post was edited on 8/29/22 at 2:09 pm
Posted on 8/29/22 at 1:55 pm to 3down10
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It's like I tell my kids, one of the most important things in life is how you present yourself.
I tell my kids the same thing.
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If you go out looking like a thug, you will get treated like a thug.
Do you see dreds hair style as acting like a thug?
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If you go out looking like a respectable adult, you will also get treated as such.
Male trial attorneys have white hippy pony tails. Men wear brand tennis shoes with their work attire. College football coaches have dreds.
Act like a professional with confidence and grace. Be prepared for interviews. And anyone who turns down the best candidate off of style is running a losing organization. Don't sweat it. Prove them wrong.
Posted on 8/29/22 at 1:57 pm to meansonny
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It's like I tell my kids, one of the most important things in life is how you present yourself.
I tell my kids the same thing.
you do?
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I disagree to hire based on the grounds of appearance or style.
Why do you tell your kids this if you don't believe it?
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:01 pm to lsufball19
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Yes, but they have a track record of doing their jobs well. A guy hanging his shingle or trying to work for a firm right out of law school doesn't.
The thread is about hiring head coaches in the SEC. This isn't about Valdosta state. You are in the wrong thread with this point.
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Again, this has nothing to do with someone's ability to perform a job well, but to act like people don't male judgments based on first impressions and appearances is just being willfully obtuse
To make hiring decisions off of appearances is willfully obtuse (appearance includes color, race, sex, style).
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Do you think Dan Mullen wore high tops with a suit in his first interview as a head coach? Or do you think he started dressing like that after being a head coach for a long time?
I bet he wore them to Miss St. Maybe a bulldog and confirm if the tennis shoe has always been his thing.
Again, this thread is about SEC head coaching jobs.
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When you have interviewed for a job in person, did you show up in jeans, t-shirt, flip flops, and baseball cap? If not, why?
This debate sprung up about hair style.
And your side has expanded it to appearance (race, sex, color are included in appearance).
Your straw man about my personal style is irrelevant. Proof? You listed 4 things and none of them were about my hair cut.
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:01 pm to meansonny
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Act like a professional with confidence and grace. Be prepared for interviews.
Thanks Judith
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:04 pm to lsufball19
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I disagree to hire based on the grounds of appearance or style.
Why do you tell your kids this if you don't believe it?
1) because choosing a candidate based on appearance (race, sex, color) is illegal. You should know better.
2) I already made this point. Any organization choosing to make hiring practices based on style (hair, shoes, transportation) over merit is a loser organization and not worth the time to fret over. It is worth an opportunity to crush it at the next job and prove what the loser organization is missing.
What part of #2 do you personally disagree?
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:08 pm to meansonny
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I bet he wore them to Miss St. Maybe a bulldog and confirm if the tennis shoe has always been his thing.
He first wore this look at SEC media days in 2015. It was talked about. So no it hasn't always been his thing
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This debate sprung up about hair style.
And your side has expanded it to appearance (race, sex, color are included in appearance).
hair style is part of appearance is it not?
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Your straw man about my personal style is irrelevant.
Sorry, it's a bit weird when someone talks out of both sides of their mouth on a topic
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You listed 4 things and none of them were about my hair cut.
Ok? add blue hair to it if it makes you feel more comfortable. But I fear your deflection from answering that question is because you and I both already know your answer. I'm guessing you dressed nicely for your interviews because you know/knew impressions are important and didn't wish to present poorly to your interviewer, you know like everyone on planet earth with any sense interviewing for a job.
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Again, this thread is about SEC head coaching jobs.
You're right. We are. And SEC football coaches are many times THE faces of the university. Their appearance absolutely matters.
This post was edited on 8/29/22 at 2:13 pm
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:09 pm to meansonny
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Act like a professional with confidence and grace. Be prepared for interviews.
Dreadlocks and ebonics are the opposite of professionalism. I don't judge people based on things they can't control. Your appearance (how you dress yourself, hygiene, etc... NOT skin color, scars, injuries, etc...) and communication skills are definitely within your control.
This post was edited on 8/29/22 at 2:10 pm
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:10 pm to Domeskeller
Bebe is a Cajun that was actually considered black in civil war days
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:22 pm to lsufball19
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I bet he wore them to Miss St. Maybe a bulldog and confirm if the tennis shoe has always been his thing.
He first wore this look at SEC media days in 2015, so no it hasn't always been his thing
Fine. Florida hired him with his tennis shoes. Again, the thread is about SEC head coaching hires. Thanks for making my point.
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This debate sprung up about hair style.
And your side has expanded it to appearance (race, sex, color are included in appearance).
hair style is part of appearance is it not?
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Yes. Just like race, sex, color, etc.. we are repeating the same points. "Appearance is too broad a term for your argument" because I can list several appearances that are illegal to make hiring decisions.
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Your straw man about my personal style is irrelevant.
Sorry, it's a bit weird when someone talks out of both sides of their mouth on a topic
Do you have an example?
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You listed 4 things and none of them were about my hair cut.
Ok? add blue hair to it if it makes you feel more comfortable. But I fear your deflection from answering that question is because you and I both already know your answer
You are equating blue hair with dredlocks? That is your "style" equivalent for your argument to hire black head coaches in the SEC? I just want to make sure we are discussing the same thing before I answer.
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:25 pm to VADawg
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Dreadlocks and ebonics are the opposite of professionalism. I don't judge people based on things they can't control. Your appearance (how you dress yourself, hygiene, etc... NOT skin color, scars, injuries, etc...) and communication skills are definitely within your control.
I didn't comment about communication skills.
I commented about dredlocks. We agree to disagree.
Is hiring a coach with dredlocks different in an off field position? How about a position group coach?
Still a "no go" with dreds?
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:27 pm to lsufball19
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You're right. We are. And SEC football coaches are many times THE faces of the university. Their appearance absolutely matters.
And yet the white guy is wearing tennis shoes because he is hip with the kids.
Lol
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:28 pm to meansonny
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Do you see dreds hair style as acting like a thug?
Well there are many stages between. So no, not in itself.
However, when you are talking about a guy who is going to be in charge of an entire program that's having millions of dollars put into it on a weekly basis, not to mention having to oversee 125 kids etc, then the criteria is likely going to be more strict.
If I'm a manager at McDonalds, it's not going to make a difference. If you are talking about what amounts to the CEO of a company, then small things can add up.
It would not be 1 thing most likely, but a culmination of multiple things.
Furthermore, it's not a single coach in a vacuum. He's in competition with other candidates. If all else is equal, then those little things can make a difference.
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Male trial attorneys have white hippy pony tails. Men wear brand tennis shoes with their work attire. College football coaches have dreds.
Act like a professional with confidence and grace. Be prepared for interviews. And anyone who turns down the best candidate off of style is running a losing organization. Don't sweat it. Prove them wrong.
I agree you have to hire off the merits, but again you aren't looking at all the people who went with the guy who doesn't have the douche tail, etc. Because there are other options.
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:34 pm to meansonny
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And yet the white guy is wearing tennis shoes because he is hip with the kids.
And the white guy doing that didn't start doing that until year 7 on the job after he had been winning. Bill Belichick dresses like a hobo now, but he wasn't doing that when he was losing as a coach for the Browns. Mullen didn't walk into an interview at State (his first HC job) with basketball shoes on. Do you just ignore these types of details and parts of the arguments you don't like on purpose?
This post was edited on 8/29/22 at 2:40 pm
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:35 pm to MJackson
Chris Low just wants to be invited to the BBQ
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:36 pm to meansonny
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Men wear brand tennis shoes with their work attire.
Not really
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:38 pm to meansonny
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Fine. Florida hired him with his tennis shoes
Florida hired a coach who had been a head coach with success in the SEC for 9 years
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Thanks for making my point.
I don't think you even know what your point is, or mine for that matter
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Do you have an example?
When you said you teach your sons one of the most important things in life is how you present yourself but then also argue that how you present yourself shouldn't matter
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You are equating blue hair with dredlocks?
Oh are those two things that different? Why is that? Can someone with blue hair not be a good football coach?
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That is your "style" equivalent for your argument to hire black head coaches in the SEC?
What do you think my argument is for hiring black head coaches?
This post was edited on 8/29/22 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 8/29/22 at 2:39 pm to meansonny
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I commented about dredlocks. We agree to disagree.
Is hiring a coach with dredlocks different in an off field position? How about a position group coach?
Still a "no go" with dreds?
I think they're trashy as shite and set a bad example for impressionable college aged kids, so yes.
FWIW, if a white guy came into an interview with meth mouth and hadn't brushed his teeth, I'd treat that the exact same way.
This post was edited on 8/29/22 at 2:41 pm
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