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re: Hey Georgia
Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:44 pm to MetroAtlantaGatorFan
Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:44 pm to MetroAtlantaGatorFan
quote:
Shh, I wonder if he knows that the NCAA didn't count bowl game stats until 2000.
So... are you saying UF doesn't claim bowl wins/losses as part of their team records until a certain date?
If they do... then how can you claim those games don't count?
Bowls were never pre-season games like in the NFL where they weren't part of a team's record. They've always been part of the team's record. They're real games that are part of a team's season and always have been.
Exhibition games don't count toward your win/loss record as a team.
Again, the reason the AP voted after the regular season and not the bowls had NOTHING to do with the games "not counting". It had to do with the fact there was a 1 month gap between the last regular season game and the bowls at the time (less than 10 prior to the 70's)... and they didn't want to wait until many fans didn't care to name their "national champion".
It's not like today where we have a whole month of bowls. This was a media based decision, not a football based one like you seem to think.
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Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:44 pm to DawgsLife
quote:
I gave you the list of selectors, so again you are incorrect.
Not surprising.
Not a single valid selector.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:44 pm to DawginSC
quote:
Member since Aug 2022
252 posts
Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:45 pm to MetroAtlantaGatorFan
quote:
Finally. Hopefully you'll calm down now instead of cussing another poster out on a sports message board.
I have never cussed out anybody. show me where I have ever used a cuss word. I do not cuss. Ever.
That said....it's time to go watch TV with the wife.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:47 pm to DawgsLife
Hopefully you don't beat her again.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 4:57 pm to MetroAtlantaGatorFan
Ah, you do realize the image the florida gator fans have here right?
Posted on 9/20/22 at 5:00 pm to 3down10
quote:
If you are going to argue that a game that happened 3-4 weeks after a team was awarded a national championship and they celebrated the national championship was somehow important and part of the process to obtaining a national championships, then you're just a dumbass and you can't fix stupid.
And you obviously don't realize schools aren't who awards National Championships and their records have no bearing on it?
Btw, most of the bowl games stats are not counted and only started getting counted recently. This was true even after they started awarding national championships after.
The AP poll was 6 years old in 1942... it wasn't some universally accepted way to name a national champion like you seem to think it was. At that point in football history, there were many individuals who released their own national champion (based on one voter) or math polls (which date back to 1926 with the first Dickinson rating). There were 7 math based systems for naming national champions that predated the AP poll's beginning in 1936.
Teams didn't go "oh, the AP poll named us champ, the season is over, no reason for trying in bowls" in the 1940's. That's an example of you using "presentism". Teams played all their games like they counted (because other than the AP poll... they did) and tried to win as many national title selectors as possible.
You have this incorrect view that bowls weren't counted by the AP because everyone considered them exhibitions. That's false. The poll was done prior to bowls because the media at the time (the AP) didn't want to release the poll after the majority of fans had stopped following football... since the bowls occurred a month after the season ended and in those games there weren't many bowls (in 1942 there were 5 bowl games).
It was about driving fan interest, not about the games not counted. They always counted (which is why they're part of team's records in all cases).
Posted on 9/20/22 at 5:45 pm to lewis and herschel
Posted on 9/20/22 at 5:48 pm to DawginSC
quote:
The AP poll was 6 years old in 1942... it wasn't some universally accepted way to name a national champion like you seem to think it was. At that point in football history, there were many individuals who released their own national champion (based on one voter) or math polls (which date back to 1926 with the first Dickinson rating). There were 7 math based systems for naming national champions that predated the AP poll's beginning in 1936.
There is no poll that is recognized more than the AP. The majority of selectors you name simply did not exist, and nobody at all used the math selectors after the AP poll came out at that time.
quote:
Teams didn't go "oh, the AP poll named us champ, the season is over, no reason for trying in bowls" in the 1940's. That's an example of you using "presentism". Teams played all their games like they counted (because other than the AP poll... they did) and tried to win as many national title selectors as possible.
They played for pride, not for the national championships. The bowl games were often teams that were selected at "random".
In 1942, it was #13 UCLA who played Georgia in the Rose Bowl. UCLA lost 3 other games that year, including one to a flight school. You did not play the #1 team, you didn't play the best team in their area, you played the best team that would accept the bowl game.
quote:
You have this incorrect view that bowls weren't counted by the AP because everyone considered them exhibitions.
No matter what you say there is no way to get around the fact that the bowl games were played 3 and 4 weeks after the national champion was named.
quote:
It was about driving fan interest, not about the games not counted. They always counted (which is why they're part of team's records in all cases).
They did not count for the national championship. Period.
I guess I should just get some friends together and we can each make our own "selectors" and then we can just put Ohio St ahead of Georgia. Because that's how valid the selectors you name are.
This post was edited on 9/20/22 at 5:50 pm
Posted on 9/20/22 at 5:54 pm to 3down10
Shh, he doesn't know that the only reason Ohio St didn't play in the Rose Bowl instead is because the Big 10 didn't allow members to play in postseason games at the time.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 8:58 pm to 3down10
quote:
They did not count for the national championship. Period.
You're not very bright.
The AP was not "the national championship" in 1942. It was one of a multitude of selectors where teams claimed a national title.
The AP poll was 6 years old. There were many other "championships" awarded at that time that had more longevity and gravitas than the AP, and they did in fact award their titles after bowls.
You honestly have no idea about the history of the time. The idea that there was a recognized single national champion is simply not accurate.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 9:17 pm to DawginSC
quote:
The AP was not "the national championship" in 1942. It was one of a multitude of selectors where teams claimed a national title.
No, there weren't.
quote:
he AP poll was 6 years old. There were many other "championships" awarded at that time that had more longevity and gravitas than the AP, and they did in fact award their titles after bowls.
No, there weren't many other championships awarded.
If that was the case, you wouldn't have needed to claim it in the 80s.
quote:
You honestly have no idea about the history of the time. The idea that there was a recognized single national champion is simply not accurate.
Once again, if what you said was even remotely true then Georgia wouldn't have needed to make the claim in the 80s. Georgia would have celebrated it back in 1942. They did not.
This post was edited on 9/20/22 at 9:19 pm
Posted on 9/20/22 at 9:47 pm to 3down10
quote:
Once again, if what you said was even remotely true then Georgia wouldn't have needed to make the claim in the 80s. Georgia would have celebrated it back in 1942. They did not.
What you don't realize is that OSU didn't claim a national championship in 1942 either. BThey claimed it later in the 1950's when the AP and Coaches poll became agreed upon as the gold standards and math based formulas were largely discarded. But again, that was "presentism" as you put it at the time. Before that the AP poll was not considered a standard. It was just another award for a team to get. Nobody claimed national championships because they didn't have a standard for doing so.
OSU instead "placed first in a poll of football writers", just like UGA placed first in a majority of the rankings available at the time.
You're thinking that the AP poll meant a national championship back then. It simply did not.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 9:56 pm to 3down10
Regardless, you are allowed to believe the bowl games didn't count (even though you count them toward your team's record) and are allowed to believe that champions named before bowl games are played was universal and not something that the AP did for marketing purposes.
You'd be wrong, but you're allowed to believe that all you like. Doesn't change the fact that UGA had the majority of selectors name them as the national champion in 1942 while OSU got selected by people voting before the season was over despite not even winning their conference outright.
I'm over trying to educate you on the reality of the situation. I'll get back to talking about this year's football prospects. Thankfully we don't rely on polls for the championship any more... they just contribute to getting the teams who play for it. Those teams then determine it on the field.
You'd be wrong, but you're allowed to believe that all you like. Doesn't change the fact that UGA had the majority of selectors name them as the national champion in 1942 while OSU got selected by people voting before the season was over despite not even winning their conference outright.
I'm over trying to educate you on the reality of the situation. I'll get back to talking about this year's football prospects. Thankfully we don't rely on polls for the championship any more... they just contribute to getting the teams who play for it. Those teams then determine it on the field.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 10:13 pm to DawginSC
quote:
What you don't realize is that OSU didn't claim a national championship in 1942 either. BThey claimed it later in the 1950's when the AP and Coaches poll became agreed upon as the gold standards and math based formulas were largely discarded. But again, that was "presentism" as you put it at the time. Before that the AP poll was not considered a standard. It was just another award for a team to get. Nobody claimed national championships because they didn't have a standard for doing so.
OSU instead "placed first in a poll of football writers", just like UGA placed first in a majority of the rankings available at the time.
You're thinking that the AP poll meant a national championship back then. It simply did not.
It was the only award. FYI, the image you posted comes off a website that sells rare newspapers. Here is what they call the article:
Ohio State Buckeyes... 1942 National champs.... - RareNewspapers.com
quote:
This is 1st report coverage on the Ohio State Buckeyes officially being named national champions of college football by the associated press.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 10:33 pm to DawginSC
quote:
Doesn't change the fact that UGA had the majority of selectors name them as the national champion in 1942
The things you keep calling selectors are not selectors, nor did they exist in 1942.
Berryman QPRS - 1990.
Billingsley Report - 1970
Sagarin - 1978
Devlod System - 1945
Actually existed in 1942:
Poling System
Houlgate System
Litkenhous
Williamson System
Formulas that existed that didn't pick Georgia:
Helms Athletic Foundation
Dunkel System
Boand System
And of course, the AP which gives Ohio St another 84 first place votes. Because that is what a math ranking system is equivalent to, a single voter.
Posted on 9/20/22 at 10:34 pm to Dawgsfan81
quote:
All Pawl is doing is giving Bama some locker room material.
Trust me, Finebaum doesn't have to give them any. They're getting the yummy rat poison from everywhere.
Joel Klatt:
"Remember how it used to be Bama or the field. It's Georgia or the field now and I think I'm taking Georgia."
(Joel's never been much of a Georgia pusher)
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