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re: First to win an SEC title? USC or aTm
Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:39 am to CNB
Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:39 am to CNB
quote:
Holy shite. Is 27-0 not already a blowout? How does one bad call excuse 57 points?
4 defensive starters out + lack of depth + both sides playing up-tempo resulting in a 4 hr game + horrible officiating = our players getting super fricking tired and struggling to defend a very high scoring offense in the 2nd half
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Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:40 am to Cockopotamus
quote:
First to win an SEC title?
Over last 50 years the 'big 6' has been it save the 76 UK split title. Whoever is first, it'll be historic.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:48 am to Cockopotamus
quote:
4 stars + aren't the only recruits with talent.
If you are talking about winning the SEC, your recruiting program better produce a lot more 4+ star commitments than 3 star commitments.
quote:
...the state has been noticeably down the past two years, which is why we went into GA NC and FL more.
I understand, but your Gamecock recruiting program has averaged only 3.22 stars over the past four years.
Bama on the other hand has averaged 3.79 and LSU has averaged 3.58. A 3.5+ star average recruiting class seems to be the magical number to win a national championship.
You also need to get at least one or two 5 stars each year.
I expect the Aggies to average over 3.5+ stars over the next four years. On the other hand, I will be shocked if your Gamecocks average over 3.5 stars over the next four years.
This post was edited on 4/24/13 at 12:50 am
Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:51 am to dbt_Geaux_Tigers_196
quote:
Whoever is first, it'll be historic.
Yep. the top 6 teams last year were incredibly even though so I figure now is a better time than ever for someone outside the big 6 to break through
Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:53 am to Sheetbend
yea i just don't really value the star system all that much. There can be some really trivial things that make the difference between a 3 and 4 star.
I trust the coaches evaluations and targets more than star rating from recruiting services.
I trust the coaches evaluations and targets more than star rating from recruiting services.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 12:57 am to Cockopotamus
quote:
I trust the coaches evaluations and targets more than star rating from recruiting services.
I do too. Coaches have to figure out who's leaving, who's staying, then recruit for those units. 3 stars all of a sudden become 4 stars if a big name coach shows interest. It's pretty subjective.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 1:06 am to DudeofLSU
They call it "battered Aggie syndrome". But yeah, you're right.
This thread reminds me of the time I tried talking shite about football to the only USC grad I knew, only it went much better this time around. She couldn't be bothered, heh.
This thread reminds me of the time I tried talking shite about football to the only USC grad I knew, only it went much better this time around. She couldn't be bothered, heh.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 1:08 am to dbt_Geaux_Tigers_196
quote:
3 stars all of a sudden become 4 stars if a big name coach shows interest. It's pretty subjective.
yep. the recruiting services have an incentive to give players higher ratings if they are considering teams with a big fanbase presence on their site also
This post was edited on 4/24/13 at 1:15 am
Posted on 4/24/13 at 2:54 am to Cockopotamus
Funny how the big time coaches with big-time recruiting programs can reload year after year with superior talent, while schools with second-tier recruiting programs make a run at a conference championship once a decade if lucky.
Year after year, the schools with the highest rated recruiting classes like Bama, and LSU have dominated the SEC.
Since Florida stopped producing top recruiting classes, they all of a sudden stopped winning SEC crowns--wonder why.
Now that Muschamp at Florida and Sumlin at TAM are now building up their recruiting programs, watch what they start to do in the SEC.
Bama catches TAM early and has two weeks to prepare for the Aggies, so I give Bama the edge this year. However, if the Aggies can beat Bama, they should become a big favorite to win the SEC West. Bama loses a lot on the OL, which could be the difference.
LSU loses too much experienced talent on defense, and their SEC schedule is ridiculously tougher than any of the SEC West teams. The Tigers are year away from teaming a dominate defense with a well designed offense.
So, this is a great year for TAM to win the SEC West.
Year after year, the schools with the highest rated recruiting classes like Bama, and LSU have dominated the SEC.
Since Florida stopped producing top recruiting classes, they all of a sudden stopped winning SEC crowns--wonder why.
Now that Muschamp at Florida and Sumlin at TAM are now building up their recruiting programs, watch what they start to do in the SEC.
Bama catches TAM early and has two weeks to prepare for the Aggies, so I give Bama the edge this year. However, if the Aggies can beat Bama, they should become a big favorite to win the SEC West. Bama loses a lot on the OL, which could be the difference.
LSU loses too much experienced talent on defense, and their SEC schedule is ridiculously tougher than any of the SEC West teams. The Tigers are year away from teaming a dominate defense with a well designed offense.
So, this is a great year for TAM to win the SEC West.
This post was edited on 4/24/13 at 3:14 am
Posted on 4/24/13 at 4:47 am to RockyMtnTigerWDE
quote:
aTm will have the better chance as they take advantage of better recruiting coming their way
Absolutely right.
USC has a great program. aTm is in an unbelievable situation though, have been recruiting off the JFF bandwagon in one of the most fertile recruiting grounds. Have good coaches and our poised to be very good for years.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 4:58 am to Cockopotamus
What kind of question is this? This is aTm easily. When's the last time South Carolina won a conference title in football? 1969? 2010 was their best shot at winning one and they blew it. Florida, Georgia, and Tennessee were all down that year and they didn't have to play a loaded juggernaut like peak LSU or Bama in the SEC Championship Game and they still couldn't get it done.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 7:02 am to Bench McElroy
Any coach that has won a BCS title had a flash of early promise (10 wins or better) soon after arrival at that school. Mac Brown sort of throws that metric off some but it still works, his early 10 win season did finally show that he had the resources and talent (combined with the bare minimum required coaching ability to win a title).
Spurrier obviously already has titles at Florida, but he has fallen far short of that at USC. Sumlin and Muschamp are the most likely cantidates to be the next coaches to win their first BCS title (aka the SEC championship).
Spurrier obviously already has titles at Florida, but he has fallen far short of that at USC. Sumlin and Muschamp are the most likely cantidates to be the next coaches to win their first BCS title (aka the SEC championship).
This post was edited on 4/24/13 at 7:07 am
Posted on 4/24/13 at 7:18 am to TeLeFaWx
quote:
USC is incapable of ever locking down a top 5 class. They just don't have the ability.
May not have both been top five but 2003 and 2007 were both atleast top ten. I think 2003 was top five and that was a lot of Holtz recruiting. Nice facts though...
Posted on 4/24/13 at 8:10 am to Cockopotamus
quote:
you have to identify talent before you can acquire it
Not sure where you're going with this, but it seems you're having a hard time keeping up.
They're two different undertakings requiring two different skill-sets. It's far more difficult to acquire top-tier talent than it is to identify it. When projecting the future of a program, we're not sitting around wondering whether Sumlin can find diamonds in the rough. We're asking whether he can go head-to-head with Saban and Miles for the studs and beat them. No credit is given to the program who offers first unless the kid signs.
That's the point. That's the focus of the conversation.
Coaches aren't praised for discovering the next AD or Brett Favre--they're praised for actually signing him.
quote:
I trust the coaches evaluations and targets more than star rating from recruiting services.
As you should. And generally speaking, there's a positive correlation between amount of big-time offers and stars. To act like the star system is invariably flawed and unreliable is silly. It sounds of Arky.
This post was edited on 4/24/13 at 8:16 am
Posted on 4/24/13 at 8:41 am to TeLeFaWx
quote:
You could have made an All-Star team of Carolina players over the last 3 years and they wouldn't have beat the 2012 Texas A&M squad...
Now I have to commit to one or the other. SoCar, easily.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 9:42 am to Bench McElroy
quote:
What kind of question is this? This is aTm easily. When's the last time South Carolina won a conference title in football? 1969? 2010 was their best shot at winning one and they blew it. Florida, Georgia, and Tennessee were all down that year and they didn't have to play a loaded juggernaut like peak LSU or Bama in the SEC Championship Game and they still couldn't get it done.
lulz ... yeah, well, we only had to go on the road at Auburn and then Auburn again in the SEC Championship game. You know, "that" Auburn. The one with the freaky athletic QB and thug POS DLineman. The one that had the horseshoe up their arses that year.
But yeah, it's okay, I get where you are coming from. It's okay, we're fine with all that. We're good.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 9:47 am to scrooster
You're getting way too worked up over this stuff, man.
Posted on 4/24/13 at 9:55 am to Cockopotamus
USCe
Posted on 4/24/13 at 9:57 am to DWag215
quote:
DWag215 posted: Not sure where you're going with this, but it seems you're having a hard time keeping up.
They're two different undertakings requiring two different skill-sets. It's far more difficult to acquire top-tier talent than it is to identify it. When projecting the future of a program, we're not sitting around wondering whether Sumlin can find diamonds in the rough. We're asking whether he can go head-to-head with Saban and Miles for the studs and beat them. No credit is given to the program who offers first unless the kid signs.
That's the point. That's the focus of the conversation.
Coaches aren't praised for discovering the next AD or Brett Favre--they're praised for actually signing him.
I'm going to try to be gentile here and not call you any names that would fit you well like, say, dumb frick or shite for brains .... so try to stay with me here, okay?
Right now, on the team SCAR has right now, there are far more players that were offered by Saban and Miles (since you wish to use that as your standard), than there are on A&M's roster. Additionally, in the 2014 class, there will be far more players signed by SCAR that were offered by Saban, Miles, et al, than there will be on A&M's roster.
Care to place a small wager on either? I mean ... since your hypocritical arse wants to use the "Saban/Miles" thing as the standard.
Now, with regard to the "star" rating system we must assume you are referring to one service, "Rivals," correct? Or are you referring to all services, 247, Scout, ESPN, Rivals, Parade, et al?
Either way ... doesn't really matter. Yes, the grading system used by recruiting services that cater to fan bases is flawed. Their evaluators are, for the most part, biased, poorly informed, lacking experience and uninterested in anything except generating premium subscription revenue from the largest fan bases. So, while yes there is a slight correlation between big time offers and star ratings, it's more of a case of the tail wagging the dog than it is what you are attempting to infer. Would a three star DB who was committed to Spurrier in his first year at SC be bumped to a four star DB if he de-committed from SC and instead committed and signed with Florida on Signing Day ... would that be an illustration of your side of the debate, or mine? Tell me.
So here is what you are presented. You have been challenged to a wager regarding who has the most players on their roster offered by Saban and/or Miles, (and A&M should really have a huge advantage here given how Miles recruits Texas so hard), and you have a wager about who will have the most in the next class, the 2014 class, with offers from Saban and/or Miles, (and once again you should have an enormous advantage because SCAR is only going to sign like 17 players in the next class) ... and you have a question before you regarding the hypothetical scenario of the DB changing his mind on signing day and the star rating jumping up a notch overnight.
Regards
Posted on 4/24/13 at 10:05 am to scrooster
quote:
Right now, on the team SCAR has right now, there are far more players that were offered by Saban and Miles (since you wish to use that as your standard), than there are on A&M's roster. Additionally, in the 2014 class, there will be far more players signed by SCAR that were offered by Saban, Miles, et al, than there will be on A&M's roster.
That probably has more to do with SC recruiting the same areas/teams/talent pool that Alabama does. I would like to see the numbers on players with both SC and LSU offers, that sounds like a bigger overlap of recruiting territory. You also have to figure that A&M has more talent in close proximity to recruit from, the most likely head to head LSU to A&M offer is going to be to a kid in Louisiana and not halfway between LA and SC, etc.
Again, if Spurrier wins another SEC championship at SC, that means he will be bucking a strong trend: either winning a title after not posting a 10 win season within his first four years at that institution (first for any coach in BCS era), or ending the SEC run of national championships.
Now, of course, a likely result is Spurrier retires to drink Coors topless on his boat, and a hot shot coach comes in and posts a 10+ win season with his roster along with some new hot recruits. That would be SC's best scenario for a title.
This post was edited on 4/24/13 at 10:07 am
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