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re: Final approval of NCAA Lawsuit delayed.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 3:28 am to FlyDownTheField83
Posted on 4/25/25 at 3:28 am to FlyDownTheField83
quote:this is why I peaced out immediately lmao
it is a waste of time to argue with you
0
Posted on 4/25/25 at 3:40 am to 3down10
quote:you've made this abundantly clear lol
I honestly have no idea what is going on here
Posted on 4/25/25 at 12:16 pm to TheSandman
quote:
this is why I peaced out immediately lmao
You can't make an argument because you are indoctrinated rather than educated. Not a single one of you has been able to produce a real argument and this page is on page 3 now.
The behavior of the indoctrinated is always predictable. You only know how to repeat the talking points from the authorities you have accepted, and when you are pressed or questioned at all on those beliefs beyond that, you fold and resort to logically fallacies and dismissals of the nonbelievers.
So if you actually wanted to surprise me, you'd form a coherent argument that wasn't based in every logical fallacy you can think of like the ink guy. And you'd be able to understand basic words like "voluntary" rather than pretending they have other meanings to make the claims like the Auburn fan.
quote:
you've made this abundantly clear lol
If you understood basic civics you'd also wonder why the government is getting involved in these things when they clearly are not supposed to. It's an assault on liberty in the guise of social justice.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 12:50 pm to 3down10
aight
Posted on 4/25/25 at 12:51 pm to 3down10
quote:
The NCAA is private organization
Not really, its a collection of mostly federally funded schools.
Amateurism was fine until the University administrators decided to personally enrich themselves off the sport. There shouldnt be mega TV deals and super conferences. There should only be the bare minimum commercial time to cover broadcast expenses. The schools shouldnt be nickeling and diming the fans at every turn. Logos should be public domain. Tickets should be sold first come first serve, not in huge blocks to corporations.
You cant make the entire sport about profit...then turn around and claim the players must be amateurs. It was the greed of the schools that ruined the sport.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 1:17 pm to scottydoesntknow
quote:
Not really, its a collection of mostly federally funded schools.
The public school angle has a little merit, however the authority should be to make the schools leave the NCAA, rather than the courts telling the NCAA which is itself a private organization, what to do.
quote:
Amateurism was fine until the University administrators decided to personally enrich themselves off the sport. There shouldnt be mega TV deals and super conferences. There should only be the bare minimum commercial time to cover broadcast expenses. The schools shouldnt be nickeling and diming the fans at every turn. Logos should be public domain. Tickets should be sold first come first serve, not in huge blocks to corporations.
This is just a social justice argument. None of what you are saying is illegal, and it's all a matter of your opinion on how things should be. You don't demonstrate a victim, just a distaste for how they argument.
That's not a legitimate argument to take away the freedoms and liberties of others. You don't get to tell people what to do because you think you are more moral than they are.
But I'll address what you say anyway.
How are the administrators enriching themselves? Do they get a % of the money or something? It's my understanding all the money generated goes back into the programs and sports. Most schools are in the red when it comes to sports, including football and are only able to operate based on donations. The schools that are lucky enough to have extra after a sport like football put that money into other sports. So how is that enriching themselves?
TV deals and super conferences are just your personal beef, and not even close to being relevant. I might agree that it sucks, but it's hardly justification for removing the rights of a private entity.
Crying about commercial time? Seriously guy? You do realize that's up to the broadcasting stations right?
If they are charging too much, don't go. See how liberty works?
Logos have to be protected because of the things people will do with them elsewhere, usually for shady reasons. And if you don't defend the trademark, you will lose it. I'm not a lawyer, but I do know a little about logo trademark laws and their purpose from work. The crazy thing is that if you actually just ask for permission, most places will give it. But if you don't ask and they don't do anything about it, they can lose their trademark. So, if you need to use a logo, just ask. If you're wanting to make a business using it, well of course you should get a license.
And selling tickets is again a matter of don't go. That's how liberty and the free market works. If you don't like something, then don't go. It's not justification for taking away their freedom.
Your entire argument is basically that it's ok because these things make you mad? That is ridiculous.
quote:
You cant make the entire sport about profit...then turn around and claim the players must be amateurs. It was the greed of the schools that ruined the sport.
Yes, you can. Once again the argument against freedom is fear of what someone else might do with it. It's a voluntary system.
The sport was fine until the government and social justice warriors got involved and started taking away the freedoms of private entities. Now we have an NCAA that isn't allowed to enforce basic standards.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 1:22 pm to 3down10
you sure do have a lot of time on your hands that you can dedicate to being mad online
Posted on 4/25/25 at 1:26 pm to TheSandman
quote:
you sure do have a lot of time on your hands that you can dedicate to being mad online
If you spent as much time learning basic civics as you do worrying about me, you might be able to form an intelligent response.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 1:28 pm to TheSandman
Hey Sandman, let’s start a contest!
Let’s see who can respond to 3down10, and get him to write more of his nut job responses. Whomever gets him to write the most words wins,……bonus points for number of times he writes “voluntary” or “indoctrinated”.
Let’s see who can respond to 3down10, and get him to write more of his nut job responses. Whomever gets him to write the most words wins,……bonus points for number of times he writes “voluntary” or “indoctrinated”.
This post was edited on 4/25/25 at 1:30 pm
Posted on 4/25/25 at 1:45 pm to FlyDownTheField83
i am down for this mainly bc the more he posts, the more ai models get ruined
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:00 pm to FlyDownTheField83
quote:
Hey Sandman, let’s start a contest!
Let’s see who can respond to 3down10, and get him to write more of his nut job responses. Whomever gets him to write the most words wins,……bonus points for number of times he writes “voluntary” or “indoctrinated”.
quote:
The behavior of the indoctrinated is always predictable. You only know how to repeat the talking points from the authorities you have accepted, and when you are pressed or questioned at all on those beliefs beyond that, you fold and resort to logically fallacies and dismissals of the nonbelievers.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:01 pm to TheSandman
quote:
i am down for this mainly bc the more he posts, the more ai models get ruined
This is probably the most intelligent thing you've ever said in your life and I doubt you even remotely know why.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:07 pm to 3down10
quote:
None of what you are saying is illegal
On 8 August 2014 in the Ed O’Bannon versus NCAA lawsuit over NIL the court found the NCAA was in violation of antitrust laws (said it was illegal), in 2015 the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals affirmed most of the district court ruling (said it was illegal), and in 2016 the US Supreme Court refused to take up this case indicating that the lower courts rulings were correct (said it was illegal).
3down10 your long standing background in filibustery and nonsensesagation is very impressive. However, I will take the fact that rejected appeals up to the US Supreme Court mean that you are LYING when you say the NCAA has not broken the law.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:16 pm to 3down10
quote:
This is just a social justice argument. None of what you are saying is illegal
No, the left doesnt own the concept of fairness. If you inherit an amateur sport(which you did nothing to create or build up) and turn it into a personal cash cow, there will be consequences. It is fair to reap the consequences of actions, which the schools and programs are currently doing.
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That's not a legitimate argument to take away the freedoms and liberties of others. You don't get to tell people what to do because you think you are more moral than they are.
Not sure what you are getting at. Whose liberties am I infringing upon?
quote:
How are the administrators enriching themselves?
Massive pay raises, extra money to use to spend, more money to fund a bloated payroll of unnecessary people. Having money to spend and exclusive control over a massive brand also gives you power that you wouldnt otherwise have.
There is a LOT of money that is skimmed off the top in athletics.
quote:
It's my understanding all the money generated goes back into the programs and sports
you have a misunderstanding
quote:
Most schools are in the red when it comes to sports, including football and are only able to operate based on donations.
Most of these programs are poorly run financially and drunk on the huge flow of cash. I made the mistake of looking up salaries for UA AD salaries one time. Secretaries making six figure salaries, old strength coaches that can barely manage a swimming team...making half a million dollars. Ive worked in multiple ADs...the waste is extraordinary.
quote:
TV deals and super conferences are just your personal beef, and not even close to being relevant. I might agree that it sucks, but it's hardly justification for removing the rights of a private entity.
A collection of taxpayer funded schools is not a private entity you fricking idiot. If it was, federal judges wouldnt be currently making all the rules. You can say the NCAA is a private entity 1000 times, the court cases say otherwise.
quote:
Crying about commercial time? Seriously guy? You do realize that's up to the broadcasting stations right?
How stupid are you? You do realize that TV commercial time is something that is negotiated. The broadcasters will always want more commercial time, therefore the total commercial time is what the schools say they are willing to allow.
quote:
And selling tickets is again a matter of don't go. That's how liberty and the free market works. If you don't like something, then don't go. It's not justification for taking away their freedom.
You are stating the most obvious things possible and acting like you are Einstein. This argument we are having...ive already won...years ago. The courts ruled, its over. Yes, there is consequences to greed
quote:
Your entire argument is basically that it's ok because these things make you mad? That is ridiculous.
What on earth are you babbling about? Are you high? My argument is that there are consequences to taking a sport that was built on amateurism, community and tradition...and turning it into a profit machine.
quote:
Yes, you can. Once again the argument against freedom is fear of what someone else might do with it. It's a voluntary system.
The courts already ruled, NIL is already here. Have you been living under a rock? What do you mean yes you can, no the courts said, no you cant. Whose freedom is being infringed? How high are you?
quote:
The sport was fine until the government and social justice warriors got involved and started taking away the freedoms of private entities. Now we have an NCAA that isn't allowed to enforce basic standards.
The University of Alabama is not a private entity. LSU is not a private entity. Ohio State...not a private entity. Even the NCAA doesnt claim they are a private entity.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:22 pm to FlyDownTheField83
quote:
On 8 August 2014 in the Ed O’Bannon versus NCAA lawsuit over NIL the court found the NCAA was in violation of antitrust laws (said it was illegal), in 2015 the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals affirmed most of the district court ruling (said it was illegal), and in 2016 the US Supreme Court refused to take up this case indicating that the lower courts rulings were correct (said it was illegal).
3down10 your long standing background in filibustery and nonsensesagation is very impressive. However, I will take the fact that rejected appeals up to the US Supreme Court mean that you are LYING when you say the NCAA has not broken the law.
This is an appeal to authority logical fallacy. It's only a matter of time before it's overturned, just like other unjust rulings have been such as Roe vs Wade, slavery, etc. What matters in these cases is often the arguments, and who has been bought.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:28 pm to 3down10
Wrong. “Appeal to Authority “ as a fallacy is typically reference to one person as an authority figure making a claim. In this case there was the district court, the court of appeals and the Supreme Court that agreed with the result.
You have said some dumb things, but for you to say “It’s only a matter of time until it’s overturned “ on a case that has been considered up to the Supreme Court shows a level of ignorance that is hilarious.
You have said some dumb things, but for you to say “It’s only a matter of time until it’s overturned “ on a case that has been considered up to the Supreme Court shows a level of ignorance that is hilarious.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:30 pm to 03 West CoChamps
quote:
This settlement will get blown up within the next 12 months and it will all start again.
Exactly.
The only point of this settlement is to get a framework that Congress can use for legislation. That is when this ends, when Congress changes the rules around employees to allow college football to have its cake and eat it too.
In trade Congress will likely ask for three things:
1. That many states are represented in the future superconference the legislation will defacto build. The fantasies where its just the Big 10 as is and the SEC as is won't have the political capital needed, those two conferences will need the votes of senators from the states covered by the Big 12, the ACC and maybe even the rebuilt PAC to get the legislation pushed through. The superconference will have around 70 programs in it at the end of the day, and some of those will be subsidized by the larger programs.
2. Women's sports are protected on the funding side, and given a dedicated percentage of the eventually salary cap that is higher than ADs would willingly give (get ready for like 10-15% for women).
3. Some sort of funding towards an apparatus to provide ongoing healthcare to players and former players not tied to their salaries (aka just more the ADs have to spend, not carve outs of the salary cap).
And college football as a whole will be happy to make these changes, because the House ruling was only giving players 22% of all revenues compared to 48% in the NFL.
If Congress doesn't act and this all gets collective bargained instead the number will get much closer to the NFL number and college football will have to be divorced from ADs to save all other college sports.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:48 pm to scottydoesntknow
quote:
No, the left doesnt own the concept of fairness. If you inherit an amateur sport(which you did nothing to create or build up) and turn it into a personal cash cow, there will be consequences. It is fair to reap the consequences of actions, which the schools and programs are currently doing.
I have no idea which puppets you vote for, you're a social justice warrior because of what you support, which is taking away the freedoms of others in the name of social justice.
quote:
Not sure what you are getting at. Whose liberties am I infringing upon?
You are saying the NCAA doesn't have a right to form it's own standards as it see's fit. And you do so under the guise of social justice.
quote:
Massive pay raises, extra money to use to spend, more money to fund a bloated payroll of unnecessary people. Having money to spend and exclusive control over a massive brand also gives you power that you wouldnt otherwise have.
There is a LOT of money that is skimmed off the top in athletics.
Once again, these are just your social justice warrior arguments. You believe that anyone who doesn't act in the manner you see fit should have their rights removed and they should be forced to your will.
It's always the same pattern, arguments against freedom always revolve around the fear of what others might do with theirs. You don't like how the NCAA uses their freedom, so you believe that gives you the right to take away theirs and force them to behavior as you see fit.
That's not how freedom works. You deny it to others, and you won't get it either. On the road to hell.
quote:
you have a misunderstanding
Most of these programs are poorly run financially and drunk on the huge flow of cash. I made the mistake of looking up salaries for UA AD salaries one time. Secretaries making six figure salaries, old strength coaches that can barely manage a swimming team...making half a million dollars. Ive worked in multiple ADs...the waste is extraordinary.
Again, more social justice warrior bullshite. None of this is justification for taking away the rights of the NCAA. These are not your decisions to make. Deciding how much people should make is communism.
quote:
A collection of taxpayer funded schools is not a private entity you fricking idiot. If it was, federal judges wouldnt be currently making all the rules. You can say the NCAA is a private entity 1000 times, the court cases say otherwise.
The NCAA is a private organization. Some of it's members are public schools. They surely aren't completely tax payer funded, and the parts we are talking about have very little if any tax payer funding.
If the NCAA wasn't a private organization they would have things like subpoena power and they could actually investigate things etc. They lack all these powers because they are a private organization.
quote:
How stupid are you? You do realize that TV commercial time is something that is negotiated. The broadcasters will always want more commercial time, therefore the total commercial time is what the schools say they are willing to allow.
The broadcasters put as many ads in as they can sell and/or they believe people will put up with. What broadcasters really want are tight windows for the games so they can keep up with a schedule.
At best they may negotiate things like tv timeouts to ensure they can make a minimum and also to help meet a window if needed to extend.
Still, none of this is a basis for taking away the basic rights of a private entity and regulating them.
quote:
You are stating the most obvious things possible and acting like you are Einstein. This argument we are having...ive already won...years ago. The courts ruled, its over. Yes, there is consequences to greed
Again, after the social justice warrior era is over, it will get overturned. It's not the first time the courts have made bad decisions, it won't be the last.
This is just an appeal to authority logical fallacy as I've pointed out previously, argue the merits.
quote:
What on earth are you babbling about? Are you high? My argument is that there are consequences to taking a sport that was built on amateurism, community and tradition...and turning it into a profit machine.
Yes, your argument is a social justice warrior argument. Because you don't think something is fair, you believe that gives you the power and right to take away the rights of those involved, even when the transactions and experience are completely voluntary.
You are a bad person in my book.
quote:
The courts already ruled, NIL is already here. Have you been living under a rock? What do you mean yes you can, no the courts said, no you cant. Whose freedom is being infringed? How high are you?
The NCAA operated just fine for over 100 years doing it. It's only been in the last 5 years that the courts have been involved, and the sports are falling apart as a result.
People have a right to form organizations and come to agreement on a set of standards in order to create a product/service. Just because you do not like how the organization runs does not give you the right to interfere with them.
You're taking away everyone's freedom.
quote:
The University of Alabama is not a private entity. LSU is not a private entity. Ohio State...not a private entity. Even the NCAA doesnt claim they are a private entity.
The ruling doesn't apply to only public schools.
If they ruled the public schools could not join the NCAA or any other organization that limited NIL, that would be fine. But that's not how they ruled.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 2:54 pm to FlyDownTheField83
quote:
Wrong. “Appeal to Authority “ as a fallacy is typically reference to one person as an authority figure making a claim. In this case there was the district court, the court of appeals and the Supreme Court that agreed with the result.
You aren't making a real argument, you're just naming an authorities opinion/ruling and saying because they are the authority, there is no argument against it.
That is a logical fallacy.
quote:
You have said some dumb things, but for you to say “It’s only a matter of time until it’s overturned “ on a case that has been considered up to the Supreme Court shows a level of ignorance that is hilarious.
Happens all the time. As I mentioned, the recent and most famous example is Roe vs Wade.
It's happens about once a year. The last time was 2024, which overruled a 1984 decision.
In 2022, There was the famous Roe vs Wade which overturned not 1 previous ruling, but 2.
In 2021, a 1989 ruling was overturned.
In 2020, a 1972 ruling was overturned.
4 different rulings were overturned in 2019, all over the supreme court from the 80s(and one from 1979).
3 in 2018.
etc.
But yeah, I'm the one showing a level of ignorance that's hilarious.
This post was edited on 4/25/25 at 2:59 pm
Posted on 4/25/25 at 3:18 pm to 3down10
quote:
3down10
cool good luck with that
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