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Does it really take that much time to build your program?
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:11 pm
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:11 pm
Or do you basically know what you have in a coach within 3 years?
Noticed something looking at the SEC streak from from 06-12/13*
Every coach that won or played for a NC in that 8 yr stretch did so at least within their first 3 years as the HC. Some did after also but they all did right off the bat
06. UF. Meyer. 2nd year
07. LSU. Miles. 3rd year
08. UF. Meyer. 4th year*
09. UA. Saban. 3rd year
10. AU. Chizik. 2nd year
11. UA. Saban. 5th year*
12. UA. Saban. 6th year*
13*. AU. Malzan. 1st year
- last SEC team in NC game
Saban did take 4 years at LSU in 03, but he won the SEC and had a top recruiting class in 01.
- Richt has been steady but hasn't
Improved upon his early success at
UGA (last SEC title 05?) still what
We knew he was within a few
years
- chizik flashed then burned (knew
Who he really was by yr 3)
- Malzan might be following chizik
- Meyer was losing his team after 09
But we still saw his potential within
3 yrs
- miles best 3 yr stretch was 05-07
Followed closely by 10-13, might
Be in another great stretch now.
- saban has always been saban but
Doesn't have bama quite as pretty
As that 09-2012 dominance at the
Moment
- ole ball coach at USC was solid
for a good little stretch but is tailing
off obviously
Basically what I'm getting at is what recent coach has slowly and steadily built his program to excellence, or basically trended up not down over the long haul? It seems to me you know what you have by yr 3
And all of those coaches listed besides miles went to their programs coming off of bad years that got their predecessors fired: for when people talk about it taking time to turn around bad programs. Maybe that's why they are "bad programs," they will never win anything.
And yes this question came to me in the "freeze is the next saban" thread. Don't want to start that thread over again bc this is freeze' make or break year I guess (4th yr) so I won't argue that one
Noticed something looking at the SEC streak from from 06-12/13*
Every coach that won or played for a NC in that 8 yr stretch did so at least within their first 3 years as the HC. Some did after also but they all did right off the bat
06. UF. Meyer. 2nd year
07. LSU. Miles. 3rd year
08. UF. Meyer. 4th year*
09. UA. Saban. 3rd year
10. AU. Chizik. 2nd year
11. UA. Saban. 5th year*
12. UA. Saban. 6th year*
13*. AU. Malzan. 1st year
- last SEC team in NC game
Saban did take 4 years at LSU in 03, but he won the SEC and had a top recruiting class in 01.
- Richt has been steady but hasn't
Improved upon his early success at
UGA (last SEC title 05?) still what
We knew he was within a few
years
- chizik flashed then burned (knew
Who he really was by yr 3)
- Malzan might be following chizik
- Meyer was losing his team after 09
But we still saw his potential within
3 yrs
- miles best 3 yr stretch was 05-07
Followed closely by 10-13, might
Be in another great stretch now.
- saban has always been saban but
Doesn't have bama quite as pretty
As that 09-2012 dominance at the
Moment
- ole ball coach at USC was solid
for a good little stretch but is tailing
off obviously
Basically what I'm getting at is what recent coach has slowly and steadily built his program to excellence, or basically trended up not down over the long haul? It seems to me you know what you have by yr 3
And all of those coaches listed besides miles went to their programs coming off of bad years that got their predecessors fired: for when people talk about it taking time to turn around bad programs. Maybe that's why they are "bad programs," they will never win anything.
And yes this question came to me in the "freeze is the next saban" thread. Don't want to start that thread over again bc this is freeze' make or break year I guess (4th yr) so I won't argue that one
This post was edited on 9/21/15 at 10:12 pm
7
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:13 pm to Lsuchs
Depends on where you are coaching
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:13 pm to Lsuchs
quote:
Does it really take that much time to build your program?
Or do you basically know what you have in a coach within 3 years?
It all depends on what you're inheriting. It's always going to be easier to build something at a program that has had previous success, even if they're coming off "down years".
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:16 pm to Lsuchs
Thing about Freeze is he has won more games EACH year he has been at OM. So as long as that number keeps going up no can really say much negative about him.
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:18 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
It's always going to be easier to build something at a program that has had previous success, even if they're coming off "down years".
Every program has had some level of previous success.
When has a program become a top SEC program where it took the coach 5+ years to have success?
Lsu was hot garbage in the 90s it took saban 2 yrs to win the SEC. And 2 of our 3 NCs have come since then, 4 SEC championships, and 1 of our 2 perfect seasons. It's not like we were world beaters before.
It just seems like if you are going to be great, it won't take you long to find out.
This post was edited on 9/21/15 at 10:51 pm
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:31 pm to Lsuchs
If the question you are asking is: "Will Georgia win a SEC Title or National Title"...
the answer to both is no
the answer to both is no
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:41 pm to Jimmy Johns
You can add vandys old coach to your list. He didn't win a NC but what he did was impressive and in a short amount of time.
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:43 pm to Jimmy Johns
Guess that's why lew is so mad
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:44 pm to Lsuchs
Sumlin has built nothing but a hype machine
Same with Butch
Bert has a track w/no horses
Same with Gus
Freeze is the best OM could hope for
Too early on the others
Same with Butch
Bert has a track w/no horses
Same with Gus
Freeze is the best OM could hope for
Too early on the others
This post was edited on 9/21/15 at 10:45 pm
Posted on 9/21/15 at 10:46 pm to Lsuchs
Tennessee is moving into decade number in their rebuilding.
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:16 pm to Lsuchs
I think if the program is really down, yes.
But most of those programs were not terrible when taken over. If you are like Tennessee, Miami, Nebraska, Michigan have been for years of bad coaching it takes more time.
Florida for example, shouldn't take more than two years. Florida was down under Muschamp, but recruited very well. If Mac hasn't done it in 3 years then it may be time to go. Miami, it needs a complete over haul. Nebraska needs a completely new recruiting strategy. Michigan needs a new recruiting strategy.
So yea...depends on the program.
But most of those programs were not terrible when taken over. If you are like Tennessee, Miami, Nebraska, Michigan have been for years of bad coaching it takes more time.
Florida for example, shouldn't take more than two years. Florida was down under Muschamp, but recruited very well. If Mac hasn't done it in 3 years then it may be time to go. Miami, it needs a complete over haul. Nebraska needs a completely new recruiting strategy. Michigan needs a new recruiting strategy.
So yea...depends on the program.
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:19 pm to Lsuchs
State has to develop players to be competitive in the SEC. Hard to get a guy like Fournette for instance. Also having 2 SEC programs in one of the least populated states makes the number of quality players limited. If there were only one SEC school in MS it would run house in the SEC
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:22 pm to Jma313
You guys could monopolize that state with a culture change.
You choose the hard road every time you allow cowbells into your stadium.
You choose the hard road every time you allow cowbells into your stadium.
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:23 pm to Jma313
quote:
If there were only one SEC school in MS it would run house in the SEC
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:25 pm to white beans
quote:
You guys could monopolize that state with a culture change.
MS and LA are that different culturally? Go on....
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:28 pm to white beans
quote:
Sumlin has built nothing but a hype machine
And here we go. Our biggest setback our first year in the SEC was that we had a horrible kicker. The only games we lost were by single digits. Hell our kicker missed an extra point against Bama.
Posted on 9/21/15 at 11:36 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
BluegrassBelle
Oh Oh I know I know (rasing hand in class) the answer is what Belle said....Vandy though did change quickly under Franklin..a good recruiter helps. Stoops will get program even better and if UK will pay him his worth, look out.
Butchy is a year away perhaps. McElwain has UF feeling good with the philosophy change on offense and it doesnt hurt to inherit the best defense in the country.
Posted on 9/22/15 at 8:28 am to Jma313
(no message)
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