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re: St Louis going crazy tonight and its on live TV...
Posted on 8/11/14 at 12:25 pm to BarberitosDawg
Posted on 8/11/14 at 12:25 pm to BarberitosDawg
Here is what it sounds like to me happened from reading the various accounts.
1. Dude is walking down the middle of a street with his buddy.
2. Cop is driving down the street and tells him he needs to walk on the sidewalk, not in the middle of the road.
3. Dude argues with cop, cop starts to get out of car, dude attacks him. The fact a shot was fired from inside the cop car seems to back this up pretty clearly and witnesses also say there was a struggle INSIDE the cop car. Additionally, I believe the dude went for the cops gun if he forced his way into the cop car which is pretty much not in dispute considering witnesses agree to the struggle within the car.
4. Dude was unable the take the cops gun from him. At the point of the struggle inside the car, it is a life and death situation and the cop should most definitely try to shoot the person attacking him inside his car.
5. Dude didn't manage to get the gun and starts running. Cop has already fired once inside the car and steps out and fires at the fleeing dude who just attacked and essentially tried to kill him when he went for the gun.
6. Dude is shot fleeing and tries to surrender.
7. Cop continues to fire, finishing the job.
If 1-7 are essentially correct, I think the cop was justified in shooting and killing the person that attacked him and went after his gun. However, I think the cop should definitely be fired and do some jail time as well because he overreacted when he continued to fire after he had shot the fleeing dude once (totally justified) and dude tried to surrender. A cop must be held accountable for a gross overreaction which shooting an unarmed attacker multiple times in the back who was fleeing then tried to surrender definitely is.
That is my take based on what has been reported so far. End of day, dude deserved to be shot for instigating an attack and potential life or death struggle, but cop deserves to be held accountable for a gross overreaction after neutralizing the threat.
1. Dude is walking down the middle of a street with his buddy.
2. Cop is driving down the street and tells him he needs to walk on the sidewalk, not in the middle of the road.
3. Dude argues with cop, cop starts to get out of car, dude attacks him. The fact a shot was fired from inside the cop car seems to back this up pretty clearly and witnesses also say there was a struggle INSIDE the cop car. Additionally, I believe the dude went for the cops gun if he forced his way into the cop car which is pretty much not in dispute considering witnesses agree to the struggle within the car.
4. Dude was unable the take the cops gun from him. At the point of the struggle inside the car, it is a life and death situation and the cop should most definitely try to shoot the person attacking him inside his car.
5. Dude didn't manage to get the gun and starts running. Cop has already fired once inside the car and steps out and fires at the fleeing dude who just attacked and essentially tried to kill him when he went for the gun.
6. Dude is shot fleeing and tries to surrender.
7. Cop continues to fire, finishing the job.
If 1-7 are essentially correct, I think the cop was justified in shooting and killing the person that attacked him and went after his gun. However, I think the cop should definitely be fired and do some jail time as well because he overreacted when he continued to fire after he had shot the fleeing dude once (totally justified) and dude tried to surrender. A cop must be held accountable for a gross overreaction which shooting an unarmed attacker multiple times in the back who was fleeing then tried to surrender definitely is.
That is my take based on what has been reported so far. End of day, dude deserved to be shot for instigating an attack and potential life or death struggle, but cop deserves to be held accountable for a gross overreaction after neutralizing the threat.
2
Posted on 8/11/14 at 1:42 pm to BarberitosDawg
quote:
That's a pretty shitty area and you can imagine the police officers it attracts aren't much better than the indigenous population reminiscent of Miami in the 80's.
Yes and no. There is actually an historic part of Ferguson that's pretty cool. Have gone there, kids have played games there, day and night, with no problems. Certainly doesn't mean there aren't thugs there. Obviously there are, but I'd also suggest that many of the looters came from outside of the Ferguson area. Would like to see where the ones arrested came from.
quote:
It's probably a war zone 24/7 and as soon as a good officer can attract a better offer somewhere else he's 'outa there before his has badge can hit the ground.
Not a war zone 24/7 but yes, as soon as a police officer can get a job in West County somewhere, he'll probably jump on it, where a majority of time is just spent writing traffic tickets. Can't blame them for that.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:01 pm to reedus23
I was surprised by the change in racial demographics in Ferguson in just the last decade.
2000 census, basically 50/50 white/black. 2012 - it's now more like 25/75 white/black.
2000 census, basically 50/50 white/black. 2012 - it's now more like 25/75 white/black.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:10 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Tiger n Miami AU83
Had written out what eye witnesses are apparently saying but figured it was useless and probably premature anyways. But suffice it to say, the eye witness (other than the cop I suppose) apparently disagree that that is how it unfolded.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:11 pm to the808bass
quote:
I was surprised by the change in racial demographics in Ferguson in just the last decade.
I was surprised by the demographics as well.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:15 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
The police are lying.
There was no struggle for the officers gun.
A good man was shot for no reason other than racial hate.
I know officers in that area and every one of them is racist, and not shy about it either.
There was no struggle for the officers gun.
A good man was shot for no reason other than racial hate.
I know officers in that area and every one of them is racist, and not shy about it either.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:17 pm to Sleeping Tiger
Did the Magma tell you to say that?
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:19 pm to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
The police are lying. There was no struggle for the officers gun.
I'm leaning this way.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:22 pm to Vols&Shaft83
Yeah.. it did. So what?
If Magma makes the effort to create words, you listen.
If Magma makes the effort to create words, you listen.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:22 pm to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
A good man was shot for no reason other than racial hate.
Roll. Damn. Magma.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:25 pm to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
Yeah.. it did. So what?
If Magma makes the effort to create words, you listen.
Damn right
Posted on 8/11/14 at 2:49 pm to Sleeping Tiger
Police lying is not something that ever surprises me anymore. If that turns out to be the case, obviously my opinion changes.
Key point imo is whether dude entered cops car and initiated a struggle in the car.
Key point imo is whether dude entered cops car and initiated a struggle in the car.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 3:02 pm to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
Sleeping Tiger
I am tending to agree with you at this point ST. Too many eye witnesses apparently are discounting the police's position.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 3:08 pm to reedus23
A police badge has turned into a license to murder.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 3:08 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Key point imo is whether dude entered cops car and initiated a struggle in the car.
What if it went down like this.
Kids walking down the street. Cop stops and tells them to get on the sidewalk (which begs the question of why they have to. My kids walk down a similar street all the time. Ride their bikes/scooters/shoot hoops and what not in the street). Kids tell them they're almost "home". Cop reaches through window and grabs kid's arm as he starts to get out of car. Kid struggles to break free. Cop draws gun, fires once from within the car. Brown may or may not have been hit at that time. Kids take off. Couple more shots fired. Brown stops in middle of street 35 feet away, puts hands up and turns around and is shot again a couple more times. So there would kind of be a struggle at the car, not necessarily in it. I'm sure the cop will say he thought kid was going for his gun even if he wasn't and maybe he really did have that perception even if it was wrong.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 3:26 pm to MIZ_COU
quote:
A police badge has turned into a license to murder.
It's scary when we agree. I may spontaneously combust.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 4:07 pm to reedus23
Just saw the looting footage. fricking savages.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 4:28 pm to Rebelgator
Yup.
ETA: local cop gossip is that the cop shooter was also black. Also local cop gossip says that the perp had the Taser of the officer when he was running away.
Take it with a block of salt.
ETA: local cop gossip is that the cop shooter was also black. Also local cop gossip says that the perp had the Taser of the officer when he was running away.
Take it with a block of salt.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 5:05 pm
Posted on 8/11/14 at 4:33 pm to Rebelgator
quote:
Just saw the looting footage. fricking savages.
Yepp. And not going to end any time soon.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 4:50 pm to reedus23
Just start shooting the looters. Set up snipers all over town and take them out and be done with it.
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