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re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/13/22 at 12:26 am
4. Trump took the documents for an unknown reason (potentially as innocuous as to write a memoir) and believed (pretty reasonably) that the DOJ would not take serious steps to recover them because of the predictable massive political fallout that would result.
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re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 11:40 pm
The alternative is that you're telling me declassified documents can still be secrets not available to the public which feeds back into the point another poster was making about the search warrant's cited statutes applying to national secrets and not classified information.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 11:33 pm
quote:
Why do you think every single document Trump has in his possession haven't been FOIA-ed successfully, when the man has been under constant scrutiny by every media outlet and agency for 6 years?
Because this "standing order" was just made up today.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 11:27 pm
quote:
Don't you think that millions of documents that former presidents have declassified, especially Trump, would've been FOIA-ed if it were that easy?
Millions of declassified documents have been released to the public. Largely through FOIA requests.
You just say that's not how it works at all, but show me something that says that isn't true. Declassification removes the level of clearance needed to see a document.
Edit: Declassified Documents through FOIA Here's an example.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 11:23 pm
They've been at the site for over a year and, from Trump's own allies viewpoint, there have been discussions with the FBI about what documents need to be turned over.
Do I think Trump packed the documents himself? No. Do I think there was plenty of time for attorneys to have reviewed everything and discussed it with him afterwards to come up with a plan on keeping or returning them? Yes and by all accounts that should have happened/did happen.
And if it's just his subordinates that packed them up, that would have been the statement released - "My subordinates packed up things accidentally and they're back with the FBI". It wasn't.
Do I think Trump packed the documents himself? No. Do I think there was plenty of time for attorneys to have reviewed everything and discussed it with him afterwards to come up with a plan on keeping or returning them? Yes and by all accounts that should have happened/did happen.
And if it's just his subordinates that packed them up, that would have been the statement released - "My subordinates packed up things accidentally and they're back with the FBI". It wasn't.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:38 pm
Is there a statute that says top secret documents can't be taken to a residence by a president and retain their classification? I'm not aware of one so I'm truly interested.
The issue isn't the taking the documents from the white house, it's declassifying them.
The simple explanation would be that you keep things marked however they're marked with regards to confidentiality, then you either return them when your done with your work or you declassify them on a document-by-document basis where appropriate.
The issue isn't the taking the documents from the white house, it's declassifying them.
The simple explanation would be that you keep things marked however they're marked with regards to confidentiality, then you either return them when your done with your work or you declassify them on a document-by-document basis where appropriate.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:29 pm
quote:
How can you be astounded without knowing the content? Do you think every classified document is a list of the names and locations of assets, and the launch codes?
Because I'm astounded by the implications of a blanket declassification order. I don't believe every classified document is the names of assets or launch codes, but if this standing order as reported is accurate then if that information ever left to the residence then it was declassified at that moment.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:26 pm
So, again, you'd be totally fine if the President took home information that related to troop movement thereby making it available for all? Because it's his decision to make alone.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:25 pm
Do I think it's there on purpose? I'd hope not. Do I think a President who believed he was going to stay in office until the very end was rushed in pulling together documents to take with him and threw in some bad stuff on accident? Yeah, I could see that.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:23 pm
quote:
So…what is your point?
My point is clearly that there are plenty of secrets the President presumably shouldn't make public (e.g., our own foreign agent identities, nuclear weapons programs, etc.) A blanket declassification of anything that gets taken home seems incredibly dangerous even if it is legal.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:20 pm
I asked if it was wise or a good idea to do that. Not if it was legal to declassify any document that goes out the door. To the contrary, I said lets assume it's a perfectly legal explanation. The implications are still astounding.
As to whether a "raid" was necessary, no one will know until the affidavit underlying the search warrant is unsealed. There are plenty of fact patterns that would make it necessary and plenty that would make it unnecessary.
As to whether a "raid" was necessary, no one will know until the affidavit underlying the search warrant is unsealed. There are plenty of fact patterns that would make it necessary and plenty that would make it unnecessary.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:17 pm
THAT'S irrelevant. They never said they declassified any information they took with them. Once it's declassified there's no justification for keeping it from the public.
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:14 pm
It's not irrelevant. It's the entire statement. Why would you have a standing order to declassify information that went home with you if you did not take classified information?
re: BREAKING: Trump describes process of how he declassified documents found at Mar-a-Lago
Posted by Hahawg on 8/12/22 at 10:12 pm
If you take this defense as true and fully legal (setting aside that none of the statutes in the search warrant depend on classification), you're still cool with it? Under this approach, if he took national security information home, then it's declassified and anyone can obtain it through FOIA request. Lets say, he took home information on planned troop movement, foreign sources for intel, etc. That all became fair game for anyone to obtain as soon as it left with him because it no longer has its classification?
I get wanting the FBI to look bad or Trump not to go to jail, but how is that even remotely wise or good?
I get wanting the FBI to look bad or Trump not to go to jail, but how is that even remotely wise or good?
re: This judge just declared open season on Christians...
Posted by Hahawg on 2/4/17 at 8:16 am
You could've chosen a more subtle screenname if you wanted to incite rabble.
re: Ginsburg...how long can she last?
Posted by Hahawg on 2/2/17 at 6:58 pm
Yes, only liberals hold her in high esteem. Liberals like the late Antonin Scalia.
re: Dems refuse to even meet with Gorsuch
Posted by Hahawg on 2/2/17 at 6:52 pm
Hypothetical: Ginsburg dies with 11 months left in Trump's term. Do you want Trump to nominate a replacement? Would you want a Republican majority Senate to vote?
re: John McCain offers to fellate Australian Ambassador
Posted by Hahawg on 2/2/17 at 12:16 pm
Assuming everyone was also angry about Congress interfering with the Executive branch after the open letter to Iran two years ago.
re: Why do white liberal men have this infatuation
Posted by Hahawg on 2/1/17 at 8:23 pm
PRIME EXAMPLE: NBA reporters. They seem to almost exclusively talk about men of color.
re: How much should a Supreme Court Justice's Salary Be?
Posted by Hahawg on 1/31/17 at 7:23 pm
I suppose I could've just posted a one sentence quip instead.
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