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re: Does anyone really believe Auburn isn't dirty?
Posted on 1/23/11 at 6:58 pm to PentagonTiger
Posted on 1/23/11 at 6:58 pm to PentagonTiger
quote:
I'm all for Auburn being innocent until proven guilty, but I hear Auburn fans saying that all this dirty talk is because they won the NC and Cam was the best player. Alabama had Mark Ingram and nothing like this occurred and Texas had Vince Young and nothing like this happened.
Agreed..being on top is not the reason. It's a combination of being on top and having some VERY low hanging fruit for simpleton midgets to pick.
1
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:08 pm to tkane311
BUT IT SAYZ N ATPB THAT WE CHEET!!!!!!1
THARS 90000 PAIGZ!!!!!!!! MUST BE TROO!!
THARS 90000 PAIGZ!!!!!!!! MUST BE TROO!!
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:18 pm to PentagonTiger
quote:
I'm all for Auburn being innocent until proven guilty, but I hear Auburn fans saying that all this dirty talk is because they won the NC and Cam was the best player. Alabama had Mark Ingram and nothing like this occurred and Texas had Vince Young and nothing like this happened.
it's pretty delusional... or maybe just really wishful thinking
if you can pretend it's jealousy then you don't have to acknowledge they are probably right... but there's no reason for 95% of the people who think auburn is dirty to want to bring down auburn
it's not like this is the vintage SEC under bear bryant where there is one elite program winning NCs and a bunch of second tier competitors
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:30 pm to tkane311
quote:
What is NOT feasible at all is that Auburn is a dirty program that has been buying players for years. I'm sorry...we can agree to disagree on the feasible but anyone who honestly thinks that Auburn has been paying players for years without being caught or even investigated for 20 years, is either an idiot or completely delusional.
That doesn't really make sense. The NCAA does not do a good job of policing things. I'm sure a lot of schools have been paying players for 20 years and haven't been caught.
I think Auburn is dumb to have Pat Dye associated with the program. After the Eric Ramsey stuff they should not have let him back anywhere near the team. It is amazing that they named a field after the guy.
The Ed Bradley piece on CBS was pretty telling LINK. The stuff on not only Dye but Colonial Bank stuff is pretty interesting.
It isn't like people are just making everything up and weaving together a dream world. Pat Dye and Auburn got busted previously. Cecil Newton admitted to shopping his son. The conspiracy theory guys are over the top, however anyone who thinks Auburn doesn't have any players who have received money is probably the naive one.
I bet every team in the SEC has players that have taken at least some money. People are digging because there seems to be more than normal activity at Auburn. The NCAA will never stop hundred dollar handshakes but payments of 100k+ and parents shopping their kids are slightly stronger charges. I believe this will play out similar to the Alabama and USC cases eventually but I'm just guessing based on how corrupt college recruiting is.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:36 pm to molsusports
quote:
if you can pretend it's jealousy
No one is pretending it's jealousy.It IS jealousy. Jealousy is as human as hunger or sexual attraction. If you give a shite about college football, you are jealous of Auburn's National Championship to some degree. You may be over the top jealous enough to spend thousands of hours stringing together an impossible list of opinions pointing to an impossible conclusion or you may just wish that your team had won the national championship instead of Auburn. Either way, if you aren't Auburn, you are jealous to some degree.
Do you think that other conferences are jealous of and tired of hearing of the SEC? Duh.
When Alabama won last year, I was sick to my stomach about it. I didn't recognize it for what it was at the time (jealousy) but it certainly was. I wanted Auburn winning last year too and not only did I not get to see it, but I had to watch our most hated rival beat Auburn at the last second and go on to win it. It was tough...and if I could have hung my hat on anything to suggest that cheating might have occurred...I probably would have. "Cecil tried to sell Cam...was refused by MSU, then he went to Auburn" is such an easy concept to hang your hat on, the ESPN "tainted" poll really isn't surprising at all. So easy that even as time goes on and no evidence surfaces...even with the FBI involved...those that are jealous will still hang their hat on this without acknowledging the increasing (as time goes on with no evidence) possibility that it might not have happened.
It is easier than losing, and easier than admitted jealousy.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:45 pm to tkane311
quote:
No one is pretending it's jealousy.It IS jealousy. Jealousy is as human as hunger or sexual attraction. If you give a shite about college football, you are jealous of Auburn's National Championship to some degree. You may be over the top jealous enough to spend thousands of hours stringing together an impossible list of opinions pointing to an impossible conclusion or you may just wish that your team had won the national championship instead of Auburn. Either way, if you aren't Auburn, you are jealous to some degree. Do you think that other conferences are jealous of and tired of hearing of the SEC? Duh.
Why isn't there an outcry every year? If jealousy pushed fans towards this behavior, then logically I would assume that a giant public bashing would occur every year. This has never happened before to a champion. Alabama wins and they go nuts about Saban. Florida wins and Tebow is king of the world. Texas wins and it is all about VY and not about jealousy. With the evidence we do have people feel that Auburn shouldn't have been able to play with a guy who's father shopped him around and may have received payment.
People also have thrown Ohio State under the bus this year and they've become known as a team that can't win the big game against elite teams. Ohio State is a good program but people aren't stomping them due to jealousy.
Pat Dye was busted in the past and shouldn't be near a college program. Cecil Newton asked for money. Based on those two facts I would be concerned. If Logan Young (dead) was associated with Alabama still, then I'd be worried about everything we did. I don't really care if Auburn did it or not but if you gave me a million dollars for a correct guess, then I'd guess that they paid Cam and other players. College athletics is dirty and we all know it.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:48 pm to tkane311
Heýyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy you guys!!!
Stage dir. Huge pitcher of red fluid with smiley face breaks thru fake brick wall scaring small children.
Stage dir. Huge pitcher of red fluid with smiley face breaks thru fake brick wall scaring small children.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 7:58 pm to arwicklu
quote:
I'm sure a lot of schools have been paying players for 20 years and haven't been caught.
You are sure? Well, if you are willing to believe that this has happened with Auburn, then why not. If it is a 100 players over the last 20 years with Auburn, 325 peripheral family members and 75 or so coaches...that's 500 people. Let's say, only another 9 schools (10 total) have engaged in an enduring, comprehensive pay for play scheme as you are suggesting that Auburn has. That is 5,000 people. Let's say that it is 4 transactions per player. 20,000 transactions. Yet Reggie Bush is the only guy that gets caught and he was paid by a courting agent?
Does it not occur to you how unfrickingbelievably unlikely this is???
Again, I'm not going to sit here and say that I know Auburn didn't pay Cam. I DON'T know. It is feasible. It is also feasible that you are a drag queen hermaphrodite. Like the Cam situation, there isn't any evidence so I will assume that you are not. Don't tell me I'M delusional for not thinking a comprehensive long-standing pay for play scheme exists at Auburn.
So what evidence from the Ed Bradley piece did the NCAA latch onto and sanction Auburn with? Oh that's right...nothing
quote:
t isn't like people are just making everything up and weaving together a dream world
You defined that entire thread...except they weren't making things up. They were stringing unrelated things together though to form a dream world composite picture. They just forgot to do the feasible reality check on the composite though.
Example. I don't like you because you make more money than me and always seem to get promotions while I am left behind. I am sure there is something decidedly wrong with you so I follow you to see what it is. I see you with a nice young lady...she is much younger than you and buy her a backpack so I presume she is your daughter...you then go to a hotel room and come out 3 hours later looking disheveled. I presume you are engaged in an incestuous relationship. Then you go to Victoria's Secret and buy some lingerie for your young companion...I see you walk behind the counter and grab something and the girls behind the counter smile at you in recognition...I presume you are the manager. I read 2 days later that the manager of a local lingerie store was arrested for sexual harassment.
I think "of course, he was raping his daughter". If I didn't like you and WANTED to hate you, that is exactly what I would think...I wouldn't stop to examine the flaws in my chained together theory...I would believe because what I believe is my choice.
This is the logic of the Blue Tuna thread and the treatment that Auburn is getting. Most of you want so badly for Auburn to be beaten with a cow prod, that you won't ever acknowledge that you were wrong in rationale or that you are wrong to want it to be truth. This is the lifeblood to the conspiracy theory.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:05 pm to arwicklu
I apologize for my lack or brevity...I get why you wouldn't have read my entire post.
It was easy pickings...not so with other recent national championship winners.
quote:
Why isn't there an outcry every year?
quote:
"Cecil tried to sell Cam...was refused by MSU, then he went to Auburn" is such an easy concept to hang your hat on, the ESPN "tainted" poll really isn't surprising at all. So easy that even as time goes on and no evidence surfaces...even with the FBI involved...those that are jealous will still hang their hat on this without acknowledging the increasing (as time goes on with no evidence) possibility that it might not have happened.
It was easy pickings...not so with other recent national championship winners.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:18 pm to tkane311
quote:
So what evidence from the Ed Bradley piece did the NCAA latch onto and sanction Auburn with? Oh that's right...nothing
Are you joking?
The NCAA described "very serious major violations" based off exactly what the Bradley story covered.
LINK
Were you not alive in 1993?
"In a scathing introduction to its 18-page report, the committee chastised Auburn for becoming one of only three universities -- the others are Arizona State and Southern Methodist -- to have been placed on probation six times, in Auburn's case a total of 12 years on probation since 1956. Persistent Offender"
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:26 pm to arwicklu
quote:
Were you not alive in 1993?
Oh sorry...was alive but wasn't paying attention and didn't click your link until just now. I have paid attention the last 18 years though and assumed that you were talking about something that happened after the people who just became legal voting age were born.
Bama fan? Like I said, I wasn't paying close attention back then so perhaps you can educate me. Did the NCAA determine that more than frozen steaks was given to Eric Ramsey? Also, can you list the following 4 historical events in chronological order? Auburn getting busted for Eric Ramsey, Bama getting busted for textbook-gate, Bama getting busted for buying Means, the birth of Christ.
This post was edited on 1/23/11 at 8:27 pm
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:35 pm to tkane311
quote:
Oh sorry...was alive but wasn't paying attention and didn't click your link until just now. I have paid attention the last 18 years though and assumed that you were talking about something that happened after the people who just became legal voting age were born.
No.
You wrote:
"So what evidence from the Ed Bradley piece did the NCAA latch onto and sanction Auburn with? Oh that's right...nothing"
You also said:
"What is NOT feasible at all is that Auburn is a dirty program that has been buying players for years. I'm sorry...we can agree to disagree on the feasible but anyone who honestly thinks that Auburn has been paying players for years without being caught or even investigated for 20 years, is either an idiot or completely delusional."
Auburn has been investigated and caught within the last 20 years. They have been found guilty more than anyone in history except Arizona State. Your posts don't make logical sense and are not based on facts. Now you've changed the last 20 years matter to only the last 18 matter.
Auburn was caught cheating and had to fire Pat Dye within the last 20 years. He's back with the program. Do you really think it is that odd that people think that Auburn might be dirty?
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:37 pm to arwicklu
If the storm settles and we aren't handed a punishment, I am so pointing out
"Well, the situation was extensively investigated and nothing was found, we must be a squeaky clean program"
"Well, the situation was extensively investigated and nothing was found, we must be a squeaky clean program"
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:39 pm to tkane311
quote:
Also, can you list the following 4 historical events in chronological order? Auburn getting busted for Eric Ramsey, Bama getting busted for textbook-gate, Bama getting busted for buying Means, the birth of Christ.
The difference is that I'm not defending what Alabama did relative to Albert Means. I think it was wrong and we deserved to be punished. I think the textbook case wasn't a big deal, however we got punished on that as well. We broke the rules based on the NCAA investigations and we were punished. I'm not going to defend things that we did wrong. I think our program is actually better and cleaner because we did get busted. I want to win, however I don't take joy in cheating to win.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 8:43 pm to arwicklu
quote:
No one is pretending it's jealousy.It IS jealousy.
Why isn't there an outcry every year?
exactly
it's different this year and it was different well before it was clear that Auburn was going to win teh SEC or a NC
People thought the Cam stuff was dirty before there was reason to be jealous
Posted on 1/23/11 at 9:25 pm to arwicklu
quote:
Auburn has been investigated and caught within the last 20 years
True...and you can say that for how many more months? And what did they get caught for? I am not nearly as educated on this as I am the Cam thing but isn't it something like an offer for a loan and a gift of some frozen steaks but the general acknowledgment that there was more? I mean..it was bad..but it was 18 years ago.
quote:I know it...and I don't like it...but do you hear Yale boasting about all the national championships that they have won or did they quit that a few decades after it became irrelevant?
They have been found guilty more than anyone in history except Arizona State.
quote:
Your posts don't make logical sense and are not based on facts
omg....I just spit my starbucks all over my mac and had to wipe it with my silk hanky.
quote:
Now you've changed the last 20 years matter to only the last 18 matter.
Again...horribly sorry but I figured since everything takes 2 to 5 years to develop and Auburn was on probation in '93...that it happened '91 or prior.
quote:
uburn was caught cheating and had to fire Pat Dye within the last 20 years
wasn't his last year to coach in '91? I'm not going to look it up but aren't you splitting hairs between what 19 is and what 20 is and what "is" is?
quote:He's never left the program? Have the Bama fans burnt a Bear effigy and hung him from the crapstone for his cheating? He's an icon...of course not. But no, he is dead so he is not associated. But if he was alive do you think Alabama would distance themselves from him?
He's back with the program
quote:
Do you really think it is that odd that people think that Auburn might be dirty
Yes and no. I don't think it's odd because I understand jealousy and the degree to which people can jedi-mind frick themselves into believing what makes them comfortable. Yes because there is no evidence in the last (I guess) 18-19 years sufficient to even warrant an investigation of Auburn paying players...what happened before Einstein developed the theory of relativity doesn't interest me and shouldn't interest anyone else.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 9:26 pm to PentagonTiger
quote:
I'm all for Auburn being innocent until proven guilty, but I hear Auburn fans saying that all this dirty talk is because they won the NC and Cam was the best player. Alabama had Mark Ingram and nothing like this occurred and Texas had Vince Young and nothing like this happened.
You really have no idea, do you.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 9:27 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:AU fans.
Does anyone really believe Auburn isn't dirty?
Nobody else.
Posted on 1/23/11 at 9:29 pm to Roaad
Jay Jacobs = Bill Clinton
are you fricking kidding me? Cecil agreed not to attend the game but he came in after and was in the stands for Scam to hug?
it's a matter of time folks
are you fricking kidding me? Cecil agreed not to attend the game but he came in after and was in the stands for Scam to hug?
it's a matter of time folks
Posted on 1/23/11 at 9:35 pm to arwicklu
quote:
The difference is that I'm not defending what Alabama did relative to Albert Means. I think it was wrong and we deserved to be punished. I think the textbook case wasn't a big deal, however we got punished on that as well. We broke the rules based on the NCAA investigations and we were punished. I'm not going to defend things that we did wrong. I think our program is actually better and cleaner because we did get busted. I want to win, however I don't take joy in cheating to win.
My point is this. Do you really want the standard of jumping to conclusions+automatic convictions in the court of public opinion to be....recent trouble? Because it seems to me that this is the last thing a Bama fan would want....I mean, you are really swinging for the fences with this one.
I think very few of us would take joy in championships aided by cheating. Believe me, I have said it repeatedly that it IS feasible and I would be unpleasantly surprised but not shocked if it comes to light that some Auburn booster did pay Cecil. If this does happen, my fond memories of this season are pretty much shot to hell and I would personally throw gasoline on that championship banner and call for everyone involved to be ousted permanently. But the more time ticks away, the more it appears that this will never happen...which on one hand made it difficult to savor the moment, but will help the taste linger.
But even if Auburn did cheat, if Alabama is any example, you can bounce back and do it again (without cheating?) pretty quick.
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