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re: Intelligent Design Vs. Evolution
Posted on 4/9/14 at 10:46 pm to FooManChoo
Posted on 4/9/14 at 10:46 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Doubtful. Humans have a spiritual side that cannot be satisfied with a purely naturalistic view of the universe. Also, you never know what information will be discovered in the future that may invalidate the known theory of evolution.
You don't need religion to be spiritual -- Of or pertaining to God or a place of worship; sacred.
Of or pertaining to spirits; supernatural.
Consisting of spirit; not material; incorporeal.
a spiritual substance or being
Of or relating to the intellectual and higher endowments of the mind; mental; intellectual.
quote:
And over the course of its existence, Christianity has teetered from one extreme to the other in its course of heresy and reformation. I believe we're in a period of decline, not because of evolution or science, but because of the apathy of the church, itself.
It's specifically because of science that The Bible is in decline. This is a book, inspired by God, with so many mistakes morally and indefensible actions taking place. (The slaughter of the Amalekites.)
quote:
I'm not concerned in the least for the long-term prospects of the gospel message of Christ.
You really ought to -- they usually say Islam or Christianity are the fastest growing religions in the world but it's actually the rejection of faith that is.
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Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:27 pm to NATidefan
quote:I really don't think He is. In the end, I believe Christ will be victorious. While the faith is being watered down in churches in the 1st world (leading to its own demise in some respects), it is steadily growing elsewhere in the world. I'm also convinced that the end will come before the last Christian dies off.
Agreed, I never said I don't believe in a God... but your God described by the Bible may be running on borrowed time.
quote:I disagree. I believe man-made religion was invented to put some organization around the spirituality humans naturally feel. I believe that the original "religion" was the one that God revealed to Adam and Eve and eventually to others as recorded in the Bible. Other religions are a perversion of the truth.
Absolutely.. that's why religion was invented in the first place... Man needed to seek outside help.
With that said, it's not a matter of needing help, but re-prioritizing. There's a reason why the Bible says it is very difficult for a rich man to get to heaven, and it has nothing to do with money in itself. It is because those who don't feel hardship tend to look to inward rather than outward.
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:31 pm to FooManChoo
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Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:38 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
TbirdSpur2010
either get in or stay out.. I like you man.. but in this situation if you are gonna pop in and say something... come back to respond...
This post was edited on 4/9/14 at 11:39 pm
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:39 pm to NATidefan
quote:I suppose that's good to hear that some people still see the merits of the true teachings of Christ (even if it is relegated to just His moral teachings).
you should be... I'm concerned and I'm not even Christian... you may think that by not being Christian I wouldn't care, but I do. I actually care a whole hell of a lot...
quote:I get what you're saying, but, in my opinion, churches shouldn't be playing favorites with hobby horses, but should strive to reveal the entire counsel of God.
Christianity is a good religion and it teaches good morals, I don't wanna see that go away. There are a lot of dumb people out there that need moral guidance, religion provides that for them. I would like to see Churches stop focusing on evolution, homosexuality, etc.... and go back to focusing on things that truly make a person holy.
Meaning, churches who focus just on being a good person are not sufficiently teaching about who God and what He has done through Jesus. Those who focus only on alcohol or homosexuality are ignoring other important aspects of the law of God. Those who ignore the law completely and tell everyone what God loves them just the way they are and that they don't have to change a thing are ignoring what the Bible actually teaches about sanctification and the marks of a true Christian.
The church, especially in America today, has been overrun with heresy and theological feel-goodery rather than the truth of the Bible, and I believe that is assisting with the downfall of the faith in America.
Why? Because when you start making Christianity look exactly like the world but with a few more rules, eventually people will wise up and figure out that it is no different and abandon it completely for more freedom.
But Christianity is something more than feeling good while rocking out to bad covers of pop songs and sipping Starbucks while you wait for your weekly pep talk to begin. I just wish more professing Christians would take the faith more seriously.
quote:I agree. The focus has shifted dramatically in the past half century within the church in America. While "being gay is a sin" is still a valid talking point, that shouldn't be the only one. What the Bible says about origins is also important (it really does have theological significance in regards to Christ's death on the cross, which is the focal point of the religion), there's more to the Bible than just the first few chapters of Genesis.
The golden rule is being replaced with "I didn't come from a monkey" and "Being gay is a sin"... why don't we focus on what really matters...
More emphasis needs to be put on who Jesus is and what He has done for us, and then move on to what He then expects of us (such as the "golden rule") out of thankfulness to what He's done.
This post was edited on 4/9/14 at 11:52 pm
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:50 pm to StrawsDrawnAtRandom
quote:While you don't need a specific religion to be spiritual, I think a lot of people like to have an outlet for their spirituality and take a more organized approach to it. People are seeking for the truth and often try to come up with their own answers. I believe the truth exists and people can know it. It goes well beyond some intellectual "endowment", IMO. People feel it deep within themselves.
You don't need religion to be spiritual -- Of or pertaining to God or a place of worship; sacred.
Of or pertaining to spirits; supernatural.
Consisting of spirit; not material; incorporeal.
a spiritual substance or being
Of or relating to the intellectual and higher endowments of the mind; mental; intellectual.
quote:See, I disagree that it is science that is causing faith in the Bible to be in decline. I'm not a stupid person and I can think rationally and critically about things. I can see the enticing nature of the naturalistic explanation of origins through the theory of evolution. There is supposedly evidence everywhere that proves the Bible's account is false. Because I actually know what the Bible teaches, it's much harder for me to be persuaded by other arguments to the contrary.
It's specifically because of science that The Bible is in decline. This is a book, inspired by God, with so many mistakes morally and indefensible actions taking place. (The slaughter of the Amalekites.)
But the Church, today, is not teaching Christians hardly anything about the Bible. The focus is usually on some sort of legalistic (man-made) and unbiblical set of rules or a personal experience that has no bearing on the scriptures themselves. Because Christians can't defend the faith, they can't explain it and they can't rationalize it. Seemingly convincing arguments (which come in many forms, including through "science") create doubt and distrust in Christians who eventually leave the faith entirely because they don't have a firm foundation.
So I would say that it isn't science that is destroying the faith, but it is the preachers and teachers who are laying the foundation of a shallow and indefensible faith that allows many to be swayed towards one thing or another.
quote:I'm not concerned because I know how this story ends.
You really ought to -- they usually say Islam or Christianity are the fastest growing religions in the world but it's actually the rejection of faith that is.
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:51 pm to NATidefan
quote:
either get in or stay out.. I like you man.. but in this situation if you are gonna pop in and say something... come back to respond...
The frick are you talking about?
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:53 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
FooManChoo
Ok... I'm done... In 5 years I'm going to come back to this thread... and then I'll do it again in 10 years... and so forth... I hope the site carries on, and you stick around.
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:55 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
The frick are you talking about?
you came in and posted some major shite like 10 pages back, then never came back.. it's annoying.
This post was edited on 4/9/14 at 11:56 pm
Posted on 4/9/14 at 11:58 pm to NATidefan
quote:
you came in and posted some major shite like 10 pages back, then never came back.. it's annoying.
You know I keep different hours than most of y'all, right? And I answered pretty much everyone who responded to me.
What has you so annoyed?
Posted on 4/10/14 at 12:08 am to FooManChoo
quote:
I agree. The focus has shifted dramatically in the past half century within the church in America. While "being gay is a sin" is still a valid talking point, that shouldn't be the only one. What the Bible says about origins is also important (it really does have theological significance in regards to Christ's death on the cross, which is the focal point of the religion), there's more to the Bible than just the first few chapters of Genesis.
More emphasis needs to be put on who Jesus is and what He has done for us, and then move on to what He then expects of us (such as the "golden rule") out of thankfulness to what He's done.
That's the attitude more Christians need. Although, I don't think "being gay is a sin" is a valid talking point anymore... at all.
This post was edited on 4/10/14 at 12:10 am
Posted on 4/10/14 at 12:10 am to NATidefan
quote:
That's the attitude more Christians need.
Tbh, that's the attitude most Christians I've encountered already have.
Posted on 4/10/14 at 12:13 am to FooManChoo
quote:
It felt like watching Darwinian propaganda that tried to condescend to the religious people like myself by talking about spiritual connections to our DNA-relatives and gently chiding us for believing antiquated beliefs that the eye was too complex for evolution or that all life was specifically created by an intelligent designer.
I'm trying to be nice now, but you really have to be condescending to heavily religious people when it comes to evolution. You have to break it down to the most basic concepts in order for them to understand. The mere fact that you'd bring up a dog evolving into a cat makes it essential that we talk that way.
And you also have to put it in a spiritual way. I do feel spiritual being connected to all animals and knowing that we come from a common base. It helps reassure me that even after humanity is gone, we will still continue to advance in some way as a planet.
But regardless, thanks for watching it, and I can't ask much more out of you in this thread.
Posted on 4/10/14 at 12:16 am to OMLandshark
quote:
I'm trying to be nice now, but you really have to be condescending to heavily religious people when it comes to evolution. You have to break it down to the most basic concepts in order for them to understand. The mere fact that you'd bring up a dog evolving into a cat makes it essential that we talk that way.
And you also have to put it in a spiritual way. I do feel spiritual being connected to all animals and knowing that we come from a common base. It helps reassure me that even after humanity is gone, we will still continue to advance in some way as a planet.
But regardless, thanks for watching it, and I can't ask much more out of you in this thread
Bacteria to birds, bro.
Posted on 4/10/14 at 12:35 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
TbirdSpur2010
You never got back to me on your thoughts of Islamic, Muslim, Jewish, Buddhist, Satanic, and ever other religion being taught in schools alongside Christianity... which I assumed you viewed needed to be taught in schools if evolution was... let's get back to that.
Posted on 4/10/14 at 12:38 am to NATidefan
quote:
You never got back to me on your thoughts of Islamic, Muslim, Jewish, Buddhist, Satanic, and ever other religion being taught in schools alongside Christianity... which I assumed you viewed needed to be taught in schools if evolution was...
I'd have no problem with that.
ETA: Was that the only burr under your saddle?
This post was edited on 4/10/14 at 12:39 am
Posted on 4/10/14 at 1:00 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Was that the only burr under your saddle?
I don't have a burr under my saddle.. I just think if you are gonna come in make comments, you should come back...
But I'm glad you think if it's ok to teach Christianity in school then it's ok to teach Satanic views as well... Now go pitch that idea to your local PTO and I'll fly out and support you.
This post was edited on 4/10/14 at 1:05 am
Posted on 4/10/14 at 1:04 am to NATidefan
quote:
I just think if you are gonna come in make comments, you should come back...
Like I told you, I keep different hours than most of y'all and I thought I'd answered everything directed at me. Sorry you took offense, but this is really a minor thing. Happens on message boards all the time, man.
quote:
But I'm glad you think if it's ok to teach Christianity in school it's ok to teach Satanic views as well...
Like I said, I don't have a problem with it. Teach multiple sides and belief systems and put the onus on parents to guide their children through the decisions. As long as the information and perspectives are presented objectively, I have no problem.
quote:
Now go pitch that idea to you PTO and I'll fly out and support you
I don't have children
Posted on 4/10/14 at 1:09 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Like I said, I don't have a problem with it. Teach multiple sides and belief systems and put the onus on parents to guide their children through the decisions. As long as the information and perspectives are presented objectively, I have no problem.
quote:
I don't have children
Me either... but I'd rather see kid's being taught something that they can use in life versus being taught 30 plus views of religion.
Posted on 4/10/14 at 1:11 am to NATidefan
quote:
I'd rather see kid's being taught something that they can use in life versus being taught 30 plus views of religion.
Eh, you can use religion in your life, too.
You're entitled to your druthers, though, of course. As am I
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