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re: Those of you who are calling for JHC's head....
Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:35 pm to FooManChoo
Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:35 pm to FooManChoo
Wrong, at UGA the football program brings in a profit, no other sports program does. So football players have earned their right to get paid, why is this a hard concept to understand. Of course the NCAA doesnt want this to happen b/c it cuts out of their wallets.
Also, are you saying that other students can't earn a free ride like these college guys? Also all you guys want JHC off the team, yet yall want us to win a national championship? We need more players like JHC, let alone kicking them off the team. IF we did that we would have a bunch of conner norman's or that white sr wide reciever (not bennet) on our team, and yall will still be bitching about not winning national championships. You can't have both! Answer me this, what other SEC school would this even be a problem like it is at UGA? This policy is getting our program nowhere!
Also, are you saying that other students can't earn a free ride like these college guys? Also all you guys want JHC off the team, yet yall want us to win a national championship? We need more players like JHC, let alone kicking them off the team. IF we did that we would have a bunch of conner norman's or that white sr wide reciever (not bennet) on our team, and yall will still be bitching about not winning national championships. You can't have both! Answer me this, what other SEC school would this even be a problem like it is at UGA? This policy is getting our program nowhere!
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 7:41 pm
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Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:37 pm to dawgsjw
lol ok, UGA and like 3 other programs bring in a profit.
I'm talking about ALL OF COLLEGE ATHLETICS, not just UGA. Even our profits would disappear immediately if we started paying athletes.
I'm talking about ALL OF COLLEGE ATHLETICS, not just UGA. Even our profits would disappear immediately if we started paying athletes.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:40 pm to dawgsjw
Well,the players already get paid (kind of)About $1,200
a month (stipend) They also have access to Pell Grant
(5k)and a clothing allowance and emergency funds.Pell Grant and stipend alone add up to about 17K and there's talk of raising the stipend to 2k...does suck for Freshman who have to live in a dorm and don't get the stipend.
a month (stipend) They also have access to Pell Grant
(5k)and a clothing allowance and emergency funds.Pell Grant and stipend alone add up to about 17K and there's talk of raising the stipend to 2k...does suck for Freshman who have to live in a dorm and don't get the stipend.
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 7:54 pm
Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:45 pm to RD Dawg
That's right. These players aren't slaves. They are student athletes who are given a huge opportunity for their futures, both in athletics and in the real world. Lots of kids wish they were given scholarships to big programs just for playing sports.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:55 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
lol ok, UGA and like 3 other programs bring in a profit. I'm talking about ALL OF COLLEGE ATHLETICS, not just UGA. Even our profits would disappear immediately if we started paying athletes.
Nice try, but more than 4 schools makes a profit. So what if the profits disapper (which it would not disappear, decrease yes, disappear no)? Are the fans buying tickets or watching on tv, etc, paying to watch the schools buildings or watch the schools players? Exactly, you gotta remember who is making the profit, the players!
Look what they did to Richard Samuel, who knows, he coulda been a hella line backer. He was in hs, but got bent over pretty good by our idiotic coaches and never got to stick to a spot and could even say he got screwed out of an NFL career. So what? Well most students going to a big time program, highly rated out of hs, go there intending to make it to the nfl where they get the fruits of their hard work. Well Samuel thought this going to uga, but got switched back and forth from O to D like a light switch, which ended up with him not being properly developed and not making it in the NFL. Like I said, he earned a scholarship like other non-athletes students can, but put it much more work along with school work, to get rewarded with hardly anything monetary wise. It just doesnt seem fair to me. Sorry I want these guys, these DGD to get a better treatment for what they put in for us, the fans and university. I think they can deserve more than what they get, and their slice of the pie should be much bigger, but then again that would make the NCAA's smaller.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 7:59 pm to dawgsjw
quote:
Like I said, he earned a scholarship like other non-athletes students can, but put it much more work along with school work, to get rewarded with hardly anything monetary wise.
This is where I disagree with you.
The non-athlete academic scholarship students take classes that are actually difficult and require 60 hours a week being a student. Athletes, for the most part, not all but most, major in programs specifically designed for athletes, like "Sports Management" or "Family Development".
Their degrees are worthless.... yes... so I agree with your larger point.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:06 pm to dawgsjw
Also, these universities and the NCAA is a business. To think otherwise is asinine. So why shouldn't the players get paid like anyone else who works for a business?
I know this can tread on slippery slopes, but if your department makes an actual net gain then a certain percentage should be divided up amongst the scholarship players and then the non scholarship players. Not too difficult. Its our capitalism in motion. It will motive other departments, baseball, basketball, etc to make their shite more efficient and try to bring in more revenue when the player can get an actual cut of the pie.
I know this can tread on slippery slopes, but if your department makes an actual net gain then a certain percentage should be divided up amongst the scholarship players and then the non scholarship players. Not too difficult. Its our capitalism in motion. It will motive other departments, baseball, basketball, etc to make their shite more efficient and try to bring in more revenue when the player can get an actual cut of the pie.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:12 pm to deeprig9
quote:
This is where I disagree with you. The non-athlete academic scholarship students take classes that are actually difficult and require 60 hours a week being a student. Athletes, for the most part, not all but most, major in programs specifically designed for athletes, like "Sports Management" or "Family Development". Their degrees are worthless.... yes... so I agree with your larger point.
Yeah you are right about them taking harder classes, but then you got some student athletes who take them too. Plus they gotta put in the weight training, the cardio aspect, and then the practices, etc, it builds up to an even fuller plate for these student athletes. Not many take these classes, but A Murray is a great example. psychology is not a gimmie major and you know he was spending a lot of time in the film room. A guy like him, who has done everything he could for this school, should be getting some financial compensation throughout his enrollment at uga. And whos to say one major is more important than another? If UGA offers it as a degree, is it not legit? Is some more legit than others and if so why?
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:30 pm to dawgsjw
Only a handful of universities break even or even make a profit off of the athletic department. 10%, according to the latest data. You have to consider more than the frugle UGA AD department. We chide them all the time for this. ( Link 1, Link 2, Link 3)
The players won't be making any profits; they would be subsidized from the increased tuition paid by those not fortunate enough to be good at football. Even those universities who manage to make profits (with only a few exceptions) still take money from student tuition and other university subsidies.
Regardless of what happened to Richard Samuel (he could have transferred if he thought he wasn't getting a fair shake, like many players do), he still got an education at UGA. Most players don't make it to the NFL, anyway, and if he had the skill (regardless of what we did with him on the field), he could have walked-on with a pro team. Even if he didn't get developed like YOU think he should have, that's what happens. He still could have gone elsewhere.
These players make upwards of $125,000 a year in scholarships, per diem, housing, food, tutoring, swag from bowl games, and the contacts they make are priceless. They also (typically) don't have to work as hard academically to make grades as those who don't have athletic scholarships. Is it "fair" that a kid works his way through school (without a scholarship), stays up late studying every night, and busts his butt every day for 4 years to get an education and then has to compete for jobs with thousands others with the same degree who graduated at the same time without the same contacts that these athletes have? Maybe grad students who contribute towards studies that get grants for the school should get paid, as well.
The players won't be making any profits; they would be subsidized from the increased tuition paid by those not fortunate enough to be good at football. Even those universities who manage to make profits (with only a few exceptions) still take money from student tuition and other university subsidies.
Regardless of what happened to Richard Samuel (he could have transferred if he thought he wasn't getting a fair shake, like many players do), he still got an education at UGA. Most players don't make it to the NFL, anyway, and if he had the skill (regardless of what we did with him on the field), he could have walked-on with a pro team. Even if he didn't get developed like YOU think he should have, that's what happens. He still could have gone elsewhere.
These players make upwards of $125,000 a year in scholarships, per diem, housing, food, tutoring, swag from bowl games, and the contacts they make are priceless. They also (typically) don't have to work as hard academically to make grades as those who don't have athletic scholarships. Is it "fair" that a kid works his way through school (without a scholarship), stays up late studying every night, and busts his butt every day for 4 years to get an education and then has to compete for jobs with thousands others with the same degree who graduated at the same time without the same contacts that these athletes have? Maybe grad students who contribute towards studies that get grants for the school should get paid, as well.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:32 pm to dawgsjw
quote:You say "paid" and I say "compensated". They do get "compensated" for playing.
Also, these universities and the NCAA is a business. To think otherwise is asinine. So why shouldn't the players get paid like anyone else who works for a business?
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:37 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Maybe grad students who contribute towards studies that get grants for the school should get paid, as well.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:44 pm to dawgsjw
This is an interesting topic...I can relate to in many ways...
Anesthesia school cost around 185K dollars with living expenses factored in, of course you can't work so you have to borrow because you are studying 65 to 85 hrs a week outside of class time. During clinicals you bring a profit to your specific program of about 400K dollars in services you complete on behalf of the program as a student. This doesn't even delve in the realm of "opportunity" cost missed. when all is said and done the school profits about 480K dollars off of each student. You persevere and don't complain because when you graduate you make great earnings with a title that is well respected...
When all is said and done, who knows how much society is benefiting from your services, and not by the way of entertainment...my point is....Should a professional student be paid for their services? In my case, even at an extremely reduced rate, the school would have to pay me to go to their program when all the numbers were crunched.....
IMHO...athletes that are not going to universities to get degrees, to better their minds and life, should have other options, like a semi-pro league that pays them and is a ladder to the NFL. Yes, the quality of play would decrease for the universities, because, ... the reason why is obvious....but everything in life is relative...so, those wanting to be entertained could watch semi-pro ball and others could watch their alma mater's scholastic athletes dedicate their sweat and pain for something more than earning a paycheck,(in the end they might go pro, who knows) and the others can just play ball...maybe they will make it to the big league....
I'd be interested to see if all the Universities adopted this, would there even be a decrease in profits, and over a stabilization period I wonder if the positive might actually outweigh the negative
There could even be special games between leagues and universities....
Anesthesia school cost around 185K dollars with living expenses factored in, of course you can't work so you have to borrow because you are studying 65 to 85 hrs a week outside of class time. During clinicals you bring a profit to your specific program of about 400K dollars in services you complete on behalf of the program as a student. This doesn't even delve in the realm of "opportunity" cost missed. when all is said and done the school profits about 480K dollars off of each student. You persevere and don't complain because when you graduate you make great earnings with a title that is well respected...
When all is said and done, who knows how much society is benefiting from your services, and not by the way of entertainment...my point is....Should a professional student be paid for their services? In my case, even at an extremely reduced rate, the school would have to pay me to go to their program when all the numbers were crunched.....
IMHO...athletes that are not going to universities to get degrees, to better their minds and life, should have other options, like a semi-pro league that pays them and is a ladder to the NFL. Yes, the quality of play would decrease for the universities, because, ... the reason why is obvious....but everything in life is relative...so, those wanting to be entertained could watch semi-pro ball and others could watch their alma mater's scholastic athletes dedicate their sweat and pain for something more than earning a paycheck,(in the end they might go pro, who knows) and the others can just play ball...maybe they will make it to the big league....
I'd be interested to see if all the Universities adopted this, would there even be a decrease in profits, and over a stabilization period I wonder if the positive might actually outweigh the negative
There could even be special games between leagues and universities....
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 8:47 pm
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:48 pm to redandblackattack
quote:
This is an interesting topic...I can relate to in many ways...
Anesthesia school cost around 185K dollars with living expenses factored in, of course you can't work so you have to borrow because you are studying 65 to 85 hrs a week outside of class time. During clinicals you bring a profit to your specific program of about 400K dollars in services you complete on behalf of the program as a student. This doesn't even delve in the realm of "opportunity" cost missed. when all is said and done the school profits about 480K dollars off of each student. You persevere and don't complain because when you graduate you make great earnings with a title that is well respected...
When all is said and done, who knows how much society is benefiting from your services, and not by the way of entertainment...my point is....Should a professional student be paid for their services? In my case, even at an extremely reduced rate, the school would have to pay me to go to their program when all the numbers were crunched.....
IMHO...athletes that are not going to universities to get degrees, to better their minds and life, should have other options, like a semi-pro league that pays them and is a ladder to the NFL. Yes, the quality of play would decrease for the universities, because, ... the reason why is obvious....but everything in life is relative...so, those wanting to be entertained could watch semi-pro ball and others could watch their alma mater's scholastic athletes dedicate their sweat and pain for something more than earning a paycheck,(in the end they might go pro, who knows) and the others can just play ball...maybe they will make it to the big league....
I'd be interested to see if all the Universities adopted this, would there even be a decrease in profits, and over a stabilization period if the positive might actually outweigh the negative
There could even be special games between leagues and universities....
And undo everything that Bear Bryant did to improve college football?
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:52 pm to deeprig9
Posted on 1/19/14 at 9:42 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Maybe grad students who contribute towards studies that get grants for the school should get paid, as well.
Boom!!
Posted on 1/20/14 at 3:51 am to davesdawgs
quote:
Maybe grad students who contribute towards studies that get grants for the school should get paid, as well.
Getting a grant for a school is different than making a profit from the football team. These players are tearing acls, getting concussions, etc, while bringing in millions, which I'm sure those grad students are doing the same thing.
Also you think the NCAA isn't a business?? Look at the fricking bowls! They dont give a frick who sponsors the bowls, just as long as they get their $$$$. I'm surprised yall agree w/ the NCaa that the school should get all the money, and the players should get paid in a scholarship. Also, going to uga doesn't cost 150k. Most of the players on the football team would qualify for financial aid or some other assistance where they wouldn't have to pay 150K like you think, not even close. When I went to school, and my bro went to uga, financial aid and hope scholarship paid most of it. At uga, my bro had to pay a little out of pocket, but that was just for the apartment, which was no where near 150K.
So all you guys acting like the scholarship is payment enough for bringing in millions is just stupid, especially when a school is recruiting a guy to come in and play football, not for their academics. The players getting a degree in the most part is just a scam so they can play football. Also, why dont we pay the coaches or assitants like we do the players, you know with free room and board and food, etc? B/c they want to get paid $$ like all the rest of Americans, who provides a service for a company (uga).
So everyone acting like JHC owes it to us to do this or that b/c he is on scholarship which is worth, you know 6 figures, is stupid. JHC owes nothing to us the fans. UGA got him to come in and play football and put asses in the seats. Then we have the strictest punishment in the the SEC to even further limit our players. The recruits see this, and quiet frankly, I wouldn't want to come to uga b/c if you have any fun and get caught, you could get screwed over in your football career, which is why you are coming to uga in the first place (marshall, mett, crowell). AGain, JHC wouldn't not be suspended like this at BAMA, LSU or the Barn! We are setting ourselves up for failure and next yr will be like this year. We have high hopes, but reality kicks in and we just shite the bed again and again. Maybe if Richt smoked some pot himself, he can come up with some good special teams play.
Posted on 1/20/14 at 7:16 am to adawgj
quote:
Makes the mind think beyond normal everyday comprehension. Every thought broken down into its simplest form.
Same was said about LSD.
You gotta remember...I don't even drink. I don't do stuff that makes me feel or act out of the ordinary, unless it is prescribed by a doctor.
Posted on 1/20/14 at 7:21 am to RD Dawg
quote:
.I really don't know if you're one those to be honest with you.
Nope. I defend Richt....possibly to a fault.
quote:
It wouldn't be left up to the schools.Easy solution,the drug testing policy would be adminstered by the conference...it very easy to test for recreational drugs....PED testing is a whole different animal.
There is ALWAYS a way to get around a rule or a test.
Posted on 1/20/14 at 7:24 am to dawgsjw
quote:
Wrong, at UGA the football program brings in a profit, no other sports program does. So football players have earned their right to get paid, why is this a hard concept to understand. Of course the NCAA doesnt want this to happen b/c it cuts out of their wallets.
I understand what you are saying, but if you pay any of the athletes you would have to pay all. law suits would be waiting to happen. Even if they didn't happen, some sports would have to be dropped. many schools lose money on their overall sports programs. You put a further strain on them by paying the athletes and you will either see many sports get dropped, or ticket prices would double.
Posted on 1/20/14 at 7:32 am to dawgsjw
quote:
Look what they did to Richard Samuel,
For every Richard Samuel there are a dozen kids that nobody heard of that gets developed into a very good football player....some play in the NFL. But that is not the primary responsibility of a college. The primary responsibility is to give them an education so they can be successful outside of sports. If they make it in sports as professionals, that is gravy.
quote:
which ended up with him not being properly developed and not making it in the NFL.
Had he stayed as a LB, there is still no guarantee that he would have made it in the NFL.
quote:
I think they can deserve more than what they get, and their slice of the pie should be much bigger, but then again that would make the NCAA's smaller.
I don't think you fully understand how the NCAA makes and distributes money. Here is an article:
LINK
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