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re: Does Calipari deserve National Coach of the Year?
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:07 pm to cas4t
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:07 pm to cas4t
quote:
I can think of probably 10 that have similar facilities.
10 out of 351. But yeah, those other 341 schools could have totally recruited that many McD's AA's. It's almost as if those schools, which shockingly tend to do well most seasons, have better players/more representation in the NBA.
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But again, Cal recruited at a high level at Memphis and UMass too.
And AGAIN, "high level" isn't "highest level." This team at UK is the "highest level." So if you care to argue that his UMass or Memphis teams were as highly recruited, go right on ahead.
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He's proved time and time over that being a winning/good coach is how you get the best players.
You're using a lot of words interchangeably. You say, "get the best players" here...but you also mention time and time again. That makes me think you're saying he got the best players at UMass and Memphis, too. But in reality, he didn't. They weren't "the best."
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I guarantee you if Cal left for Memphis again tomorrow he'd have a top 5 team within 2 years. And they don't even have their own arena.
We'll never know. But these are easy (pointless):
I guarantee that if Bo Ryan was coaching at UK, they'd be undefeated with no margin of victory less than 15 points.
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Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:07 pm to gumbeaux
Coach Brey if I had a vote.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:09 pm to RT1941
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And when they get to the bottom of the barrel and throw up every possible reason to devalue them as "elite coaches" - they have no choice but to resort to juvenile excuses like they cheat, they are conference favorites, media darlings, the pay off the officials, or the conference was weak this year.......
False narratives...false narratives, everywhere!
It's all about how you define "coach of the year" and how you weigh the attributes that contribute to that. Many, understandably, default to W/L as the ultimate gauge. I think that's very simplistic and fails to account for the different dynamics at each school.
I think that's pretty reasonable. But evidently it makes me a Nazi.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:10 pm to ocelot4ark
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You're using a lot of words interchangeably. You say, "get the best players" here...but you also mention time and time again. That makes me think you're saying he got the best players at UMass and Memphis, too. But in reality, he didn't. They weren't "the best."
He consistently signed top 5 classes at both schools. He also signed the #1 player in the nation while at UMAss as well as at Memphis.
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I guarantee that if Bo Ryan was coaching at UK, they'd be undefeated with no margin of victory less than 15 points.
and he'd be deserving of COY
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:13 pm to Prof
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Not always. If you're at a shitty school and/or inherited a shitty roster and get far more out of them should be possible then that ought to be recognized. I'm not even saying they should win just that this aspect/difficulty of the job + performance with that difficulty should be a part of the criteria (not the only criteria either).
that's essentially punishing a coach for doing well enough to earn a shot at a major program. At the end of the day, in college, the best coaches end up with the best jobs. I feel like I could argue that giong 40-0 with elite talent is just as hard as having a slightly above average year with shite talent.
Cal squeaked by on a number of occasions this year. Idc how good his players are....38-0 is insanely hard.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:14 pm to cas4t
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I can't believe I feel like I have to convince you that you are wrong.
That says more about you than it does me.
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You're the one who mentioned his in-game coaching strategies and shifting gameplans. If you can't name what type of offense UK runs, then you have no business judging a coaches in-game coaching ability. Sorry.
Good God. Is it easier to execute a game plan...ANY GAME PLAN with good talent or bad talent? Can you put those pieces together and try to locate what my actual point was now? I didn't say he doesn't make those adjustments. I'm saying he doesn't need to as much, or his teams don't rely on his coaching decisions as much as some others.
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Again, you mentioned his in-game coaching. I simply pointed out that he seems to be very involved.
And I pointed out that it doesn't distinguish him from most/good coaches. You say it as if he's the only one.
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No I'm trying to inform you that Cal is by far the most deserving of COY.
How's that going for you?
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you're the one who continues to make idiotic statements followed with nothing but back peddling.
Go ahead and link me to those specific statements or back peddles.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:15 pm to ocelot4ark
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It's all about how you define "coach of the year"
most of us seem to be on the same page. I think you put too much value in your idea of COY. At the end of the day, winning is king in every sport.
The best coaches get the best jobs and win the most games.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:16 pm to cas4t
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He consistently signed top 5 classes at both schools. He also signed the #1 player in the nation while at UMAss as well as at Memphis.
So not the highest then? Top 5 =/= top 1, still, right?Words DO have meanings.
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and he'd be deserving of COY
Yeah, with a margin of victory that high in every game he would.
This post was edited on 4/2/15 at 3:17 pm
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:17 pm to ocelot4ark
I'm done arguing with an Arkansas fan who has clearly accepted mediocrity to the point that he doesn't think winning is the ultimate measure. You've told yourself that for far too long for me to be able to convince you otherwise. I'm convinced it's a "culture thing".
have a good day.
have a good day.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:18 pm to cas4t
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I feel like I could argue that giong 40-0 with elite talent is just as hard as having a slightly above average year with shite talent.
Like I said earlier, we've seen varying levels of talent (and developed over a 4 year span talent) over the last 40 years and no one else has been able to go undefeated since the Hoosiers in '76. UK under Cal has already won two more games than them. '96 Kentucky came close with two losses to eventual Final Four teams. '09 UNC had 4 regular season losses despite absolutely owning everyone in the NCAA tournament. You've had the Fab Five and Coach K's 90s Duke squads. It's not like there wasn't talent out there to attempt the undefeated season.
This post was edited on 4/2/15 at 3:19 pm
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:19 pm to ocelot4ark
quote:
So not the highest then? Top 5 =/= top 1, still, right?Words DO have meanings.
you're attempting to discount the fact that he landed top 5 classes at schools that haven't sniffed a top 5 class since he left.
Keep reaching.
have a good day
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:20 pm to cas4t
quote:
that's essentially punishing a coach for doing well enough to earn a shot at a major program. At the end of the day, in college, the best coaches end up with the best jobs. I feel like I could argue that giong 40-0 with elite talent is just as hard as having a slightly above average year with shite talent.
Cal squeaked by on a number of occasions this year. Idc how good his players are....38-0 is insanely hard.
Not at all -- you're operating in extremes. Any scale/criteria that includes difficulty is open to adjustment and major bball schools have their own difficulty levels including but not limited to the toughness of their schedules. As for Cal, you don't get to a perfect season without being good.
This post was edited on 4/2/15 at 3:22 pm
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:21 pm to cas4t
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most of us seem to be on the same page. I think you put too much value in your idea of COY.
Sorry, guys! I had my own opinion on something. Sorry I haven't come around to your way of thinking just yet. Do keep trying.
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At the end of the day, winning is king in every sport.
The best coaches get the best jobs and win the most games.
For about the 5th time...
You'd agree, then, that they should just give the COY award to whoever wins the NCAAT?
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:21 pm to BluegrassBelle
and the Duke reference earlier was hilarious. He'd be saying the same thing if it were Coach K. well Duke was no powerhouse before Coach K. He built that program from scratch.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:22 pm to cas4t
quote:
I'm done arguing with an Arkansas fan who has clearly accepted mediocrity to the point that he doesn't think winning is the ultimate measure. You've told yourself that for far too long for me to be able to convince you otherwise. I'm convinced it's a "culture thing".
have a good day.
Otherwise, "I can't point to your back peddles or ridiculous beliefs, because I've been relying on a false narrative. So now I'm just going to throw out an ad hominem attack and REALLY be a bitch."
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:23 pm to cas4t
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and the Duke reference earlier was hilarious. He'd be saying the same thing if it were Coach K. well Duke was no powerhouse before Coach K. He built that program from scratch.
Oh - did I say Coach K wasn't a good coach, Mr 'I can't read for fricking shite'?
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:24 pm to ocelot4ark
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Sorry, guys! I had my own opinion on something.
By all means, express yourself. You're entitled to your wrong opinion.
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You'd agree, then, that they should just give the COY award to whoever wins the NCAAT?
No, I think it should go to the coach who wins the most games against the best competition. In other words, UK could lose the next game and I still think Cal deserves COY.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:25 pm to UKWildcats
quote:You are a newbie on this board. You have not idea how long Bama fans have had to read the exact same posts from jealous rival fans.
Funny how I never hear how Saban can't coach. He does the same thing.
I promise you the exact same shite gets said about Saban and even worse because rival fans resort to him of paying off the refs, getting favorable treatment from his buddy (Mark Emmertt at the NCAA), and getting favorable scheduling due to the close proximity of the SEC home office in Birmingham.
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:26 pm to ocelot4ark
No, but you implied that you'd say the same thing about Coach K as you are with Cal.
Here's a question. Are you essentially saying that once a coach reaches a certain level where he can get the best talent in the country, he should no longer be in consideration for COY because he has a significant advantage? (an advantage that said coach created for himself, by the way.)
Here's a question. Are you essentially saying that once a coach reaches a certain level where he can get the best talent in the country, he should no longer be in consideration for COY because he has a significant advantage? (an advantage that said coach created for himself, by the way.)
Posted on 4/2/15 at 3:28 pm to ocelot4ark
quote:
Otherwise, "I can't point to your back peddles or ridiculous beliefs, because I've been relying on a false narrative. So now I'm just going to throw out an ad hominem attack and REALLY be a bitch."
I've already called you out on 2 of your back pedals, and have no interest in linking or quoting something that has been plainly stated by multiple posters at this point. You're a grown man (I assume), feel free to use some context clues and figure it out for yourself. I won't always be here to hold your hand through every issue you have in your internet life.
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