Prodigal Son
| Favorite team: | LSU  |
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| Number of Posts: | 1184 |
| Registered on: | 5/16/2023 |
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re: Suggestion Box: How can we drive the Woke Left even more insane?
Posted by Prodigal Son on 4/25/25 at 2:02 pm
Become devoted followers of Jesus Christ. It’s a win-win!
0
re: Cool Video Describing Ancient Christian Liturgy
Posted by Prodigal Son on 4/24/25 at 8:45 pm
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Now for all those Bible Christians.
Is that supposed to be an insult? Are you a Christian?
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Not all that Jesus taught could be written down. Therefore the apostles handed down the traditions that jesus taught them, verbally and by the practice of the faith
Where does it say that? (For us ‘Bible Christians’)
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John 21:25 ? Now, there are many other things that Jesus did. If they were all written down one by one, I suppose that the whole world could not hold the books that would be written.
Do you not see a leap from ‘did’ to ‘taught’?
Also, do you not see how this “secret knowledge” thing is also the foundation of Gnosticism- which the Bible specifically condemns?
That said, I’m not the arbiter of truth. I’m (prayerfully) the recipient of abundant grace and mercy from the Triune God. Of course I recognize that we didn’t have the Bible, in its entirety, for many years (but I believe we did have the basic gospel written very early). And in that time, (I think) God relied upon His well trained and completely devoted Apostles to bridge the gap.
What I have a hard time with, is the idea that He would put most of what I need to know in a Book that is now widely available (thanks!)- but kept just a few really really important things out- and entrusted those things to mortal men. No disrespect intended- just reminding all, that we all agree that only what is in scripture is inspired by God. There are no additional teachings of Christ, other than what is in the Bible. Can you show me where someone says anything that is recognized as Holy Spirit-inspired outside of what is recorded in scripture?
ETA: 1 Peter 5:1
So I (Peter) exhort the elders among you, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, as well as a partaker in the glory that is going to be revealed:
1 Peter, believed by the early church fathers and biblical scholars to be written around 60-65 AD, by Peter, in Rome, 30 years after the events recorded in Matthew 16:18. Why does he (Peter) refer to himself as a “fellow elder” instead of “The Pope”? For that matter, can you show me a single instance, in scripture, where Peter’s “primacy” is exercised or evidenced?
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 4/1/25 at 9:41 pm
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AI? Really? You must get tired of saying evolution is “only a theory”. Come on, you know what a scientific theory is. But in case you don’t.
I don’t say it’s “only” a theory. I’m well aware of the difference between the everyday usage of the word, and the scientific use. I’m well aware that you treat these theories the way a devout Christian treats Christian doctrine. I also believe that your brain malfunctions when faced with this obvious connection. Materialism is a helluva drug.
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Why move the goal posts?
Like yall did, when you quickly realized that Darwin’s theory was inadequate? That’s not what I’m doing. I’m showing you how the foundation of your worldview (scientific materialism) fails miserably at the onset. You have not a single observation of how life can/has created nonlife- yet it is the necessary precursor to the equally unproven theory of UCA. Your theory asks that we accept one miracle, and then nature takes over. It is, indeed, a double standard.
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Maybe abiogenesis as a hypothesis is in the text books
Sad attempt to defend obvious indoctrination. I would ask you to do better, but I also realize that your position is logically and evidentially indefensible.
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because it is one of the more if not most rational hypotheses for a natural explanation to the origin of life, and might be testable and falsifiable.
Couple things. Natural explanations alone cannot account for much of what we experience (love, respect, freaking math, etc)in reality. You are constantly faced with the existence of the immaterial (consciousness) world. You are intentionally eliminating possible explanations (immaterial) due strictly to your inability to measure these things. Also, your claim that abiogenesis “might” be testable/falsifiable is nothing more than a statement of faith.
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Saying “we don’t know so God did it” isn’t science.
I agree. And so do the vast majority of Christian scientists. Science answers the “how.” Religion (Christianity) explains the “why.” You can strawman all you want (there’s plenty to choose from), but the fact remains that there are many well-credentialed, serious scientists (theists and atheists) who question the ability of natural selection to account for the complexity of life that we see today.
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We may never know how life began on earth, and that is ok.
Then stop teaching it to kids like you do. Just take abiogenesis out of the textbooks. How hard is that? Why not? Because it’s literally the atheists’ only hope (faith).
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But evolution of species is as factual as me releasing an apple from elevation and knowing it will fall.
Thank you. That’s a perfect example of how you conflate known facts with make believe. You can go into a lab and prove the former- over and over. Yet the latter has never been observed. I dare you to quote Lenski’s experiment as evidence of UCA.
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There you go again mixing up hypothesis which is a hunch, a somewhat of a guess
Thanks again. So, we’re teaching a guess in high school textbooks. Sounds like indoctrination to me. :dunno:
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I was interested in astronomy and cosmology as a kid
I’m not taking away from biology, but that’s some really interesting stuff. Even Dawkins said something like that the fine tuning argument was compelling/interesting. Obviously not enough to overcome his desire to be Lord of his own life, but, compelling nonetheless.
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The universe model I support might have to come later if I ever decide to read up on the latest tech findings.
You should. Your understanding of life is incomplete without it. It’s like you’re trying to evaluate the design of an automobile with only an understanding of the braking system.
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I think you are mistaken
I m not. It’s more simple than you make it out to be.
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The vast majority of atheists say
Does it really matter what people say? Or, does logic dictate reality?
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So what if there is or isn’t supernatural beings
There are. But, we’re talking about “the” God. Are you employed? Do you exhibit this behavior in the presence of your employer? Of course not. You do what you are designed to do- obey authority (or suffer the consequences otherwise). It’s only in this “credit system” that you feel empowered to keep on swiping- knowing you can’t pay the bill. You need spiritual DOGE- we all do.
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Thank you for posting the book name. I read about 6 pages of it and realized you never read it minus the quote the creationists cite
You read 6 pages and then criticize me for not reading the whole book. Classic Squirrelmeister. If nothing else- you are consistent. :lol:
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You would have mentioned the guy was an atheist and that he considered Habilis to be an Australopithecine,
You’re such a staunch supporter- I expected you would have known. I don’t care what he thought- beyond what he said- that there is no fossil evidence linking apes and humans.
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if you knew anything about the subject matter
Here’s what’s important to know:
- nobody knows when the candle was lit. That’s it. From there, we all can make many unfalsifiable assumptions- but in literally every instance, we lack the confidence of mathematical (or logical) proof. Our positions are equally faith based. Your inability to grasp this concept is comical to me- only because I believe that you will eventually figure it out.
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anthropology in the last 20 years since Ernst died
Could be compared to Clay and Buck taking over for Rush. Is that an improvement? :lol:
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What anthropologists argue about now
… is a whole lot more than what you just said. Bro- it’s so obvious that you are unwilling to engage anything that threatens your safe space.
:rotflmao:
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Oh, and you are an atheist too.
My advice- stop this. Are you debating me, or just trying to win cheap internet points on a thread that no one reads but me and you?
Love you, bro. :cheers:
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/30/25 at 8:11 pm
… continued
Wrong thread. :lol: Seriously though, I wish it would’ve taken. I’d much prefer to be having friendly theological discussions with you as a believer. I hope one day we will.
Yes. We are indoctrinating children (starting in junior high) into an unproven worldview that absolutely has an agenda- to deconstruct faith in God. You are living proof. Also, this:
”Although atheism might have been logically tenable before Darwin, Darwin made it possible to be an intellectually fulfilled atheist.” — Dick Dawkins
Say, you know who else was a huge fan of Darwin? This guy named Karl Marx, and - wait for it… Yep. You guessed right. Its Hitler. Let’s go ahead and throw Lenin and Mao Zedong in for good measure.
I know this doesn’t disprove Darwin’s theory. But it shows that Darwin’s theory is an integral part of a destructive worldview.
Ever heard of Nero? In AD 54 he was lightning his garden paths by burning Christians alive.
How did the Apostles die? Admittedly, the weight of the evidence varies. But, the martyrdom of James, the brother of Jesus is well attested by reliable historians like Josephus and Eusebius (quoting 2nd century historian Hegesippus). It’s well known that world was very hostile to Christianity in the first 300 or so years. It’s beyond reasonable to accept the idea that the apostles faced severe persecution. What makes you think they didn’t? Do you have some historical evidence or documents that show Peter and Paul sipping margaritas in Madagascar or something? :lol:
Seriously though, I would think that a horse and a zebra are the same kind. Different species. What do I win?
Is it though? That’s very misleading. That number was derived from a 1 to 1 comparison of a single protein. When the entire genome is considered- we get varying results. This article from Caltech says that it’s only 95%. Biologist, Richard Buggs
has estimated that there is only an 84% similarity between the two genomes. Regardless, even if we are “98%” (we aren’t) similar- that’s 98% of over 3 billion. That means there’s (at least) 60,000,000 genetic differences between humans and chimps. That’s not insignificant. It doesn’t require a degree in biology to recognize that it’s the differences that matter- not the similarities. Again, you see similarities as evidence of UCA. I see the similarities as evidence of a Common Designer. Both conclusions are unfalsifiable. Both positions are faith-based.
I honestly don’t know enough to be confident, but I would think that donkeys and horses are the same kind. As far as humans/chimps go- I don’t care if we are 99% similar. There’s obviously more differences in reality between humans and chimps, than there is between horses and donkeys.
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The only indoctrination I ever received was from the Catholic Church.
Wrong thread. :lol: Seriously though, I wish it would’ve taken. I’d much prefer to be having friendly theological discussions with you as a believer. I hope one day we will.
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Are you maybe talking about education?
Yes. We are indoctrinating children (starting in junior high) into an unproven worldview that absolutely has an agenda- to deconstruct faith in God. You are living proof. Also, this:
”Although atheism might have been logically tenable before Darwin, Darwin made it possible to be an intellectually fulfilled atheist.” — Dick Dawkins
Say, you know who else was a huge fan of Darwin? This guy named Karl Marx, and - wait for it… Yep. You guessed right. Its Hitler. Let’s go ahead and throw Lenin and Mao Zedong in for good measure.
I know this doesn’t disprove Darwin’s theory. But it shows that Darwin’s theory is an integral part of a destructive worldview.
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Are you implying that someone else died for their beliefs?
Ever heard of Nero? In AD 54 he was lightning his garden paths by burning Christians alive.
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Are you referring to “the 12”? If you are, what are your sources that they died for their beliefs?
How did the Apostles die? Admittedly, the weight of the evidence varies. But, the martyrdom of James, the brother of Jesus is well attested by reliable historians like Josephus and Eusebius (quoting 2nd century historian Hegesippus). It’s well known that world was very hostile to Christianity in the first 300 or so years. It’s beyond reasonable to accept the idea that the apostles faced severe persecution. What makes you think they didn’t? Do you have some historical evidence or documents that show Peter and Paul sipping margaritas in Madagascar or something? :lol:
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Surely a horse and a zebra are not the same species in the modern scientific context but are they the same “kind”?
Seriously though, I would think that a horse and a zebra are the same kind. Different species. What do I win?
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Now applying the same methods to chimpanzees and humans, we can see we are 98.8% similar to them
Is it though? That’s very misleading. That number was derived from a 1 to 1 comparison of a single protein. When the entire genome is considered- we get varying results. This article from Caltech says that it’s only 95%. Biologist, Richard Buggs
has estimated that there is only an 84% similarity between the two genomes. Regardless, even if we are “98%” (we aren’t) similar- that’s 98% of over 3 billion. That means there’s (at least) 60,000,000 genetic differences between humans and chimps. That’s not insignificant. It doesn’t require a degree in biology to recognize that it’s the differences that matter- not the similarities. Again, you see similarities as evidence of UCA. I see the similarities as evidence of a Common Designer. Both conclusions are unfalsifiable. Both positions are faith-based.
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You think a chimp and a human are not the same “kind”. Just be honest and logically consistent when you claim a horse and a donkey are not the same “kind” though they can hybridize and even rarely produce fertile hybrids and are less genetically similar to each other than are chimps to human.
I honestly don’t know enough to be confident, but I would think that donkeys and horses are the same kind. As far as humans/chimps go- I don’t care if we are 99% similar. There’s obviously more differences in reality between humans and chimps, than there is between horses and donkeys.
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/30/25 at 8:09 pm
quote]Like universal common ancestry? Well that is already a scientific fact.[/quote]
No, it’s not. From AI assist:
Universal common ancestry is widely supported by scientific evidence, particularly in evolutionary biology, but it is considered a theory rather than an absolute fact. It posits that all living organisms share a common ancestor, which is supported by genetic, biochemical, and fossil evidence.
Evidence requires interpretation, and interpretation is subject to presuppositional bias. For example, if methodological naturalism is the lens through which you see the world, then that’s going to influence the way you evaluate evidence.
Yes, abiogenesis is often included in biology textbooks, particularly in discussions about the origin of life and its relationship to evolution. However, the extent and manner in which it is taught can vary significantly across different educational systems.
Gee, why would anyone want to teach such an unproven, irrelevant theory- as the necessary precursor to evolution?
I like this one even better:
Yes, abiogenesis is often included in high school biology textbooks as part of the discussion on the origin of life, although its treatment can vary significantly between different educational systems. The teaching of abiogenesis aims to provide students with an understanding of how life may have arisen from non-living matter, :lol: despite the ongoing debates and lack of direct empirical evidence for the process.
Yay science! :rotflmao:
That’s right. I forgot- you’re an “oscillating universe” kind of guy, right?
Oh. Ok.
This is not an accurate comparison. Non-stamp collectors and non-football players don’t make claims like “stamps don’t exist,” or “there’s no such thing as football.” Atheism makes a truth claim- “there is no God.” It is a belief.
Lol. Ok buddy.
Ernst Walter Mayr (/ma??r/ MYRE; German: [??nst 'ma??]; 5 July 1904 – 3 February 2005)[1][2] was a German-American evolutionary biologist. He was also a renowned taxonomist, tropical explorer, ornithologist, philosopher of biology, and historian of science.[3] His work contributed to the conceptual revolution that led to the modern evolutionary synthesis of Mendelian genetics, systematics, and Darwinian evolution, and to the development of the biological species concept.
His theory of peripatric speciation (a more precise form of allopatric speciation which he advanced), based on his work on birds, is still considered a leading mode of speciation, and was the theoretical underpinning for the theory of punctuated equilibrium, proposed by Niles Eldredge and Stephen Jay Gould. Mayr is sometimes credited with inventing modern philosophy of biology, particularly the part related to evolutionary biology, which he distinguished from physics due to its introduction of (natural) history into science.
Never heard of the guy, huh? Well, that idiot halfwit is who you have to thank for your current understanding of species.
I did. Go back and read the quote again. It’s from his book written in 2004. I thought for sure you would have seen that. It’s written in English. But just for redundant clarity’s sake-
You can buy it on Amazon for about $40.
To be continued…
No, it’s not. From AI assist:
Universal common ancestry is widely supported by scientific evidence, particularly in evolutionary biology, but it is considered a theory rather than an absolute fact. It posits that all living organisms share a common ancestor, which is supported by genetic, biochemical, and fossil evidence.
Evidence requires interpretation, and interpretation is subject to presuppositional bias. For example, if methodological naturalism is the lens through which you see the world, then that’s going to influence the way you evaluate evidence.
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Like abiogenesis? Hypothesis, different than evolution and irrelevant
Yes, abiogenesis is often included in biology textbooks, particularly in discussions about the origin of life and its relationship to evolution. However, the extent and manner in which it is taught can vary significantly across different educational systems.
Gee, why would anyone want to teach such an unproven, irrelevant theory- as the necessary precursor to evolution?
I like this one even better:
Yes, abiogenesis is often included in high school biology textbooks as part of the discussion on the origin of life, although its treatment can vary significantly between different educational systems. The teaching of abiogenesis aims to provide students with an understanding of how life may have arisen from non-living matter, :lol: despite the ongoing debates and lack of direct empirical evidence for the process.
Yay science! :rotflmao:
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Like the multiverse theory? Don’t know anything about it and irrelevant to biological evolution and common ancestors
That’s right. I forgot- you’re an “oscillating universe” kind of guy, right?
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I don’t have a double standard on this subject.
Oh. Ok.
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Not collecting stamps is a hobby and not playing football is a sport by your logic. Not having faith in a supernatural fantasy is not a religion.
This is not an accurate comparison. Non-stamp collectors and non-football players don’t make claims like “stamps don’t exist,” or “there’s no such thing as football.” Atheism makes a truth claim- “there is no God.” It is a belief.
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Darwin isn’t our Jesus
Lol. Ok buddy.
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I never heard of the guy (Ernst Mayr) to be honest. If that bullshite you posted really is from that guy, all I can say is he didn’t know WTF he’s talking about in 2004, because any halfwit studying biology at that time knew of Homo Habilis bridging the gap between Australopithecus and Homo Erectus.
Ernst Walter Mayr (/ma??r/ MYRE; German: [??nst 'ma??]; 5 July 1904 – 3 February 2005)[1][2] was a German-American evolutionary biologist. He was also a renowned taxonomist, tropical explorer, ornithologist, philosopher of biology, and historian of science.[3] His work contributed to the conceptual revolution that led to the modern evolutionary synthesis of Mendelian genetics, systematics, and Darwinian evolution, and to the development of the biological species concept.
His theory of peripatric speciation (a more precise form of allopatric speciation which he advanced), based on his work on birds, is still considered a leading mode of speciation, and was the theoretical underpinning for the theory of punctuated equilibrium, proposed by Niles Eldredge and Stephen Jay Gould. Mayr is sometimes credited with inventing modern philosophy of biology, particularly the part related to evolutionary biology, which he distinguished from physics due to its introduction of (natural) history into science.
Never heard of the guy, huh? Well, that idiot halfwit is who you have to thank for your current understanding of species.
quote:
And you provided no source for the quote. That’s a fail man.
I did. Go back and read the quote again. It’s from his book written in 2004. I thought for sure you would have seen that. It’s written in English. But just for redundant clarity’s sake-
You can buy it on Amazon for about $40.
To be continued…
re: Tim Walz Son Gus, drops a Truth Bomb on him
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/28/25 at 7:41 pm
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he might be an even bigger clown than Kamala.
Dang. You had me right up until this point. Kamala is proof of one thing- you can sleep your way to the top, but if you don’t know what to do when you get there- you won’t be there long.
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/28/25 at 5:13 pm
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They are (quacks) because they aren’t engaging in science but rather making assertions that can’t be tested in reality
Like universal common ancestry?
Like abiogenesis?
Like the multiverse theory?
Like materialism?
Do you not see your own double standard?
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What are you even arguing?
That atheism requires just as much faith as Christianity- ultimately. Right now though, I’m just trying to get you to see that at some point- UCA requires a leap of faith.
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Evolution can happen rapidly,
How convenient. That’s not what Darwin thought. He said-
”It may be said that natural selection is daily and hourly scrutinizing, throughout the world, every variation, even the slightest; rejecting that which is bad, preserving and adding up all that is good; silently and insensibly working, whenever and wherever opportunity offers, at the improvement of each organic being in relation to its organic and inorganic conditions of life”.
Boy, natural selection sounds a lot like God. :lol: But I digress.
”We see nothing of these slow changes in progress, until the hand of time has marked the long lapses of ages, and then so imperfect is our view into long past geological ages, that we only see that the forms of life are now different from what they formerly were.”
“Rapid” evolution, evolved because Darwin’s theory didn’t accurately describe reality. That’s your foundation. Perhaps one day science will learn that all life “instantly evolved,” in a couple of days, into various kinds, at which point natural selection took over, and produced the millions of species that we see today.
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Did he really write that? If so, when did he write it? All I could find in the search for that text was creationist websites and not any legitimate scientific papers or sources.
"The earliest fossils of Homo, Homo rudolfensis and Homo erectus, are separated from Australopithecus by a large, unbridged gap. How can we explain this seeming saltation? Not having any fossils that can serve as missing links, we have to fall back on the time-honored method of historical science, the construction of a historical narrative." (Ernst Mayr, What Makes Biology Unique?: Considerations on the Autonomy of a Scientific Discipline, page 198 (Cambridge University Press, 2004).)
Gee, I wonder why it’s so hard to find- except on creationist websites? This is a good time to remind you that even creationists don’t dispute natural selection and/or adaptation. Many scientists (atheist or otherwise) dispute the claim that natural selection + deep time can account for the complexity of life that we see today (which is indescribably more advanced than when Darwin proposed his theory).
Before I get back on track, I want to throw something in about materialism-
This ideology goes way back before any real science was done. Materialism is a philosophy, not a fact. It is a constructed worldview that denies the existence of the obvious immaterial aspects of reality.
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What you posted doesn’t even mention Homo Habilis
Homo Habilis was discovered in the early 1960’s. Ernst Mayr wrote that book in 2004. Why wouldn’t he have said *except homo habilis? Because he obviously doesn’t consider HH a missing link.
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because it does bridge the gap between Rudolfensis/Erectus and Australopithecus
Not according to Ernst Mayr.
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I was aware of this many moons ago as a middle school aged kid
Now we’re getting somewhere. Your indoctrination began very early. You’ve been groomed from a young age.
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The creationist website posting this nonsense is staffed by people who aren’t aware of common knowledge evidently.
Yeah. That must be it. :lol:
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You can’t disprove evolution isn’t driven by the Flying Spaghetti Monster neither
Nobody’s arguing for the Flying Spaghetti Monster. If they were, do you think they’d be willing to die for that belief? Before you come back with some lame 9/11 comparison- remember that the disciples were in a unique position, having firsthand experience and knowledge of the resurrected Jesus Christ.
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All we can do is show what is true and what the causes are
All you can do is show what you believe to be true, and what you believe caused it.
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Dude, please do some legit research on this subject rather than reading from William Lane Craig or answers in Genesis or whatever
Pretty sure Craig is some type of theistic evolutionist. AiG- I agree with you- to an extent. Many, if not most, of these creationist/scientist types take undue liberties when defending their claims, as does the other side. My intent in quoting any creationist/scientific material is not to attempt to pass it off as fact, necessarily, but to point out that there are legitimate reasons for legitimate scientists to question the current scientific paradigm. But, time and time again, you attack the source of the information, rather than attempt to discredit the information itself.
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Very good. Check out Pakicetus and Ambulocetus. Evolution of whales
I’m aware of the claim. Here’s a good challenge to that claim-
Youtube Link
There are two rebuttals to critics:
Here, and here.
It all starts with indohyus (48mya), right? Then pakecitus (52mya)? But pakecitus is found 4million years earlier than indohyus, in the fossil record. And how many beneficial mutations would it take to get from pakecitus to a whale? How long would that take? Population genetics says “a long time. More time than was available.” Then there’s the 49 million year old fossil of a fully aquatic whale that destroys the evolutionary timeline. He also says that archaeopteryx shows up before theropods. And he smashes tiktaalik.
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/22/25 at 9:33 pm
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Perfect god who ruined his creation
Lol. You might want to reserve your judgment for the finished product. I’d bet the farm that you’ll be singing a different tune on judgement day.
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Irrelevant. I’m not going to lie to myself and believe in fantasy because it is more comfortable.
Absolutely relevant. I think you’re missing the point. Intentionally.
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The god and gods in the Bible are all obviously fantasy.
Not Jesus.
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You never understood Dawkins’ quote. The illusion is to people like you who are uneducated on the subject matter. Apparent design is only apparent to you, not to anyone who’s studied biology.
Lol. Ok buddy.
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I think you are trying to say I only believe in things that can be shown and demonstrated to be factual based on the preponderance of evidence. Thanks, I guess.
No, I’m saying that you’re saying that the physical world is all that exists. Do you love your children? How much does it weigh? How many units of love do you have? Where do you keep it? What about logic? Where is it on the periodic table of elements? What about the laws of nature and mathematics? Did we create them or discover them? Are they physical? No. But, somehow they describe and govern the physical world. Hmmm.
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Do you realize you are posting articles from a website that is a pseudoscience-based joke?
About the author
Casey Luskin is a scientist and an attorney with graduate degrees in science and law
He holds a PhD in Geology from the University of Johannesburg where he specialized in paleomagnetism and the early plate tectonic history of South Africa.
His B.S. and M.S. degrees in Earth Sciences are from the University of California, San Diego, where he studied evolution extensively at the graduate and undergraduate levels, and conducted geological research at Scripps Institution for Oceanography
And he’s citing references from secular sources (and Christian sources). Their group of fellows is highly credentialed. These are not quack grifters. They are highly educated, highly intelligent individuals who use the same scientific method to come to different conclusions, because they start with a different hypothesis. Your insults carry no weight. They are nothing more than a conditioned response from an intolerant worldview. With all due respect, obviously. Just my opinion.
quote:
No, they don’t
Yes, they did.
New study suggests big bang theory of human evolution
The first members of early Homo sapiens are really quite distinct from their australopithecine predecessors and contemporaries
Gee, that seems to be the opposite of what you said.
Two million years ago somewhere in Africa, a small group of individuals became separated from other australopithecines. This population bottleneck led to a series of sudden, interrelated changes—in body size, brain size, skeletal proportions, and behavior—that jump-started the evolution of our species.
Wow- population bottleneck? Where have I heard that before? Sudden, interrelated changes? That sounds like rapid evolution- not slow, gradual, undirected change over millions of years. Jump-starting the evolution? :rotflmao: I’ve never heard a better argument for design than that! :lol: All this from the University of Michigan- not some creationist website.
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Many legitimate scientists can’t even agree
That’s the most intellectually honest thing you’ve said in a while. :lol:
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Complete nonsense. Homo Habilis is the most commonly attributed bridge between the Homo species and the Australopithecine species.
Take that up with Ernst Mayr. I’m just telling you what he said:
“the earliest fossils of Homo, Homo rudolfensis and Homo erectus are separated from Australopithecus by a large, unbridged gap” without “any fossils that can serve as missing links.”
Your attack on Ernst Mayr, and any scientist who challenges the current paradigm, is a mirror image of the way democrats eat their own when one steps off the reservation/plantation. It’s uncanny. It’s like an uncontrollable reflex.
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Sorry but this is complete stupidity from cognitive dissonance.
Oh look- you did it again. Don’t tell me it’s stupidity- tell me why it’s stupidity. Engage the material, instead of relying on the logical fallacy of dismissing it because you don’t like the source.
quote:
And there’s more to evolution than fossils - comparative anatomy, genetics, etc.
Ok. Show me how any of these eliminates God as a hypothesis. Show me how comparative anatomy could only be explained by UCA, and is not even remotely possible to be explained by a Universal Common Designer. Show me how Y chromosomal Adam and Mitochondrial Eve couldn’t in any way be affirming of the biblical concept of Adam and Eve.
I guess what I’m saying is, show me something that has no other possible explanation- like 2+2=4, or how two competing truth claims cannot both be true- and I’ll relent. At least until I find a logically coherent workaround. :lol:
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Giant list of fossils of transitional species
The link did not work for me. But I know- archaeopteryx, tiktaalik, etc. I’m just saying that it, at some point, requires belief- in the absence of firsthand knowledge. That doesn’t mean that you’re wrong. It doesn’t mean that I’m right. It just means what it means- that belief exists in the absence of proof. Regardless of the subject. Atheism is a belief. :cheers:
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/21/25 at 12:46 pm
quote:
You are careful to talk about proofs only in mathematics but when you say “theory” in relationship to scientific observation you misuse the word “theory”. A “theory” is an explanation of a body of scientific facts. Maybe you should use the word “hypothesis” if that’s what you mean
Fair point. Yes, I mean hypothesis. :cheers:
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Facts don’t care about Prodigal Son’s feelings
Agreed. Nor do they care about yours. It’s interesting that atheists always say this- as though it is only applicable to theists. What’s more comforting- having to account for your life before a perfect and holy God, or the sweet bliss of ceasing to exist? I think it’s obvious that the atheist position is a much more comfortable position (in life) than that of the theist. As they say, ignorance is bliss.
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There is no speculation on the general premise of the theory of biological evolution and common ancestry of all known life on earth
Sure there is. First, it speculates that the material world is all that exists. It speculates that nothing created everything, and that life spontaneously evolved from non-living materials in a cosmic accident. I know you’ll say that we’re not talking about the origin of life, but the primordial ooze theory (hypothesis?) is still taught in textbooks, and is the necessary precursor to UCA. The very foundation of all of your precious scientific facts, rests upon the belief (speculation) that there is no God. You see apparent design in biology, and speculate that it’s an illusion. You see similarities between apes and humans, and speculate that there must be a common ancestor instead of a common Creator. You see deformities and imperfections in life and nature, and speculatively attribute them random, undirected natural processes- rather than attribute them to the results of a fallen creation.
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Sure, Jan. Why don’t you post some skulls of Australopithecus Afarensis, Homo Habilis, and Homo Erectus.
Has science shown that we evolved from ape-like creatures?
When the human-like members of our genus Homo appear, they do so abruptly. A paper in the Journal of Molecular Biology and Evolution called the appearance of Homo sapiens “a genetic revolution” in which “no australopithecine species is obviously transitional.”16 In a 2004 book, the famed evolutionary biologist Ernst Mayr explained that “the earliest fossils of Homo, Homo rudolfensis and Homo erectus are separated from Australopithecus by a large, unbridged gap” without “any fossils that can serve as missing links.”17
The lack of fossil evidence for this hypothesized evolutionary transition was confirmed by three Harvard paleoanthropologists, who wrote:
“Of the various transitions that occurred during human evolution, the transition from Australopithecus to Homo was undoubtedly one of the most critical in its magnitude and consequences. As with many key evolutionary events, there is both good and bad news. First, the bad news is that many details of this transition are obscure because of the paucity of the fossil and archaeological records.”
And the good news? “Although we lack many details about exactly how, when, and where the transition occurred from Australopithecus to Homo,” the three went on, “we have sufficient data from before and after the transition to make some inferences about the overall nature of key changes that did occur.”19
In other words, the fossil record provides us with ape-like australopithecines (“before”) and human-like Homo (“after”), but not with fossils documenting a transition between them. In the absence of intermediaries, we’re left with “inferences” of a transition based strictly upon the assumption of Darwinian evolution. No wonder one commentator argued that if we take the fossil evidence at face value, it implies a “big bang theory” of the appearance of our genus Homo.20
Question: If literally all life is the result of one life form transitioning into another- why is the earth not littered with millions of transitional fossils?
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Make up your mind on proofs belonging in mathematics
Mathematics and logic.
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Taxonomy is but one of the many pieces of evidence supporting the overwhelming preponderance of evidence as explained by the theory of biological evolution of species.
Provide your best example and let’s discuss.
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Sounds like some Brigham Young type stuff there.
Clever deflection. Funny though.
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/18/25 at 9:55 pm
quote:
You are asserting as fact that which you have no evidence to support.
Lol. I’m not asserting that as fact. I literally said “theory.” I find it interesting, but whether it’s true or not has no bearing whatsoever on my relationship with God, or the fact that I have to go to work tomorrow.
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Sorry you can’t put two and two together because of your presuppositions, biases, and cognitive dissonance.
Translation:”Sorry you can’t come to the same speculative conclusion that I have, because your presuppositions, biases, and cognitive dissonance differ from my own.”
I’m glad you said “putting two and two together.” 2+2=4, all day every day everywhere all the time. It can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. Universal common ancestry can’t. You can make a compelling case, but you can’t prove it. Proofs exist only in mathematics and, interestingly, logic.
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An upright walking ape, just like me and you
That’s quite the imagination you’ve got there. :lol:
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You are a chordate, a mammal, a placental, a primate, a monkey, an ape, a hominid, a hominem, and a homo. :lol:
A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.
Taxonomy doesn’t prove common ancestry. It provides the same framework for belief in a common Designer as it does for a common ancestor.
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Yeah so how do the laws of physics change before the flood? You were just about to explain that.
I lean towards the theory that it changed after the flood. I think the water vapor canopy theories are interesting, though I know they have serious heat problems.
quote:
And he killed all those evil firstborn babies too!
Is that objectively wrong?
quote:
You might want to read some legitimate papers on that topic.
live science.com..
Modern men's genes suggest that something peculiar happened 5,000 to 7,000 years ago: Most of the male population across Asia, Europe and Africa seems to have died off, leaving behind just one man for every 17 women.
This so-called population "bottleneck" was first proposed in 2015, and since then, researchers have been trying to figure out what could've caused it.
One hypothesis held…
…while another idea suggested…
Now, a new paper,
…published… May 25 in the journal Nature Communications, offers yet another explanation
… might have…
That ratio of 17 females for every one male "struck us as being very extreme, and there must be another explanation,"
Nobody knows, but they know it can’t be God. How is it any different for you to cite science as proof that scientific materialism is true, than it is for me to quote scripture, or theology?
re: Young People Are Struggling With Weakening Critical Thinking Skills
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/18/25 at 9:58 am
quote:
Smart phones and social media ruined kids
I don’t disagree, but, where do kids get these things from?
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/9/25 at 8:17 pm
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So you presuppose that matter and energy don’t behave the same now as they did a few thousand years ago?
That’s the theory, yes. The flood was a catastrophic event, that changed the atmospheric conditions of earth, which affected all life.
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With no evidence?
We have a historical record- which in any other case, you would agree that a historical account is sufficient to base a hypothesis on. As far as evidence goes, we all have the same evidence. Interpretation will vary according to bias. Just because you refuse to accept any science conducted in an effort to prove a hypothesis that you disagree with- doesn’t affect its validity.
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From Homo Heidelbergensi
quote:
Homo Habilis
quote:
Homo Erectus
You sure know your homos! :rotflmao:
But seriously,
Homo Habilus is no bulletproof case. To say the least. A handful of bone fragments found in a pile. No two paleo anthropologists agree on which bones belong to what species. The only important thing to note here, is that you guys don’t change your mind (or the textbooks) in light of new discoveries (that challenge your presuppositions).
Heidelbergensis is no slam dunk, either.
Homo heidelbergensis was widely considered the most recent common ancestor of modern humans and Neanderthals, but this view has been increasingly disputed since the late 2010s
Home Erectus? Apparently there is a growing opinion among scientists that erectus was totally human. A study found that
A group of 202 modern Australian aborigines share an astonishing 14 of 17 homo erectus traits. The most recent evidence suggests that only a handful of traits separate these two presumed species of man, and even these are doubtful.
Lucy?- Not a human. All ape.
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if those aren’t the missing link, then nothing will convince you.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. The vast majority of these “discoveries” are a handful of scattered bones/fragments, and a whole lot of imagination. A bunch of educated men, making educated guesses. Then passing that off as fact, because of muh current consensus.
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If the hieroglyphics and cuneiform tablets
Simply a matter of dating. For one, some scholars believe that the flood may have been around 3500-5000bc. The oldest known cuneiform is from around 3500bc. I don’t know much about Egyptology, but everything I’ve read says the oldest known hieroglyphics are also from around 3500-4000bc. (Which is interesting, given a young earth view) Also, I don’t see any reason why some things like these couldn’t have survived the flood. And just because the Egyptians don’t mention the flood, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. In fact, just about every other ancient culture has a flood story that resembles that of Noah’s. That’s interesting, given the biblical relationship between the Jews and Egyptians. The God of Israel skull-dragged the entire Egyptian pantheon. They certainly would have had motive, as well as means, to erase this blemish from their history.
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proven by genetics
You mean like the population bottleneck that proves that all people descended from one man and one woman? Mitochondrial Eve? Or how the genetic mutation rate suggests a human history of just thousands of years?
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You are incapable to understanding acknowledging scientific fact, not from a lack of intelligence, but of willful cognitive dissonance
Because it’s not fact. It’s the inference to the best explanation. And it’s clearly biased.
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Did you see my notes on the trees verified to be over 5 and 10 thousand years old?
Yes. It presupposes uniformitarianism. It makes an assumption about when the candle was lit.
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I understand it (the Bible) much better than you. Sorry.
:rolleyes:
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You presuppose univocality as a dogma.
Yes. And then I test that hypothesis thoroughly by investigating your claims otherwise, and coming to the same conclusion that Christians have come to for 2000 years: the 66 books, by 40+ authors, over a span of 1500 years- is one overarching meta narrative. I concede that copies are not necessarily inspired or inerrant. But I don’t see where any copyist error calls into question anything of theological significance.
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You use scripture to interpret scripture as part of your dogma.
Guilty! Thanks for the compliment! :cheers:
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That’s a weakness on your part
How is it any different than you citing scholars and scientists?
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you don’t know what the original authors meant
The irony. :lol: That’s why we use scripture to interpret scripture. It’s a theological system of checks and balances, that is there to help guard against heresy. Anyone (ahem, you) can take small sections or single verses out of context, and derive all sorts of heretical views. I’m not claiming that it’s all cut and dry, simple. But, the information needed for salvation is accessible to all.
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You take much of it out of context. I don’t
:rotflmao: I might get some things wrong, but your sole purpose for reading it is to try to disprove it. Unlike Islam, you can’t do that without taking it out of context. Your rigid ideology is incapable of tolerating a coherent scripture. To you, it’s not whether or not the Bible is true, it’s that it must not be true.
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And I have the history and all the other Christian writings that didn’t make the cut under my belt and the Dead Sea scrolls too so I understand what was going on. You don’t.
:casty: You cling to anything that relieves you of reckoning your impending judgement. Yazidis, aliens, gnostics, Egyptians, ancient Mesopotamian religions- anything and everything you can find to bolster your case. You put your blind faith in any academic source that confirms your presuppositions.
re: So Democrats might walk out of the Joint Address?
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/4/25 at 7:09 pm
:onoz:
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/4/25 at 6:52 pm
quote:
They try to twist and bastardize known facts about evolution to fit their preconceived nonscientific beliefs about nature.
I don’t doubt that you can find some examples of this. There are many who use Christianity for personal enrichment. But I don’t think it’s reasonable to characterize every Christian scientist as continuously, knowingly engaging in deception. More accurately stated- this is how they interpret the evidence. Dr. James Tour comes to mind.
On the other hand, your side has quite a history of passing off outright lies as “facts” and then quietly (rarely, if at all) walking them back. The Miller/Urey experiment is another example.
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Let’s believe God created kinds, and that when they got off the ark, the animals went into a hyper-evolution mode and turned into all the species of today.
You mean like this?
This example shows that reproductive isolation, which typically develops over hundreds of generations, can be established in only three.
You’re not gonna like this. :lol: Answers in Genesis.
In a post-flood scenario, speciation likely occurred in a relatively linear pattern. As animals spread from Ararat, new species would have emerged naturally as species moved away from each other and into varying habitats. The founder effect would have had a significant impact on these new populations. Variable alleles would have been uncommon in these original small populations. Due to genetic drift associated with the founder effect, fixed traits would have appeared quickly in populations, making them differentiate relatively easily. Each of these new populations likely could interbreed with their close relatives, at least in the beginning, resembling a peripatric model, except for both populations initially being small. As populations dispersed into new habitats, environmental pressures would fix even more traits, further diversifying the population until it either no longer could or no longer wished to regularly successfully interbreed with other related populations. Thus, in a very short space of time after Ararat, possibly only a few years for short-generation kinds, there would begin to be distinct species.
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You are closely related to monkeys, lesser to dogs and deer, lesser still to kangaroos, lesser still to duck billed platypus, lesser still to chickens and ducks, lesser still to frogs and fish, and even still you are distantly related to bananas and watermelon and aspen trees.
You see these similarities as evidence for UCA. I see them as evidence of a common Creator.
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So what? Ever heard of God of the Gaps fallacy?
There’s a difference between saying “God did it. No need to investigate further.” And, “God did it. Let’s try to figure out how.”
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Even if we were to somehow show that some higher power that you might call a deity started life on this planet, it still wouldn’t make your Bible any more factual.
No, but it sure would wreck your foundation. :lol:
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don’t know what the hell you’re talking about.
Uniformitarianism is a geological principle that suggests the same natural laws and processes that operate today have always operated in the past and will continue to do so in the future. It emphasizes that the present is the key to understanding the past, particularly in the context of Earth's geological history.
This is the assumption that your worldview hinges on. If you walk into a room, and find a candle already burning- can science determine when the candle was lit?
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Quit saying I’m arguing from authority. The facts are the facts not because some guy says it’s true, but only if they are evidently true.
Prove it.
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But also consider how the Chinese and Vietnamese also have calendars with the year 1 being way older than the alleged time of Noah’s flood
Same thing. I doubt they have calendar that is 10,000 years old. They just have a calendar, and a history, that claims to be 10,000 years old. I would bet that if you applied the same level of scrutiny to these claims, as you do Christianity, you’d have no choice but to dismiss them as false. But you don’t. You latch onto anything that supports your beliefs. Just. Like. Me. And. Foo. :rotflmao:
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The ancient Egyptian solar calendar was started in what is our 4241 BCE on the Gregorian calendar. Yes in 4241 the Egyptians had a writing system and they were keeping track of the years and the sun so they could know when to plant and harvest.
A calendar is not a writing system. The earliest known writing is Sumerian cuneiform from around 3500 BC.
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According to most biblical types, Noah’s flood occurred around 2300-2400 BCE. In other words, about 400 years after the Egyptians build their first pyramid. What’s funny is the Egyptians didn’t know anything about the great flood of Noah as they just kept building their pyramids like nothing happened. They build their great pyramid of Khufu around 2500BCE and the last major pyramid was built around 1500BCE. They were writing hieroglyphics in 3200BCE all the way to the time of Alexander the Great. Same calendar, same writing system, same people (using archaeology and genetics from sequenced mummies), same pyramids before “Noah’s flood” and after… It’s like the flood never happened
When was the candle lit?
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You know I know it well. And you know that I know the history of the Bible and early Christianity better than you and everyone else on this site.
Not really, no. You know how to use it for your own purposes, but you clearly don’t understand it.
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The foundation of their entire religion is creationism and it is certainly what “Jesus” would have believed if he was a historical person.
Jesus did teach it, and I do believe it. While I think it’s possible that it’s allegorical, and that the truth it conveys is not necessarily dependent upon it being a literal, historical account of actual people and events, I do agree that abandoning the literal reading and denying its historicity can eventually lead to a compromised and impotent faith, and is often born out of a desire to neuter the rest of the Bible. So, in that regard, you are correct. It is foundational to the practice of Christianity. But, it is not a requirement for salvation.
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If everything surrounding Christ is made up myth, then why believe in Christ’s salvation being anything but a myth too?
There’s more than enough evidence for the historicity of Christ’s life, death and resurrection. You just refuse to accept it and cling to fringe theories of book salesmen because it supports your preferred hypothesis.
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I think you mean “Gnosis”
No. I was referring to your belief- not your knowledge. :lol:
quote:
ETA: just to be clear, I’m not calling you filthy, or a Democrat.
No worries, friend. It never crossed my mind. :cheers:
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/4/25 at 5:47 pm
(No Message)
re: 57 Maine School Districts Hide Kids’ Gender Dysphoria From Parents
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/3/25 at 10:29 pm
quote:
I agree, but I don’t like where you are headed…
:lol:
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Evolution of species is factual based on the overwhelming preponderance of evidence
I’m not arguing against speciation. Neither are ID proponents or creationists. I’m arguing against universal common ancestry- not because I need it to be false, not because I think I can prove it, but because I don’t think you or anyone else can prove it without coming to a point of belief about “how things must have been.” I also would argue that there is no known mechanism by which life could originate from non-life.
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Only those who ignore that evidence
No one is ignoring evidence. We’re all interpreting the same evidence, differently, coming to unfalsifiable conclusions, and using our own arguments from authority as the foundation for our beliefs. The only difference is, the theist readily acknowledges that.
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We also know Noah’s flood not only could not have happened, but we know it did not happen using all we have learned about our planet with the scientific method.
Because you assume uniformitarianism- that things must always have been just as they are now. Unfalsifiable argument from authority. See?
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used the 7000 year old Yazidi calendar the other day that you didn’t like.
I liked it :dunno: I told you how I found it very interesting. It’s obviously influenced by Judaism, Christianity and Islam (among many others). Just because they have a calendar that says the earth is 7000 years old, doesn’t mean they have a 7000 year old calendar.
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What I want to have happened is irrelevant.
As far as how it affects objective truth? I agree. But, as far as how it influences the way you interpret reality- it is primary.
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My fault for getting them confused
I can see how they are the same , from your perspective.
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I know the Bible so well,
No offense, but you know the Bible like a democrat knows the constitution- only to twist it, as a means to get what you want.
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and those “theistic evolutionists” must not.
They start with Genesis as allegory. Im not really a fan. But insomuch as salvation does not depend on your view on Adam and Eve, I’m inclined to hear the reasoning behind it.
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The 6 day creation and young earth is integral to Judaism and Christianity
The only thing that’s integral to Christianity is Christ. Duh. If you’d quit feeding your fantasies with (your unjust judgement of) the difficult passages in the OT, and spend a little time in the NT, you’d realize that.
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If you take creationism out of Christianity, you don’t have the same religion anymore. It’s all or nothing.
I disagree that it is necessary to hold a literal view of Genesis in order to be a Christian. You don’t have to believe in a literal 6 x 24hr day creation to understand Christ’s work on the cross. Salvation is a gift from God- not something you earn in any way. Your affinity for Gnosticism is showing. :lol:
re: DOGE dividend has been added to US debt clock
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/2/25 at 8:33 pm
quote:
As long as it's going to american citizens I'm fine with it.
I’m not. No one who didn’t pay taxes should get a single red cent.
re: Flickering LED bulbs
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/2/25 at 8:20 pm
I agree with Clames on the possibility of harmonics/interference from other devices on the circuit. I would add that you absolutely should check the wiring connections- at the fixture, the switch, and the panel at least. It could be a failing switch or circuit breaker as well.
I hate troubleshooting LEDs. Dirty power/harmonics, high/ low voltage, high/low temperature, neutral current, and improper grounding are really the only things that I can think of that cause them to fail prematurely. The real problem is that each of those things can be like a needle in a haystack. If it was my house, I would verify there are no loose connections, everything was grounded- and put some higher quality bulbs in; just to see if that fixes it. If it doesn’t, then start eliminating the other options- one by one.
I hate troubleshooting LEDs. Dirty power/harmonics, high/ low voltage, high/low temperature, neutral current, and improper grounding are really the only things that I can think of that cause them to fail prematurely. The real problem is that each of those things can be like a needle in a haystack. If it was my house, I would verify there are no loose connections, everything was grounded- and put some higher quality bulbs in; just to see if that fixes it. If it doesn’t, then start eliminating the other options- one by one.
re: Why Is The United States So Spiritually Poor?
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/2/25 at 2:03 pm
quote:
Why is the United States so spiritually poor?
Pride: a high or inordinate opinion of one's own dignity, importance, merit, or superiority, whether as cherished in the mind or as displayed in bearing, conduct, etc.
Combine that with the erosion of our moral guardrails (that Christianity provides) through the multifaceted attacks on Christianity (“science”, “academia,” Hollywood, the “new” atheists :lol:), and the next thing you know you’re way off course and the wheels are coming off.
John 3:19-21
19“This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil. 20“For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21“But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God.”
When you also consider that 9A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough.… that’s the long answer. Well, medium length.
The short answer is that we are reaping what we’ve sowed.
re: How to make life slow down
Posted by Prodigal Son on 3/1/25 at 4:45 pm
quote:
What are you guys doing on the weekend after a long work week?
Build a fire from scratch. Process your own fire wood. Cut your own grass. Listen to some music and relax while you “work.” Those things are cheap, easy, and time consuming (and it’s a good workout, and you’ll get some sun). If you wanna spend some money, go hunting, rebuild an old truck, home improvement, etc. The trick is to do something that you enjoy, or find a way to enjoy what you do. Either way. Happiness is a choice.
It also bears noting that if you’re a married father of children who are still in the home- you shouldn’t expect to have much free time. I was told and have learned to appreciate that fact. It is a badge of honor. If you aren’t a married father, then that’s what you should be trying to figure out on your spare time.
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