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Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:50 pm to sms151t
quote:
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Would the outrage be the same if a man who was 17 wearing steel toed work boots, had a shaved head, with suspenders, was walking down the street and got shot during an argument?
Is the man in question black?
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:51 pm to sms151t
No. A bystander, not a co-conspirator, is not legally liable or required to step in and stop said crime.
Morally is a whole other bag of worms that I'm not opening.
Morally is a whole other bag of worms that I'm not opening.
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:51 pm to AUnite
quote:
Zimmerman isn't a cop and it doesn't matter WTF he thought might happen.
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:51 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
Only if Zimmerman initiated with potentially deadly force would this hold true. If Zimmerman approached Martin with anything other than potentially life-threatening force and then Martin took it to that level (aka "getting his arse beat") Zimmerman is justified in defending himself with his weapon.
This is correct.
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:53 pm to AUnite
quote:
Florida (and most other states) do not require a citizen to step in and stop a crime.
So what?
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:54 pm to AUnite
I have no clue to how to handle morality of incident
I wouldn't be certain if Good Samaritan law could be applied in some offbeat way here. I think it would be interesting to see if an attorney played that card.
I wouldn't be certain if Good Samaritan law could be applied in some offbeat way here. I think it would be interesting to see if an attorney played that card.
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:55 pm to Roger Klarvin
Who cares what color the man is?
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:55 pm to diddydirtyAubie
quote:
why did Trayvon call him Zimmerman a creepy arse cracka?
Because he was being followed by a man in the dark?
It's not like he would go to Zimmerman and say "Howdy neighbor! Nice night for a walk." It wasn't needed, but it doesn't mean that he should have been punished for that. It's not like he called Zimmerman a cracker. Also I would say the same thing if a white girl was being stalked by a black guy, or something like that. A person is scared in that position, and will not be thinking clearly. quote:
why was Trayvon suspended from school?
Why was Zimmerman arrested for assulting a police officer? Why did his wife issue a restraining order citing domestic violence? What does any of this have to do with the current case?
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:57 pm to rtr14
quote:
It's not like he called Zimmerman a cracker.
that's exactly what he was called though.
quote:
Why was Zimmerman arrested for assulting a police officer? Why did his wife issue a restraining order citing domestic violence? What does any of this have to do with the current case?
why did Zimmerman have 17 other calls of reporting suspicious activity without any incidents?
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:58 pm to sms151t
Good Samaritan law doesn't apply here, but had Martin been intending to commit a crime and Zimmerman stopped him he would have been within his right to stop him. He isn't required to, but it wasn't illegal for him to follow Martin. He was only violating the law if he initiated a fight or drew his gun without cause.
I have a CHL and they are very clear about what you can and cannot do with it. If he drew it prior to Martin obviously attacking him, someone else or attempting to break and enter he is guilty of at least manslaughter.
I have a CHL and they are very clear about what you can and cannot do with it. If he drew it prior to Martin obviously attacking him, someone else or attempting to break and enter he is guilty of at least manslaughter.
Posted on 6/27/13 at 11:58 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
quote:
Zimmerman isn't a cop and it doesn't matter WTF he thought might happen.
She's exactly right.
And no, you can't be the initial aggressor in a fight and then claim self-defense. Not in Florida, anyway. Pretty sure about this. Zimemrman claims Trayvon started it, and is using self-defense.
It's a shame Travon isn't here to comment on how it started.
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:00 am to semotruman
As I stated earlier only two facts we know
One man is dead.
One man is on trial for murder.
One man is dead.
One man is on trial for murder.
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:00 am to semotruman
quote:
It's a shame Travon isn't here to comment on how it started.
frick Trayvon
ETA: frick Zimmerman. frick Rachel. frick ERRBODY
This post was edited on 6/28/13 at 12:04 am
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:01 am to sms151t
quote:
Who cares what color the man is?
You asked if the outrage would be similar. A man deemed a "white Hispanic" shot a black kid. If he had shot a white kid it wouldn't be news. Had he been black and Trayvon white, it wouldn't be news. Had he been a "dark Hispanic" and Trayvon white, it wouldn't be news.
Lets cut through the bullshite: Regardless of whether or not Zimmerman is guilty of a heinous crime (and he might be) this case is national news because the victim was black and the shooter "white" (according to the media narrative).
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:03 am to semotruman
quote:
And no, you can't be the initial aggressor in a fight and then claim self-defense. Not in Florida, anyway. Pretty sure about this. Zimemrman claims Trayvon started it, and is using self-defense.
You can be the initial aggressor and claim self defense. The problem is determining when the threshold for imminent danger is crossed, and that's where it gets complicated.
If they were just in a fight and Martin was punching Zimmerman, then no, he couldn't claim self defense. You can't use deadly force just because you're losing a fight.
I think once Zimmerman's head began being pounded into the concrete it crossed a line where you can defend yourself with deadly force. Having your head pounded into pavement can be considered deadly force, so meeting that with deadly force can be considered justifiable.
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:04 am to diddydirtyAubie
quote:
that's exactly what he was called though.
Like I said earlier, if you are being followed in the dark, you aren't exactly going to be friendly to them if they confront you. This goes for anyone, of any race.
quote:
why did Zimmerman have 17 other calls of reporting suspicious activity without any incidents?
Did he follow any of those suspects even when the 911 dispatcher told him not to? Why would this time be different?
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:05 am to semotruman
quote:
And no, you can't be the initial aggressor in a fight and then claim self-defense
If by "fight" you man "jump", then sure. If Zimmermen went and hit him in the face or pounced on him without provocation it cant be self-defense. If Trayvon feared for his life because of Zimmerman's initiation, Zimmerman is guilty.
If Zimmerman yelled at him to stop or tried to talk to him or told him he had called the police or initiated the incident in any other manner ( even grabbing him by the arm or something), then of course he can claim self-defense. initiation doesn't deprive one of the right to defend themselves if the other party takes it to the next level.
This post was edited on 6/28/13 at 12:07 am
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:05 am to sms151t
You know what? As much as I'd love to stay here arguing with your folks all night, I have better things to do. I hope that if someone follows you some dark night because they don't like what you're wearing that you don't get shot when you ask them why. 
Posted on 6/28/13 at 12:06 am to semotruman
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