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re: R.I.P. George H.W. Bush
Posted on 12/3/18 at 2:04 pm to KSGamecock
Posted on 12/3/18 at 2:04 pm to KSGamecock
quote:
we're still feeling the impact of decisions he made.
He helped cover up Spiro Agnew's corruption during Watergate, and was up to his neck in the Iran-Contra affair. As nice as he was to people, those 2 things would have gotten everyday people thrown in jail.
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Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:05 pm to KSGamecock
I'm a Democrat and don't love everything he's done. He's certainly not above criticism. That being said I don't see the point in bringing up every grievance I've ever had immediately following his passing. I guess all norms are out the window these days. Hope you feel better post rant. 
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:10 pm to jbond
quote:
I guess all norms are out the window these days
Here's a 1500s woodcut of Lutherans farting at the Pope
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:27 pm to KSGamecock
I see what you're trying to say... That norms have always been pushed back against and it's hardly a new occurrence. You seem to think I mean norms in general, when I was specifically referring to civility and respect in American politics. How hard is it to just not say all the bad shite about him stored up in your head for a couple days? I'm sure your opinions are valid, but is now really the time? I'm not defending him or every decision he made. I just liked it better when people waited for the body to cool down before going in on a late president.
Of course this is a message board for sharing opinions, so continue shitting on him if you want, it's all very edgy.
Of course this is a message board for sharing opinions, so continue shitting on him if you want, it's all very edgy.
This post was edited on 12/3/18 at 3:30 pm
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:36 pm to jbond
I get that you mean norms in American politics, were he a private citizen I probably wouldn't do it. My issue with you is that the "norm" you're defending is conversation stifling and silly.
What? You want me to come out of the blue and start a thread about HW in October 2021?
That's stupid.
A politician is in the news, people are going to talk about him. If you think this board is "edgy" you need to browse the internet more and if the mundane conversation in this thread offends you then go ahead RA it and have Lew ignore it or better yet just don't read it.
What? You want me to come out of the blue and start a thread about HW in October 2021?
That's stupid.
A politician is in the news, people are going to talk about him. If you think this board is "edgy" you need to browse the internet more and if the mundane conversation in this thread offends you then go ahead RA it and have Lew ignore it or better yet just don't read it.
This post was edited on 12/3/18 at 3:38 pm
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:39 pm to KSGamecock
All the shite he did is a moot point now and apropos of nothing except his passing. Noted that you want to bash him while he's still trending, I guess I see the value in that over waiting a bit?
This post was edited on 12/3/18 at 3:40 pm
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:43 pm to jbond
quote:
All the shite he did is a moot point
That simply isn't true.
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:43 pm to jbond
I'm gay and dislike how he and Reagan both handled the AIDS crisis. That means jack shite today though and these used to be the rare moment where we came together, or at least pretended to come together for a couple days. Maybe it was only ever pretense. I guess I think, even if it's a bit of a show, it still has values. If we can't come together when a president passes, what can we as Americans come together on these days? Even football is today politicized FFS
This post was edited on 12/3/18 at 3:44 pm
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:48 pm to KSGamecock
Its entirely possible to rail against NAFTA or whatever policy gripe without framing it as he's dead, but he wasn't that great to begin with. If his stances on issues as president over 20 years ago aren't moot, then what's the practical value of using them to critique him today? The issues themselves are not moot, but using his views from 2 decades ago to criticize him today has no practical value.
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:54 pm to jbond
quote:
I'm gay and dislike how he and Reagan both handled the AIDS crisis. That means jack shite today though
I'm not well versed in that but I would venture to guess that AIDS spread more, had a greater stigma, and more people died because of how they handled it. That does mean shite today, it's still being felt.
Look at his approach to the Middle East, specifically his endorsement and enforcement of the Carter Doctrine. His stationing of troops in SA was fuel for AQ and led to 9/11. His mentoring of neo-cons like Wolfowitz and Cheney placed them in positions to get us in to Iraq a decade later and everything that has come since then, ISIS and so on.
That shite matters. A president's death is the perfect time to review his record and how it has affected things, if anything it should be the norm.
quote:
If we can't come together when a president passes, what can we as Americans come together on these days? Even football is today politicized FFS
You're probably right here but this is the least of it and maybe the most healthy part of it.
This post was edited on 12/3/18 at 4:00 pm
Posted on 12/3/18 at 3:56 pm to jbond
I think at our cores we probably have different ideas about the presidency as an office. You have a certain veneration for it that I don't share. I think it might be a generational thing.
Posted on 12/3/18 at 4:00 pm to jbond
quote:
If his stances on issues as president over 20 years ago aren't moot, then what's the practical value of using them to critique him today?
Because he was instrumental in debasing the executive office to the point where we barely bat an eye at the rampant corruption and sometimes illegal activity coming from that branch today. He was heavily involved in the Watergate scandal, and the efforts to cover it up. He was heavily involved in the Iran-Contra affair in the 80's while VP. These things have ramifications that have impacted how we view the executive branch of the US today.
Now, I don't put all the blame at his feet, but if he was such a great man of principle, where were those principles when he had the opportunity to apply them to the betterment of this country? Further, because we've long ignored his faults and been reticent to discuss them, it helped give rise to his son's political career and his ascension to the WH, where he spearheaded a misguided war we'll be paying for for decades.
Posted on 12/3/18 at 4:04 pm to KSGamecock
I think I got a little rhetorically carried away, repercussions of his decisions are almost certainly still felt today. I guess his admin feels distant enough that for me that I'd rather just indulge in some kumbaya togetherness
Posted on 12/3/18 at 4:10 pm to jbond
Fair enough, I respect your candor.
Posted on 12/3/18 at 4:54 pm to KSGamecock
Posted on 12/3/18 at 5:49 pm to jbond
Should we like, wait a certain amount of time before we tell people how we feel about the guy? Well, here's a preview: he was a bad guy. Big time. I could sit here and list shite out that dude was responsible for for a frickin hour. And most of it is bad.
Condolences to his grieving family.
Condolences to his grieving family.
Posted on 12/7/18 at 6:51 pm to Vols&Shaft83
JFK says hello.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 12:03 am to BoarEd
quote:
Should we like, wait a certain amount of time before we tell people how we feel about the guy? Well, here's a preview: he was a bad guy. Big time. I could sit here and list shite out that dude was responsible for for a frickin hour. And most of it is bad.
OK, now do it without the same batshit crazy tinfoil hat crap the right does with the Clinton Body Count.
The people who believe this stupid shite on the internet are just debilitatingly frustrating.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 7:48 am to jbond
quote:
I'm sad you've forgotten how to mourn a president properly like an adult American
I don't think I'll ever mourn a president.
Posted on 12/8/18 at 11:04 am to Ag Zwin
quote:
OK, now do it without the same batshit crazy tinfoil hat crap the right does with the Clinton Body Count.
The people who believe this stupid shite on the internet are just debilitatingly frustrating.
You're kidding, right? The guy was a blatant war profiteer. His bio reads like pure fantasy ala Manchurian Candidate. A made man from the University of Yale doesn't actually go fight wars. Don't tell me you believe that bullshite.
He was responsible for the death of JFK and he was behind the assassination attempt on Reagan. He was also most likely behind the events of 9-11 as well. After all, that event allowed us to go back in and "finish" the war he had started a decade prior.
Get your head out of the sand. These people running our country are criminals.
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