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re: I want God to be real.
Posted on 1/18/15 at 11:44 pm to Roger Klarvin
Posted on 1/18/15 at 11:44 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
Correct, now explain how you know that the universe did not begin as a product of natural processes.
If one is claiming that the universe was created from nothing by nothing, then the burden of proof is to offer evidence that such a creative occurrence is a natural occurrence.
Contrarily, if one is claiming that the universe was created by a natural occurrence from something, then the burden of proof would be to identify the natural source for the something from which the universe was created.
Anything less would be introducing supernatural creation.
2
Posted on 1/18/15 at 11:51 pm to beejon
quote:
If one is claiming that the universe was created from nothing by nothing, then the burden of proof is to offer evidence that such a creative occurrence is a natural occurrence.
He didn't claim that it did happen that way, he claimed that you have to prove that it did not or could not have happened that way.
Right now, the question is agnostic as in: It cannot be known at this time or there is no evidence.
You are saying that it was caused by something supernatural, therefore it must be proven or you must provide evidence that there is something supernatural.
If it is outside of the "natural world", then how can you measure it? Could you ever prove it? Is your position reliant only on your faith that it is true?
We're saying we don't know, you're saying you do.
And doing a very bad job at arguing, which is kind of why William Lane Craig lost all credibility a while back.
Posted on 1/19/15 at 12:07 am to beejon
quote:
If one is claiming that the universe was created from nothing by nothing, then the burden of proof is to offer evidence that such a creative occurrence is a natural occurrence.
Contrarily, if one is claiming that the universe was created by a natural occurrence from something, then the burden of proof would be to identify the natural source for the something from which the universe was created.
Anything less would be introducing supernatural creation.
First, I never said it happened that way. I was illustrating the absurdity of claiming the universe must exist due to a supernatural cause. The fact is that you believe it has a supernatural cause, and that there is no other possible explanation, because you lack both the desire and the knowledge to believe anything else.
Second, and this goes back to you lacking the knowledge most likely due to a lack of pursuit for obvious reasons, there are widely held ideas in the field of astrophysics about "nothing coming from nothing" as an explanation for existence.
In what I believe is a futile attempt to educate, I offer you this:
LINK
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