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re: The Unpile Personal Foul LSU/PSU
Posted on 1/3/10 at 12:15 am to arrakis
Posted on 1/3/10 at 12:15 am to arrakis
If that happened at any other point in the game it would be a penalty. So it was a penalty. It is always some kinda of bad call with lsu have y'all ever lost a game because you just lost?
1
Posted on 1/3/10 at 11:51 am to thehucklebuck
PSU fan here to offer a LONGWINDED perspective from the other side.
1) Should DEFINITELY been a delay of game on Bowman, NO question.
2) Once LSU player drags Bowman, ref has no choice but to throw flag, ESPECIALLY because he tried to push him away & let go of Bowman 2 times before your guy actually dragged him (watch replay online & see for yourself), so based on what happened, he has to call 15yd PF on LSU.
3) Should never have gotten to that point because it should never have taken that long for the refs to either stop the clock to clear the pile or call the 5yd delay penalty on us (and I agree with Bowman that sacrificing 5 penalty yds to get 10-15 seconds off the clock in that situation is absolutely worth it). Is ref's fricking job to handle sanbagging like that in those situations (and please don't be homer & pretend YOU wouldn't have tried to waste a little time if YOU had been up with so little time left) your guy got frustrated because idiot ref wasn't getting off his arse & doing his job.
4)This call by itself didn't cost LSU the game, it cost LSU 15yds and 2 or 3 plays that still would have to have been converted plus the kick itself, not a sure thing at all on that field
5) With Les's poor play calling/clock management, I don't know if it even made that much of a difference, e.g. middle screen with no TOs left ?!!! Does he even know that you can stop the clock if you throw to the sides? If middle is empty, at least try to gain more than 10yds so you can line up while they stop clock to move chains & spike it on 1st down. Also, clock stops for a penalty, WTF was up with letting 10 seconds run off clock before snap on next play?
6) Officiating was HORRIBLE for BOTH sides, LSU O-Line was holding on EVERY single play (even tackled Jared Odrick from behind twice), and our boys did more than their fair share of holding as well. Saw at least two block in the backs during returns not called on LSU. We had a gift 1st down where we only made 9yds but they gave it to us. On our final offensive series, on 3rd & goal from the 3 your DT was LINED UP offsides and knocks our center on his arse before ball is even snapped, yet flag was throw on US?
7) As for conditions,that field really held back BOTH teams, Holiday would probably have scored at least once, but on a dry field we probably exploit our running advantage by an extra 100yds and hold onto the ball even longer, giving you fewer opportunities. We definitely would have have turned some of those FGs into TDs, and IMO the passing games offset (we BOTH dropped like 10 easy catches and 4 sure INTs EACH). Also, on a dry field, we sack your QB at least 3 times, guy with the ball knows where he's going but defender has to push off wet soggy field to REACT to other guy's move.
8) Finally, for all the people who thought LSU would win by 40, you didn't play the Big Ten (or 06/07 tOSU), you played 09 Penn State; shockingly enough, we TOO have people who can run the 40 in less than 6 seconds. We DON'T lineup 11 6'5" 350lb cornfed tractors, we're actually a spread/finesse offense, our only two losses came to teams with bigger/stronger horses in the lines that overpowered us. I obviously don't expect you to be familiar with our recruiting, but we have recruited a decent amount of speed/skill the last 6-7 years, and that's why over the last 5 years we have 51 wins, including new year's day bowl wins over southern teams that were supposed to r@pe us with their speed like 05 FSU, 06 Tennessee and 09 you guys. We are 10-3 in bowls since joining the Big Ten in 1993, including a 5-3 against the SEC, so while our victory wasn't a SURE thing/done deal by any means, it was hardly outside the realms of possibility. You WEREN'T playing Indiana, you were playing a team that has averaged 10+ wins over the last 5 years and has the highest bowl winning % in history, including 4-1 over that 5 year span losing only to a semi-pro USC (who's players take PAY CUTS to go to the NFL) playing a 'neutral site' game 8 miles from their fricking campus.
In conclusion, I was actually impressed by LSU's players, you need to upgrade your lines but your skill players can play with ANYONE, incomplete grade on QB and RBs because your O-Line didn't do anything for them/plus RB injuries. Your D-Coordinator actually wasn't that bad (EXCELLENT redzone defense, let them do what they want between the 20s, yards don't kill you, TDs do), but O guy needs to get a clue. Les is good for 9-11 wins a year, but he won't get you to the SECCG, let alone the BCS MNC. You will finish 2nd to Bama next year in West but will be better than East champion and probably go to Sugar Bowl after Bama de-pants East Champ in CCG, worst case you end up in Cowboys Stadium for Cotton Bowl. Good luck next year, all LSU fans I met at game were classy/knowledgeable, GREAT fanbase,
1) Should DEFINITELY been a delay of game on Bowman, NO question.
2) Once LSU player drags Bowman, ref has no choice but to throw flag, ESPECIALLY because he tried to push him away & let go of Bowman 2 times before your guy actually dragged him (watch replay online & see for yourself), so based on what happened, he has to call 15yd PF on LSU.
3) Should never have gotten to that point because it should never have taken that long for the refs to either stop the clock to clear the pile or call the 5yd delay penalty on us (and I agree with Bowman that sacrificing 5 penalty yds to get 10-15 seconds off the clock in that situation is absolutely worth it). Is ref's fricking job to handle sanbagging like that in those situations (and please don't be homer & pretend YOU wouldn't have tried to waste a little time if YOU had been up with so little time left) your guy got frustrated because idiot ref wasn't getting off his arse & doing his job.
4)This call by itself didn't cost LSU the game, it cost LSU 15yds and 2 or 3 plays that still would have to have been converted plus the kick itself, not a sure thing at all on that field
5) With Les's poor play calling/clock management, I don't know if it even made that much of a difference, e.g. middle screen with no TOs left ?!!! Does he even know that you can stop the clock if you throw to the sides? If middle is empty, at least try to gain more than 10yds so you can line up while they stop clock to move chains & spike it on 1st down. Also, clock stops for a penalty, WTF was up with letting 10 seconds run off clock before snap on next play?
6) Officiating was HORRIBLE for BOTH sides, LSU O-Line was holding on EVERY single play (even tackled Jared Odrick from behind twice), and our boys did more than their fair share of holding as well. Saw at least two block in the backs during returns not called on LSU. We had a gift 1st down where we only made 9yds but they gave it to us. On our final offensive series, on 3rd & goal from the 3 your DT was LINED UP offsides and knocks our center on his arse before ball is even snapped, yet flag was throw on US?
7) As for conditions,that field really held back BOTH teams, Holiday would probably have scored at least once, but on a dry field we probably exploit our running advantage by an extra 100yds and hold onto the ball even longer, giving you fewer opportunities. We definitely would have have turned some of those FGs into TDs, and IMO the passing games offset (we BOTH dropped like 10 easy catches and 4 sure INTs EACH). Also, on a dry field, we sack your QB at least 3 times, guy with the ball knows where he's going but defender has to push off wet soggy field to REACT to other guy's move.
8) Finally, for all the people who thought LSU would win by 40, you didn't play the Big Ten (or 06/07 tOSU), you played 09 Penn State; shockingly enough, we TOO have people who can run the 40 in less than 6 seconds. We DON'T lineup 11 6'5" 350lb cornfed tractors, we're actually a spread/finesse offense, our only two losses came to teams with bigger/stronger horses in the lines that overpowered us. I obviously don't expect you to be familiar with our recruiting, but we have recruited a decent amount of speed/skill the last 6-7 years, and that's why over the last 5 years we have 51 wins, including new year's day bowl wins over southern teams that were supposed to r@pe us with their speed like 05 FSU, 06 Tennessee and 09 you guys. We are 10-3 in bowls since joining the Big Ten in 1993, including a 5-3 against the SEC, so while our victory wasn't a SURE thing/done deal by any means, it was hardly outside the realms of possibility. You WEREN'T playing Indiana, you were playing a team that has averaged 10+ wins over the last 5 years and has the highest bowl winning % in history, including 4-1 over that 5 year span losing only to a semi-pro USC (who's players take PAY CUTS to go to the NFL) playing a 'neutral site' game 8 miles from their fricking campus.
In conclusion, I was actually impressed by LSU's players, you need to upgrade your lines but your skill players can play with ANYONE, incomplete grade on QB and RBs because your O-Line didn't do anything for them/plus RB injuries. Your D-Coordinator actually wasn't that bad (EXCELLENT redzone defense, let them do what they want between the 20s, yards don't kill you, TDs do), but O guy needs to get a clue. Les is good for 9-11 wins a year, but he won't get you to the SECCG, let alone the BCS MNC. You will finish 2nd to Bama next year in West but will be better than East champion and probably go to Sugar Bowl after Bama de-pants East Champ in CCG, worst case you end up in Cowboys Stadium for Cotton Bowl. Good luck next year, all LSU fans I met at game were classy/knowledgeable, GREAT fanbase,
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