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re: Why would you fire the DC?
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:00 pm to BarberitosDawg
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:00 pm to BarberitosDawg
Probably because his defense is so bad that it skipped right past adequate and mediocre and into liability stages. Maybe because if we aren't getting gashed through the air one season we are getting devastated by the run game. Maybe because he also is one of the highest paid coordinators in college and he has yet to prove any of that worth. Or even come close. Maybe because he embarrasses the university with his antics when he's getting caught giving the choke signal or trying to fight coaches. Maybe because he's a bad husband. Maybe because he's a miserable frickhead who probably eats his own children. Maybe because he hasn't seen his pecker in over a decade. Maybe because he's an a-hole but not a cool one like Saban or Spurrier but more like Kiffin.
That said I am slowly but surely learning that Georgia focuses far more on the balance sheet than they do the W/L column and the opinion you showed in your OP is the AD's opinion. I find it disgusting but that's the program I was born into. Idk, I just am more of a fire at will kind of guy, continue to burn everything to the ground until something works. Chose the wrong University for that I guess
That said I am slowly but surely learning that Georgia focuses far more on the balance sheet than they do the W/L column and the opinion you showed in your OP is the AD's opinion. I find it disgusting but that's the program I was born into. Idk, I just am more of a fire at will kind of guy, continue to burn everything to the ground until something works. Chose the wrong University for that I guess
This post was edited on 12/5/13 at 1:02 pm
1
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:36 pm to DawgsLife
I'm all for adjustments being made for the 2nd half of play. That's what everyone should do based on how the 1st half went.
However, several times the 2nd half adjustments came way too late while other times it looked like we didn't even make any.
Points allowed:
Op: 1st - 2nd - Tot
CU: 21 - 17 - 38
SC: 24 - 6 - 30
NT: 14 - 7 - 21
LSU: 17 - 24 - 41
TN: 3 - 28 - 31
MZ: 28 - 13 - 41
Van: 14 - 17 - 31
FL: 3 - 17 - 20
AS: 6 - 0 - 6
AU: 27 - 16 - 43
KY: 10 - 7 - 17
GT: 20 - 14 - 34
Avg: 15.6 - 13.8 - 29.4
In 8 games, our opponents scored more points in the first half than the 2nd. Games of note are Auburn, Mizz, and Clemson, where we were playing from behind and lost. Nearly lost to GT, as well.
The other 4 games, our opponents scored more points in the 2nd half than the 1st. Games of note here are FL, Vandy, and TN, where we either lost or nearly lost.
CTG had more games where teams scored more in the 1st half than the 2nd, but in several of those games, we either lost or nearly lost and needed some last-minute heroics by our offense to win.
When you look at the averages, we only "adjusted" about 2 points between the 1st and 2nd halves.
However, several times the 2nd half adjustments came way too late while other times it looked like we didn't even make any.
Points allowed:
Op: 1st - 2nd - Tot
CU: 21 - 17 - 38
SC: 24 - 6 - 30
NT: 14 - 7 - 21
LSU: 17 - 24 - 41
TN: 3 - 28 - 31
MZ: 28 - 13 - 41
Van: 14 - 17 - 31
FL: 3 - 17 - 20
AS: 6 - 0 - 6
AU: 27 - 16 - 43
KY: 10 - 7 - 17
GT: 20 - 14 - 34
Avg: 15.6 - 13.8 - 29.4
In 8 games, our opponents scored more points in the first half than the 2nd. Games of note are Auburn, Mizz, and Clemson, where we were playing from behind and lost. Nearly lost to GT, as well.
The other 4 games, our opponents scored more points in the 2nd half than the 1st. Games of note here are FL, Vandy, and TN, where we either lost or nearly lost.
CTG had more games where teams scored more in the 1st half than the 2nd, but in several of those games, we either lost or nearly lost and needed some last-minute heroics by our offense to win.
When you look at the averages, we only "adjusted" about 2 points between the 1st and 2nd halves.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:37 pm to davesdawgs
quote:
What I want is a proven DC with a lot of college experience like Chavis or Bud Foster at VT. If we can't get a proven winner then we are basically rolling the dice again like we did when we replaced Martinez with Grantham which at this point I'm not sure was an upgrade.
If that is what you are waiting on, then you will never replace a coach at UGA. Our administration is not willing to pay what it takes to get guys like that, we have to get the next one of those guys before he becomes one of them. Hiring proven coaches (read: expensive) is not something UGA does or ever will. It is a poor argument.
Also, we are a "good" program, but I for one and getting very sick and tired of accepting "good" because we are afraid to even attempt to be great and do what needs to be done.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:43 pm to Damn Good Dawg
Todd Grantham was the man with the plan and very desirable when we hired him.
We have established he rebuilt defenses usually rather quickly where he had success.
Here he has not.
Why?
A>)Was he not provided with adequate resources to accomplish the task, or is it a failed system of metrics.
B>)Are college kids unable at UGA to decipher and comprehend difficult task and assignments as some in here have suggested?
C>)Why do college students at lower tier institutions such as Alabama have no problem running the same type schemes does the water in Alabama have some magic powers we just don't get or could it be something else (see A)?
I have yet to see any viable reason why the powers to be shouldn't have hired him in and yes we had a serious problem before TG with WM is their something more we haven't discussed that is the underlying issue causing a crappy defense year in and out.
I just have a hard time blaming the figurehead for it all.
Remember the entire team for years now has come into the playing season fat, lazy and mostly out of shape and no one here can tell me this is not the damn case unless you wear the Rose colored glasses so many of you do.
If TG needs ten more analyst then why the Frick does he not have them? if Joe Tereshinski is responsible for all these fat fricks being out of shape we see each and every year why don't you Disney-tards oust his "eat a doughnut and lift a moonpie arse" out the door?
No shite, some of you would just rather bark at the moon and complain.... admit it and move on.
If we are going to burn it all to the ground IMO need to do a heavy spring cleaning is my point and case. Wasting money on another buyout and fruitless stopgap measure is wasting my life and sanity (what little is left.)
They might as well start up a Lacrosse team and hell I will just follow that. It sure would be a lot cheaper.
UGA would win the NCAA in 3 years easy and Alabama probably has a sex law on the books prohibiting Lacrosse from being played in the state so I don't need to think about them anymore except when I flush.
We have established he rebuilt defenses usually rather quickly where he had success.
Here he has not.
Why?
A>)Was he not provided with adequate resources to accomplish the task, or is it a failed system of metrics.
B>)Are college kids unable at UGA to decipher and comprehend difficult task and assignments as some in here have suggested?
C>)Why do college students at lower tier institutions such as Alabama have no problem running the same type schemes does the water in Alabama have some magic powers we just don't get or could it be something else (see A)?
I have yet to see any viable reason why the powers to be shouldn't have hired him in and yes we had a serious problem before TG with WM is their something more we haven't discussed that is the underlying issue causing a crappy defense year in and out.
I just have a hard time blaming the figurehead for it all.
Remember the entire team for years now has come into the playing season fat, lazy and mostly out of shape and no one here can tell me this is not the damn case unless you wear the Rose colored glasses so many of you do.
If TG needs ten more analyst then why the Frick does he not have them? if Joe Tereshinski is responsible for all these fat fricks being out of shape we see each and every year why don't you Disney-tards oust his "eat a doughnut and lift a moonpie arse" out the door?
No shite, some of you would just rather bark at the moon and complain.... admit it and move on.
If we are going to burn it all to the ground IMO need to do a heavy spring cleaning is my point and case. Wasting money on another buyout and fruitless stopgap measure is wasting my life and sanity (what little is left.)
They might as well start up a Lacrosse team and hell I will just follow that. It sure would be a lot cheaper.
UGA would win the NCAA in 3 years easy and Alabama probably has a sex law on the books prohibiting Lacrosse from being played in the state so I don't need to think about them anymore except when I flush.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:49 pm to BarberitosDawg
quote:
Todd Grantham was the man with the plan and very desirable when we hired him.
Pretty sure he was like our 5th pick after everyone kept turning down Georgia cause they thought Richt was gone. Silly them, we're Georgia and he's our Joe Pa
quote:
If we are going to burn it all to the ground IMO need to do a heavy spring cleaning is my point and case.
Oh I'd love to have a cleansing fire and toss all those mediocrity lovin' dicks but that ain't happening.
At least offer the fans someone to blame, idc if it's morally wrong. Someone has to pay for all the furniture I broke.
This post was edited on 12/5/13 at 1:50 pm
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:52 pm to BarberitosDawg
quote:
Was he not provided with adequate resources
He was/is
quote:
Are college kids unable at UGA to decipher and comprehend difficult task and assignments
Our playbook is bigger than some in the NFL, so no not many probably can in year 1
quote:
Why do college students at lower tier institutions such as Alabama have no problem running the same type schemes
That's like saying our D and the pittsburgh steel curtain is the same because they're both defense. Us and alabama may both run a version of the 3-4, but you're fooling yourself if you think the schemes and complexity are the exact same. We recruit the same kids they do.
quote:
could it be something else
Yeah, he's not a good coach.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:53 pm to Damn Good Dawg
Didn't the call list look something like this?
1. Kirby Smart
2. Chavis
3. Foster
4. Muschamp (?)
5. Grantham
He was NOT the man with a plan.
1. Kirby Smart
2. Chavis
3. Foster
4. Muschamp (?)
5. Grantham
He was NOT the man with a plan.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:54 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Games of note are Auburn, Mizz, and Clemson,
I would argue that Clemson was an anomaly. I mean, young defense, first game, hostile environment, and an excellent offense.
LSU, I chalked it up more to Gurley going down halfway through the second quarter. Our offense really struggled without him, and that puts more pressure on the defense. Same for Tennessee, really. SO many injuries to the offense...we really did not have an offense of note for about 3 1/2 games. When you don't have a defense, either...well, that is disaster waiting to happen.
My biggest disappointment was the Florida game. They never should have gotten back in the game. That hangs a good bit on the defense, but, there were a couple of breaks from the offensive side of the ball that allowed Florida to get back in the game. Safety...Lynch fumble...But of note is South Carolina, Auburn and Georgia tech. I really thought the defense adjusted well. Of course, it could also be argued that had we gone into the game with a better defensive plan we might not have fallen behind in those games. But...you can never fully tell what a team might come out with offensively. Who would have guessed that Tech would throw as much as they did, for instance?
Hey, I am not apologizing for Grantham. I just want everybody to take all circumstances into consideration before calling for anybody's job. It's easy to spot what should have been done from the stands or the couch. Much more difficult from the field. But, then again...if it were easy, we would all be making the big bucks as a coach, right?
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:55 pm to Nicolae
quote:
Our administration is not willing to pay what it takes to get guys like that, we have to get the next one of those guys before he becomes one of them. Hiring proven coaches (read: expensive) is not something UGA does or ever will.
Disagree. See previous call list prior to settling on CTG. And settle is exactly what we did. Our DC hole was exactly the same as Boom's OC search right now.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 1:59 pm to VoxDawg
quote:
Didn't the call list look something like this?
1. Kirby Smart
2. Chavis
3. Foster
4. Muschamp (?)
5. Grantham
He was NOT the man with a plan.
Yeah, I think it was something like that. As mentioned above, people thought Richt would be gone and were afraid to come here...kind of like what Muschamp will be going through. So, people wanting to blame Richt for hiring Grantham are wrong. he was something like the fifth choice, and one reason he did not get who he wanted was so many fans were screaming for his head back then. But I DO remember many people thinking it was a good hire.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 2:02 pm to DawgsLife
There are a lot of contributing factors to why a defense could struggle, but our defense was obviously not good enough to overcome them.
Our offense, on the other hand, struggled at times, mostly due to injuries, but overcame obstacles to win games time and time again, or at least make a game of it. We routinely put up more than enough points to win against most teams, but found ourselves coming down to the wire regardless of the score.
Our offense, on the other hand, struggled at times, mostly due to injuries, but overcame obstacles to win games time and time again, or at least make a game of it. We routinely put up more than enough points to win against most teams, but found ourselves coming down to the wire regardless of the score.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 2:04 pm to DawgsLife
quote:
So, people wanting to blame Richt for hiring Grantham are wrong.
Not necessarily, had he fired Willie when he should have his job wouldn't have been on the line and we could have actually hired a quality DC.
Richt ain't getting out of it that easy. This every much so lies on his head.
quote:
But I DO remember many people thinking it was a good hire.
We all wanted to believe....
quote:
There are a lot of contributing factors to why a defense could struggle, but our defense was obviously not good enough to overcome them.
Exactly, and regardless of any external factors the fact remains that this was Grantham's unit and he is responsible for their outcome no matter what. Just like Mark Richt is responsible for it all.
This post was edited on 12/5/13 at 2:06 pm
Posted on 12/5/13 at 2:19 pm to Damn Good Dawg
Let's also not forget that CTG isn't just the Defensive Coordinator. He's "Assistant Head Coach." I think they made a massive mistake by "promoting" him after the success of the 2011 season (defensively), but when you look at what a train wreck 2010 was, you could only go up from there. As many have mentioned in other discussions, 2011 was the exception, not the rule. Softer schedule and superior talent overcame what was still a flawed scheme and a headstrong blowhard who was driving the bus, defensively.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 2:53 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
There are a lot of contributing factors to why a defense could struggle, but our defense was obviously not good enough to overcome them.
Actually....our defense was not the problem. Our run defense did pretty well. The secondary was the problem. And, keep in mind that we had an exceptionally young secondary with two true freshmen starting many times. AND, one of those was injured for a 3-4 games. That REALLY puts the pressure on. A coach is ALWAYS under pressure when he has to start a freshman. It's even worse when it is a true freshman, and then when you have to start a back up to a true freshman.......wow. Ugly. And, that is pretty much what we got. Ugly with a long "U".
Posted on 12/5/13 at 2:55 pm to DawgsLife
quote:
keep in mind that we had an exceptionally young secondary with two true freshmen starting many times.
Then wouldn't logic tell you to simplify things to give your players the best chance to be successful? What good does it do having a 2" playbook that nobody understands so everyone is standing up looking at the sidelines when the ball is snapped?
Posted on 12/5/13 at 2:59 pm to Damn Good Dawg
quote:
Not necessarily, had he fired Willie when he should have his job wouldn't have been on the line and we could have actually hired a quality DC.
Good point, and one that is difficult to defend. I could try...but I'd rather not!
quote:
We all wanted to believe....
But it wasn't just us, the fans. A lot of supposedly sports oriented people felt it was a good hire.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 3:16 pm to VoxDawg
quote:
Didn't the call list look something like this?
1. Kirby Smart
2. Chavis
3. Foster
4. Muschamp (?)
5. Grantham
He was NOT the man with a plan.
No. More like this:
1. Smart
2. Grantham
Foster was consulted, but Richt and Foster both say that he was talking with Bud about possible targets, such as Grantham.
Chavis was never contacted at all by UGA. Nor was Muschamp.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 3:25 pm to Nicolae
I can only go by what was reported at the time. I've slept since then.
Posted on 12/5/13 at 3:47 pm to WG_Dawg
quote:
Was he provided with adequate resources?
He was/is
Says who what study or assessment backs this statement?
quote:
Are college kids unable at UGA to decipher and comprehend difficult task and assignments
Our playbook is bigger than some in the NFL, so no not many probably can in year 1.
We start Freshmen now?
quote:
Why do college students at lower tier institutions such as Alabama have no problem running the same type schemes
That's like saying our D and the pittsburgh steel curtain is the same because they're both defense. Us and alabama may both run a version of the 3-4, but you're fooling yourself if you think the schemes and complexity are the exact same. We recruit the same kids they do.
WTF does this even mean? They either can or the can't stop with the hogwash
quote:
could it be something else
Yeah, he's not a good coach.
Possibly and possibly he doesn't have the proper tools to get the job done.
Counter point...
Was he provided with adequate resources?
He was/is
Says who what study or assessment backs this statement?
quote:
Are college kids unable at UGA to decipher and comprehend difficult task and assignments
Our playbook is bigger than some in the NFL, so no not many probably can in year 1.
We start Freshmen now?
quote:
Why do college students at lower tier institutions such as Alabama have no problem running the same type schemes
That's like saying our D and the pittsburgh steel curtain is the same because they're both defense. Us and alabama may both run a version of the 3-4, but you're fooling yourself if you think the schemes and complexity are the exact same. We recruit the same kids they do.
WTF does this even mean? They either can or the can't stop with the hogwash
quote:
could it be something else
Yeah, he's not a good coach.
Possibly and possibly he doesn't have the proper tools to get the job done.
Counter point...
Posted on 12/5/13 at 3:49 pm to DawgsLife
Our overall defense was bad, regardless of which parts were dysfunctional.
If our QB couldn't throw the ball to save his life but we scored 40 points a game by running it, no one would complain about how good/bad the passing game was. Same goes for defense.
We can get 10 sacks a game or own the LOS and stuff the run game, but if we keep giving up a lot of points and wind up losing because of it, no one talks about the good things because they don't matter when we have an L in the record book. Our run defense might be serviceable but we kept getting gashed through the air. We made backup and run-first QBs look like Pro Bowl pocket passers.
The youth argument just doesn't fly with me anymore. Young defensive players flourish in other defenses. It's obviously a problem with them learning the playbook and not focusing on fundamentals. I expected us to struggle with our young secondary, but when GT is killing us through the air in the last game of the season, we've got serious problems.
The problem isn't the scheme or the players, it is the combination of the two at the same time. CTG needed to adjust his playbook to the youth and inexperience of the players but he didn't do that and we got eaten alive. Our red zone defense is terrible and we had trouble getting TOs all season. That means we aren't in the right places and we aren't executing. I expected some, maybe even a lot of that, at first, but after we got through the (supposedly) hardest part of our schedule, we weren't doing much better. I blame the coach for that one.
If our QB couldn't throw the ball to save his life but we scored 40 points a game by running it, no one would complain about how good/bad the passing game was. Same goes for defense.
We can get 10 sacks a game or own the LOS and stuff the run game, but if we keep giving up a lot of points and wind up losing because of it, no one talks about the good things because they don't matter when we have an L in the record book. Our run defense might be serviceable but we kept getting gashed through the air. We made backup and run-first QBs look like Pro Bowl pocket passers.
The youth argument just doesn't fly with me anymore. Young defensive players flourish in other defenses. It's obviously a problem with them learning the playbook and not focusing on fundamentals. I expected us to struggle with our young secondary, but when GT is killing us through the air in the last game of the season, we've got serious problems.
The problem isn't the scheme or the players, it is the combination of the two at the same time. CTG needed to adjust his playbook to the youth and inexperience of the players but he didn't do that and we got eaten alive. Our red zone defense is terrible and we had trouble getting TOs all season. That means we aren't in the right places and we aren't executing. I expected some, maybe even a lot of that, at first, but after we got through the (supposedly) hardest part of our schedule, we weren't doing much better. I blame the coach for that one.
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