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re: Kevin Steele new DC
Posted on 1/4/16 at 11:40 am to AUbagman
Posted on 1/4/16 at 11:40 am to AUbagman
quote:
What are the ST failures you're referring to if we aren't allowed to include pure kicking stats? Is it the #1 in the SEC 30+ kickoff return stat? The #7 20+ yard punt return stat? The zero blocks allowed on a field goal? Is it the only 1 TD allowed on opponent kickoff/punt returns? Please tell me exactly what area this bad ST play is?
But, but..fire Scott Fountain
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Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:15 pm to AUbagman
quote:
Is it the #1 in the SEC 30+ kickoff return stat? The #7 20+ yard punt return stat?
You have to look at averages and not just the highs LINK
quote:
The zero blocks allowed on a field goal
Along with 26 other teams? So almost 25% of all teams. LINK
quote:
Is it the only 1 TD allowed on opponent kickoff/punt returns?
We weren't in the top 50 in kick-off coverage or top 100 punt coverage. kick-off Punt
Hell, if you want to use a made-up effiencies we were behind Troy. LINK
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:16 pm to JamalSanders
quote:We punted 55 times in 2015, and had 7 returns for 87 yards. The UGa return for a TD accounted for 53 of those, and LSU got 23 on another, so of the other 53 punts our opponents averaged roughly .20 return yards (roughly 2 1/2 inches) per punt.
The ST coach has next to zero impact on kicking and punting. His work is in the coverage and return schemes. Under Fountain, those have been bad. There was a sharp downturn when Boulware left and it isn't hard to see that.
Of the 18 kickoffs we had returned, our opponents averaged 21.44 yards. Longest was 39 yards vs TAMU; only three others were more than 25, which meant our opponents' starting field position following kickoffs was almost always at the 25 or closer thanks to Carlson's 70% touchback ratio.
Meanwhile, AU was #4 in the nation in kickoff return average (28 yards per return) and managed to return just over half of our opponents 67 kickoffs. We weren't quite as productive returning punts, but were still pretty good, averaging 11.5 yards per return (#29 in FBS, #6 in SEC), but that was on only 15 returns (then again, thanks to our defense, we forced only 46 punts all year, dead last in the SEC and tied for #120 in FBS).
We didn't block any punts, FGs or PATs this season, but the blocked FG vs Memphis in the bowl was the only kick of any kind our opponents blocked, so that's pretty much a wash (correction: we blocked the Memphis FG, and didn't allow any blocked kicks all year) . In a similar vein, we didn't score any TDs on ST, but the only one we allowed was the PR against the Dawgs.
I don't have time or inclination to look up our ST statistics during Boulware's tenure, but I seriously doubt they are significantly better (in fact I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that they aren't as good).
ETA: h/t to lowspark, I forgot that we blocked the Memphis FG, not the other way around.
This post was edited on 1/4/16 at 1:55 pm
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:23 pm to JamalSanders
quote:
You have to look at averages and not just the highs LINK
How does that link help your assertion?
Since when is being in the top 25% a bad thing?
Does your link calculate touchbacks into "returns"? If so, Auburn would naturally have a high average, no?
Nothing I stated was made up. It was pulled directly from CFB stats. Those were facts.
This post was edited on 1/4/16 at 1:24 pm
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:30 pm to FearlessFreep
quote:
We punted 55 times in 2015, and had 7 returns for 87 yards.
Easy to cover punts when your team only has to cover 30 yards on average or they get shanked out of bounds. Regardless, 1/7 punt returns were housed.
In 2014, Auburn was #72 in punt return average and around #90 in 20+ punt returns with ~15% of the 19 punt returns being 20+ yards
Opponent Punt Return Avg
2015- #112
2014-#72
2013-#52
Opponent KO Return Avg
2015- #66
2014- #87
2013- #123
Auburn Punt Return Avg
2015- #29
2014- #4
2013- #23
Auburn Kickoff Return Avg
2015- #4
2014- #82
2013- #27
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:31 pm to GenesChin
quote:
Easy to cover punts when your team only has to cover 30 yards on average or they get shanked out of bounds.
But P/K statistics have nothing to do with the ST coach. They have special coaches, right?
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:32 pm to GenesChin
Given that our TE/HB have been mediocre at best over the past two years and our ST isn't the greatest/most amazing thing ever being the #6 paid TE coach is being overpaid.
ETA: Fountain isn't considered an elite recruiter either
ETA: Fountain isn't considered an elite recruiter either
This post was edited on 1/4/16 at 1:36 pm
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:34 pm to TheJones
quote:
But P/K statistics have nothing to do with the ST coach. They have special coaches, right?
I wasn't the one who pointed out that we only had 7 punt returns
When a K makes a FG or a punter kicks a booming punt, the only credit the ST coach deserves is making sure it didn't get blocked. Cody Parkey and Carlson kicking it through the uprights isn't because Fountain has some new cool kicking technique
This post was edited on 1/4/16 at 1:37 pm
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:37 pm to FearlessFreep
Think you got it backwards on the blocks...
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:50 pm to GenesChin
quote:So, the fact that only 7 of 55 punts were returnable kind of indicates that our coverage team was in position to prevent our opponents from making a return, does it not? Considering our ineptitude on offense led to so many punts, it seems like that would be a positive, not a negative.
I wasn't the one who pointed out that we only had 7 punt returns
quote:Phillips averaged 41 yards per punt. I'm sure you have some stats to back up your claim that the majority of his punts were <30 yards?
Easy to cover punts when your team only has to cover 30 yards on average or they get shanked out of bounds.
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:52 pm to AUbagman
quote:
AUbagman
Don't go down this rabbit hole. I have already gathered all sorts of stats before showing that AU's ST is not atrocious under Fountain and that the 2 are actually very comparable but some just need scapegoats and since most people don't understand what Fountain does then he is the target
Posted on 1/4/16 at 1:57 pm to GenesChin
quote:In 2015, AU attempted 27 FGs, 40 PATs, and 55 punts, for a total of 122 kicking attempts. We had zero blocked.
When a K makes a FG or a punter kicks a booming punt, the only credit the ST coach deserves is making sure it didn't get blocked.
What kind of improvement on those numbers would you expect from our next ST coach?
This post was edited on 1/4/16 at 1:58 pm
Posted on 1/4/16 at 2:10 pm to FearlessFreep
This post was edited on 1/4/16 at 2:11 pm
Posted on 1/5/16 at 9:37 am to TigerPaw1
quote:
before showing that AU's ST is not atrocious under Fountain
My emotional stance that will never change because of FSU's KO Return TD = Fountain sucks at Special Teams
My rational stance- Fountain is avg to solid ST but his TE/HB coaching, ST coordinating + recruiting doesn't deserve what he is paid.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:13 am to GenesChin
6 days later- frick Gus and frick Jay Jacobs.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:15 am to GenesChin
quote:
My emotional stance that will never change because of FSU's KO Return TD = Fountain sucks at Special Teams
You mean the return where we had a guy pull up lame and left a gaping hole in the coverage that the FSU returner went through?
Damn Fountain for pulling ST player's hamstrings during active plays!
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:28 am to GenesChin
quote:
My emotional stance that will never change because of FSU's KO Return TD = Fountain sucks at Special Teams
I can appreciate that but I think that's a little harsh considering we had a guy cramp right on the lane they return happened quote:
My rational stance- Fountain is avg to solid ST but his TE/HB coaching, ST coordinating + recruiting doesn't deserve what he is paid.
I agree with avg to solid although I don't know exactly WHO is a super great ST coach. So many moving parts on that side of field. Punters and kickers really are responsible themselves in performance or have specific coaches they meet with. As for kick coverage and returns a lot of that comes down to the athletes you have on your team which ST coaches don't have a ton of control over. Overall if you look at footballoutsiders rankings AU's ST under Fountain were top 5 in 2013, pretty terrible in 2014 and back to top 20 in 2015. So do with that as you will
As for his TE/HB coaching I think he did good things with the talent he inherited in 2013 but since then we have been working fill that hole and I think he has done a good job of getting young guys there. I mean Jakell Mitchell was the expected TE until his unfortunate passing so that was an unexpected gap at TE this year with 4 freshman at TE/HB. Next year Pettway & Cox are sophomores with 13 games experience and we are bringing in one of the best TE recruits.
Bottom line for me I have no problems with Fountain at this point. Now if we don't see growth at the H-Back spot the next few seasons then I think it might be time to start calling for heads but as of now with what he has had to work with and what he has produced it's been perfectly fine for me.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:45 am to TigerPaw1
Do fullbacks like cox and Pettway fall under Horton as RB coach or fountain?... that's one question is like answered.
Regardless of who's coaching them, they did a solid job this year as freshmen... both have tons of upside, especially cox, who can be used in the passing game.
Regardless of who's coaching them, they did a solid job this year as freshmen... both have tons of upside, especially cox, who can be used in the passing game.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:50 am to beatbammer
ST was atrocious in 2013 and 2014 but they were actually the best part of this season by far so Fountain has earned his keep for now IMO.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:52 am to lowspark12
quote:
Do fullbacks like cox and Pettway fall under Horton as RB coach or fountain?.
They split time.
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