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re: (OT) Who will win the presidency?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 3:44 pm to SquatchDawg
Posted on 8/17/16 at 3:44 pm to SquatchDawg
Just noting. We've got a close election going on up in here.
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Posted on 8/17/16 at 3:48 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:
Not in the popular vote - but small pockets in swing states can definitely swing elections because of how the electoral college works. You effect one state and that could be enough.
Yes, and we've already addressed that these examples of voter fraud are happening in areas where there aren't close elections.
quote:
The fact is that proof of ID should be required as it is for almost everything else.
Then, by the constitution, you'd have to make it free. Even if ID cards cost $1 you wouldn't be able to enforce them as that is considered a poll tax, which is unconstitutional. I get what you're saying and I tend to agree, that's just the challenge there.
quote:
Again - if it's so irrelevant why is the DNC up in arms and litigating this issue?
Litigating voter ID issue? So they can pander to minorities that they feel it disenfranchises. Has less to do with voter fraud and more to do with strengthening their stronghold in minorities.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 3:49 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:DNC isn't against more stringent voter ID laws to help allow voter fraud, they're against it because that could disenfranchise millions of voters who vote for them at a very high rate. The RNC is so pro stringent ID laws because it's easier to disenfranchise voters who they can't get to vote for them, rather than do more to convince them to vote red.
Also, this is a straw man argument anyway. The fact is that proof of ID should be required as it is for almost everything else. Whether or not it isn't a major issue is irrelevant.
Again - if it's so irrelevant why is the DNC up in arms and litigating this issue?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 3:57 pm to gatorhata9
quote:
Please explain where anyone has acknowledged that voter fraud doesn't exist.
Acting like it's completely ineffectual is essentially the same thing as acting like it doesn't exist when the point is that it absolutely IS effectual, especially because of how the Electoral College works and how significant it can be as a result in swing states.
Again, think about the 2000 election and how it literally boiled down to just a small portion of votes in one state being the difference of having G.W. Bush or Al Gore as president.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 3:58 pm to SumterCoDawg
quote:
they're against it because that could disenfranchise millions of voters who vote for them
I don't believe that for a second
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:05 pm to gatorhata9
quote:
Then, by the constitution, you'd have to make it free. Even if ID cards cost $1 you wouldn't be able to enforce them as that is considered a poll tax, which is unconstitutional.
That's just not true. There's already states that do require voter ID. Georgia is one of them, for instance.
By your silly logic, you'd have to consider gassing up your car and putting air in your tires a "poll tax", otherwise how the frick do people drive themselves to the polls to vote?
Just dumb.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:06 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:You don't believe that Democrats wouldn't want it to suddenly be tougher for millions of poor minorities to vote for them? You know, the group that votes for them like 99% of the time. Do you think that Republicans all just have impeccable morals and want the best chance at a fair election, with absolutely no ulterior or sinister motives? If this is your reasoning then you are brainwashed and blinded by party loyalty beyond chance of recovery.
I don't believe that for a second
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 4:07 pm
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:11 pm to SumterCoDawg
quote:
DNC isn't against more stringent voter ID laws to help allow voter fraud, they're against it because that could disenfranchise millions of voters who vote for them at a very high rate. The RNC is so pro stringent ID laws because it's easier to disenfranchise voters who they can't get to vote for them, rather than do more to convince them to vote red.
LOLWUT?
You realize that to use a SNAP card and apply for food stamps you have to show an ID? AND you have to not only prove who you are, but you have to show documentation you actually qualify for such benefits.
Who the hell in this country that's of voting age doesn't have a freaking ID?
The ONLY people who don't have ID are people who aren't citizens or are dead.
The states that currently don't require an ID to vote that have been trying to require ID to vote have even offered to give ID's to people FOR FREE, and Democrats have STILL fought against it.
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 4:18 pm
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:15 pm to SumterCoDawg
quote:
You don't believe that Democrats wouldn't want it to suddenly be tougher for millions of poor minorities to vote for them?
You mean the poor minorities who ALL show their ID when applying for welfare benefits? Those poor minorities?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:18 pm to SumterCoDawg
I don't believe that they think there's this huge number of legit registered voters that will be disenfranchised because they can't produce an ID. It sounds good but do you really believe this?
If that's not it...then why else fight against voter ID laws? Hmmm...
If that's not it...then why else fight against voter ID laws? Hmmm...
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 4:19 pm
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:19 pm to BeefDawg
quote:
The ONLY people who don't have ID are people who aren't citizens or are dead.
It's estimated that 11% of Americans don't have government issued ID. Also estimated that 18% of seniors don't have ID and 25% of African Americans don't have ID, thus the motivation for Dems to keep voter id laws as open as possible.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:22 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:They're not doing it for some wholesome reason, try to follow me on this: THEY NEED BLACK PEOPLE AND OTHER MINORITIES TO HAVE NO EXCUSE NOT TO VOTE FOR THEM ON ELECTION DAY. Even if states offered ID for free there would still be lazy people who just wouldn't go pick one up, they want as few barriers and excuses as possible for their voters to get to the voting booth.
It sounds good but do you really believe this?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:25 pm to gatorhata9
quote:
we've already addressed that these examples of voter fraud are happening in areas where there aren't close elections
Ohio, FL, NC? Hell...if I remember right it took 100% of Philly to win PA for Obama. Also don't discount local elections too.
quote:
Even if ID cards cost $1 you wouldn't be able to enforce them as that is considered a poll tax, which is unconstitutional.
If you want to get in a Constitutional discussion....I get that. But this is NOT why the Dems fight this issue.
quote:
they can pander to minorities that they feel it disenfranchises.
I agree but it's also to make sure they get the result they want. There are too many cases of fraud out there to discount them all as coincidence.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:29 pm to SumterCoDawg
quote:
THEY NEED BLACK PEOPLE AND OTHER MINORITIES TO HAVE NO EXCUSE NOT TO VOTE FOR THEM ON ELECTION DAY.
I AGREE - but there are so few people out there with no ID that this is a cover story because it has a sympathetic ring rather than the truth:
THEY ALSO RIG ELECTIONS - WHY IS THIS SO HARD FOR YOU TO ACCEPT?
How do you get 110% turnout? Who exactly shows up and claims to be a dead person to vote? You don't do this as an individual out for a laugh. This is an organized effort.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:31 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:
THEY ALSO RIG ELECTIONS - WHY IS THIS SO HARD FOR YOU TO ACCEPT?
[citation needed]
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:32 pm to BeefDawg
quote:
Acting like it's completely ineffectual is essentially the same thing as acting like it doesn't exist when the point is that it absolutely IS effectual
And yet you've yet to prove once instance in any of these elections where voting fraud is swinging elections while ignoring plenty of evidence, by people smarter than you and me, to the contrary.
quote:
Again, think about the 2000 election and how it literally boiled down to just a small portion of votes in one state being the difference of having G.W. Bush or Al Gore as president.
And was voter fraud committed? It's great to throw out what ifs and hypotheticals all day long but I prefer to deal in facts.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:39 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:So 25% of black people and 1 out of 10 Americans isn't enough to make a difference? Just no big deal? It is also a way for them to look like the "good guys" to their voters, but that's not the only reason.
but there are so few people out there with no ID that this is a cover story because it has a sympathetic ring rather than the truth:
quote:Their own primaries: probably yeah, but there isn't an organized effort by part of the DNC to hack voting machines and help people vote as dead guys in the national election. Unless I missed some national scandal or there was something in that email leak that I don't know about.
THEY ALSO RIG ELECTIONS - WHY IS THIS SO HARD FOR YOU TO ACCEPT?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:40 pm to BeefDawg
quote:
The ONLY people who don't have ID are people who aren't citizens or are dead.
And certain criminals that don't carry for obvious reasons.
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 4:41 pm
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:41 pm to gatorhata9
quote:
And was voter fraud committed? It's great to throw out what ifs and hypotheticals all day long but I prefer to deal in facts.
Best I could find.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 4:48 pm to SumterCoDawg
quote:
It's estimated that 11% of Americans don't have government issued ID. Also estimated that 18% of seniors don't have ID and 25% of African Americans don't have ID, thus the motivation for Dems to keep voter id laws as open as possible.
And what a load of crap that is.
If you run a search on the web for "how many voting eligible people don't have identification", every single thing returned is some leftwing as frick site spouting some "survey" with questions like, "Do you have a government issued unexpired photo ID valid in your state?"
Every excuse in the book is being given.
There's a couple million 80+ year old's with Alzheimer's living in old folks homes who don't have ID's. We can't "disenfranchise" them!
Or the couple million 18-22 year old gang-banger thugs who live with their single mom's and aunties and 6 other illegitimate brothers, sisters, and cousins from 5 different fathers don't have an ID yet because they're still technically a dependent (so only the mother has to show her ID when applying for welfare), and don't give one shite about a driver's license because the last thing they want on them is an ID with a home address.... lord forbid we "disenfranchise" these people.
I GUARANTEE you, that if we made it so once your dependents turned 18 years old, they had to apply for welfare themselves and they came off their parent's welfare teet, they'd get themselves a government issued ID real damn quick.
And again, the states that have been criticized for this are offering ID's FOR FREE. Most are even offering to issue lost birth certificates for free to those in financial difficulty.
The system is broken and for some reason everyone but Democrats seems to [want to] realize it.
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 5:02 pm
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