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Posted on 7/1/15 at 2:46 pm to Prettyboy Floyd
Yeah Splitter is a 4-year starter with the Spurs, so he even played under Coach Bud for a couple years. He fits in Bud's system seamlessly.
If he can stay healthy, he's 8-10 points and 6-8 rebounds and a couple blocked shots a night. But most of all, we get to move Horford back to his natural position at the 4.
And if we get Harris at the 3, who cares about losing DeMarre. Harris is 18 points and 6 rebounds a game from the 3 spot. DeMarre was 11.5 and 4. Granted, he was an outstanding defender, but he only became a defensive gem once he got in Bud's system. Harris shoots and moves the ball better and we got Sefolosha to play defense at the 3 when it's needed. Harris actually isn't a bad defender either.
If he can stay healthy, he's 8-10 points and 6-8 rebounds and a couple blocked shots a night. But most of all, we get to move Horford back to his natural position at the 4.
And if we get Harris at the 3, who cares about losing DeMarre. Harris is 18 points and 6 rebounds a game from the 3 spot. DeMarre was 11.5 and 4. Granted, he was an outstanding defender, but he only became a defensive gem once he got in Bud's system. Harris shoots and moves the ball better and we got Sefolosha to play defense at the 3 when it's needed. Harris actually isn't a bad defender either.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 3:00 pm to BeefDawg
former Hawk Devin Harris?
Posted on 7/1/15 at 3:05 pm to BeefDawg
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Harris actually isn't a bad defender either.
I prefer good defenders at every position which is why I had an issue with giving away our first rounder for a 1 diminsional 2. I think we will still win games but Demarre was a damn fine player who I would prefer over Harris although the money was to high.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 3:07 pm to BeefDawg
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But most of all, we get to move Horford back to his natural position at the 4.
I keep hearing this but I don't understand the benefit on offense. A lot of what atlanta's offense go this past season was Horford's ability to shoot the long two from the elbows. He got space to do that because opposing centers typically weren't quick enough to handle his drives, so they played off him at the top of the key. If the opposing center will now be staying on the block with splitter, that means a smaller, more athletic 4 is going to be right out there with Horford.
On defense it will help that he isn't guarding someone who has a couple inches and 30-40 pounds on him, but it looks like a wash to me.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 3:20 pm to Croot
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former Hawk Devin Harris?
No, Tobias Harris, from Orlando.
At least that's the rumor on twitter.
Tobias Harris is a RFA with about a $4.5M cap hit to Orlando. Orlando has about right at $19M cap space. And if they are offering Paul Millsap $20M/year max contract, then they need to free up some space. And, supposedly Harris and Coach Skiles don't like each other.
If Orlando signs Millsap, they won't be able to match any offers for Harris. His max contract with 4-year tenure is $16M.
I'm not saying we will offer him $15M, but we could. That's better than paying Millsap $21M and being forced to start Sefolosha and Bazemore at the 3 and having Horford and Millsap both playing PF when Splitter is in. That wouldn't make sense actually. It's not a good design.
This is why I think we let Millsap go and we get rights to Harris. Meaning if anyone offers Harris, we can match that contract and keep him. And if it happens to be a max contract, $16M, we can afford it and actually save money instead of re-signing Millsap.
This post was edited on 7/1/15 at 3:58 pm
Posted on 7/1/15 at 3:33 pm to ATLdawg25
Horford becomes our Tim Duncan if we have a true 5 and move Al to the 4.
It works in San Antonio. And Coach Bud is trying to build that exact look here. And he's really close.
Duncan floats between the 4 and 5 spots depending on the lineup. But when Splitter was in there, Duncan played the 4 and just killed everybody with those 12-17 footers. Meanwhile Ginobili and Leonard kill folks from the perimeter and Parker finds easy lanes and penetrates to the basket.
We have a VERY similar makeup to this if we get a true center to play the 5 and let Millsap go while picking up Tobias Harris.
It works in San Antonio. And Coach Bud is trying to build that exact look here. And he's really close.
Duncan floats between the 4 and 5 spots depending on the lineup. But when Splitter was in there, Duncan played the 4 and just killed everybody with those 12-17 footers. Meanwhile Ginobili and Leonard kill folks from the perimeter and Parker finds easy lanes and penetrates to the basket.
We have a VERY similar makeup to this if we get a true center to play the 5 and let Millsap go while picking up Tobias Harris.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 4:26 pm to RunLindsayRun
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Demarre Carroll to the Raptors.
Do we really want to pay a player $15 million/year who finished 113th in the NBA in player efficiency (PER)? You know who had a higher PER? Chris Kaman, Jordan Clarkson, Carlos Boozer, Mike Muscala, Cole Aldrich, the list goes on. On paper, it looks like a stinger, but long-term the Hawks win.
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We also aquired Tiago Splitter.
If you normalized numbers, he ranked as the 54th best player in the NBA, just behind Dwight Howard and Dirk Nowitzki.
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Millsap is deciding between us and Orlando.
He is dispensable. Put Splitter at C, Howard at PF and spend the money on a SG or SF. The Hawks could’ve blown their wad, but their approach is the correct one. I’m a fan of Millsap, in fact I think he is the most underrated player in the NBA. BUT, the Hawks need to keep their options open for future FA classes. 60 wins is a huge accomplishment, but this team isn’t built for the playoffs. Sign Paul Pierce and go get a defensive minded SG (Corey Brewer or Shumpert). Have Korver come off the bench, and this team is better than last year.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 4:27 pm to BeefDawg
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picking up Tobias Harris.
Pretty important we pick that guy up.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 4:48 pm to WhopperDawg
Millsap flew down to Orlando today to meet with them and now he's back in Atlanta. No clue how his visit went though and still have no confirmation on if he's staying here or if we're doing that rumored sign-and-trade.
If Millsap stays here with the Hawks, we're left with $1.4M of cap space and that's it. And we'd have no SF/3 except Sefolosha and Bazemore.
So I don't know WTF we're doing still. It would be nice to hear something concrete.
Honestly, I don't want to give Millsap $20M. It leaves us with no options and a hole in the lineup at the 3 position. Plus it would mean Horford is still playing the 5 if Millsap is our 4. And I guess Splitter would be coming off the bench like Pero (except he's way better than Pero).
If Millsap stays here with the Hawks, we're left with $1.4M of cap space and that's it. And we'd have no SF/3 except Sefolosha and Bazemore.
So I don't know WTF we're doing still. It would be nice to hear something concrete.
Honestly, I don't want to give Millsap $20M. It leaves us with no options and a hole in the lineup at the 3 position. Plus it would mean Horford is still playing the 5 if Millsap is our 4. And I guess Splitter would be coming off the bench like Pero (except he's way better than Pero).
Posted on 7/1/15 at 5:05 pm to Glory, Glory
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Do we really want to pay a player $15 million/year who finished 113th in the NBA in player efficiency (PER)? You know who had a higher PER? Chris Kaman, Jordan Clarkson, Carlos Boozer, Mike Muscala, Cole Aldrich, the list goes on. On paper, it looks like a stinger, but long-term the Hawks win.
He improved all season. I would take Carroll over all of those guys.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 5:08 pm to BeefDawg
Very interesting off-season already. I love the Junkyard Dog but we couldn't pay him that. He did great for us, worked really hard to become a shooter and has always been a very good defender, but we can't pay him what Toronto just did. Our system helped him a lot. Saw a stat where 83% of his shots were off assists. Toronto on the other hand had the 3rd lowest assist rate. He made the right decision to go take the big money he earned but I think he will struggle a bit there.
I'm torn on Millsap too. Definitely worse without him but wouldn't be a lottery team so we wouldn't really have big prospects of getting better. Gotta develop our own guys, very rarely will we land a big name FA, so hard to do. That is why throwing away the last 2 drafts really hurts.
I'm torn on Millsap too. Definitely worse without him but wouldn't be a lottery team so we wouldn't really have big prospects of getting better. Gotta develop our own guys, very rarely will we land a big name FA, so hard to do. That is why throwing away the last 2 drafts really hurts.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 5:13 pm to Glory, Glory
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You know who had a higher PER? Chris Kaman, Jordan Clarkson, Carlos Boozer, Mike Muscala, Cole Aldrich
If you think any of those guys would bring more to the Hawks than Carroll, then I've got some volcano insurance to sell you.
"Volcano insurance? I'm pretty sure we've never had a volcano."
"Well...don't you think you're overdue for one?"
Posted on 7/1/15 at 5:13 pm to TigerinUGA
quote:
I'm torn on Millsap too. Definitely worse without him but wouldn't be a lottery team so we wouldn't really have big prospects of getting better. Gotta develop our own guys, very rarely will we land a big name FA, so hard to do. That is why throwing away the last 2 drafts really hurts.
The guy we gave away form our last year would be a perfect chance to give him a shot if Millsap gone but we let him go.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 5:25 pm to ATLdawg25
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If you think any of those guys would bring more to the Hawks than Carroll, then I've got some volcano insurance to sell you.
Are you really that stupid? That’s a serious question.
I was debunking RLR’s perceived end of the world comment aka losing Carroll. In no way did I say any of those guys offered the Hawks more than Carroll, but instead pointed out a guy (with proven analytics) who I don’t see worth $15 million/year.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 5:58 pm to Glory, Glory
Millsap stays with ATL 3 yr/59 million, with a player option after 2 years. It will allow him to cash in on the new TV contract. While I don’t think he was a huge need, this gives ATL a lot of flexibility in 2017. Nice work by Bud.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 6:47 pm to BeefDawg
any chance they still go after Harris now they got Millsap back?
Posted on 7/1/15 at 7:21 pm to Croot
Nope, we're out of cap space after keeping Millsap. In fact, we're slightly over the cap and probably have to release Shelvin Mack.
So I'm perplexed. We're still down a SF starter at the 3 position. And, Horford is still stuck at the 5 since Millsap is the 4.
Basically, Splitter replaces Pero, which is a for sure upgrade for those 15-20 minutes every game, and Hardaway gives us an upgrade at depth at the 2 position with Korver. This will allow Korver to get a lot more rest every game rather than wearing down playing 37 minutes and losing his accuracy.
But that leaves us a hole at the 3. Unless they plan to start Sefolosha or Bazemore I guess. Or maybe they want to play more of the Teague and Schroeder combo minutes. And maybe Korver and Hardaway become a new combo package as well. I don't know at this moment. I just hope they don't do something stupid like trade away Teague or Schroeder for some mediocre SG out there.
So I'm perplexed. We're still down a SF starter at the 3 position. And, Horford is still stuck at the 5 since Millsap is the 4.
Basically, Splitter replaces Pero, which is a for sure upgrade for those 15-20 minutes every game, and Hardaway gives us an upgrade at depth at the 2 position with Korver. This will allow Korver to get a lot more rest every game rather than wearing down playing 37 minutes and losing his accuracy.
But that leaves us a hole at the 3. Unless they plan to start Sefolosha or Bazemore I guess. Or maybe they want to play more of the Teague and Schroeder combo minutes. And maybe Korver and Hardaway become a new combo package as well. I don't know at this moment. I just hope they don't do something stupid like trade away Teague or Schroeder for some mediocre SG out there.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 7:38 pm to Glory, Glory
quote:
Are you really that stupid? That’s a serious question.
Are you kidding? You named other players on the basis of PER who maybe played 20 mins per game as if the Hawks could find Carroll's production for so much cheaper elsewhere.
The whole reason people were busting in their pants at the thought of resigning him (note: I have not been one of those people) was because he was quite literally a perfect fit in the Hawks' system. He was Kawhi Leonard lite.
He's not worth what the Raptors are paying him. The Hawks were smart not to try to match that deal. But to pretend like there are players a dime a dozen who could do exactly what the Hawks need is asinine.
The best move was to let him walk, but its a scenario where the business of the game is taking him away from where he fits the best. The Raptors are paying him like he can be a focal point, which is stupid.
Posted on 7/1/15 at 8:03 pm to BeefDawg
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So I'm perplexed
Me too. Your scenario of adding Harris and letting Milsap go made perfect sense given that Junkyard is out the door.
Now we have a log jam at 4 and no 3 and no cap space.
Bud, please explain?
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