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re: moral equivalency? hunh vs flopping
Posted on 3/8/14 at 3:43 pm to arrakis
Posted on 3/8/14 at 3:43 pm to arrakis
quote:how do you an define an injury? is a player with his breath knocked out injured? he certainly cant play the next play, but will likely be fine shortly. should he make efforts to get off the field to help the offense maintain its pace? how about guy who is dizzy? is he just tired from too many snaps in row, is he having a heat stroke, or just needs gatorade? are you qualified to judge that? is the player? i would say straight up faking an injury is unethical, but degree of injury is a gray area. and if you go by the hunh set's opinion, if you can, do it.
Let's start with knowledge of the rules and mechanics and see if helps satisfy your questions about my competence: You stated, earlier in the thread, that feigning an injury (flopping) is within the current rules of the game. Would you say feigning an injury to stop the clock meets the criteria of an unfair act?
quote:games, teams, dates, which official were you, calls you made please? only fair. the rules of football are published, anyone can look them up.
Mostly JUCO and occasionally Div II.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 3:49 pm
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Posted on 3/8/14 at 3:51 pm to LC412000
quote:
re: moral equivalency? hunh vs flopping (Posted on 3/8/14 at 12:03 pm to narddogg81)
I am not in favor of HUNH offense and believe if the defense must flop to slow it down, then go with it. Have not seen rules prohibiting it
^^^^
The HUNH offense is designed to do 1 thing and we all know that, STOP the defense from being able to substitute and gas them. There is NO denying that.
If you are a believer that the D has no right to substitute personnel,then you KNOW this is a competitive advantage,I don't care who you root for. That said,I personally don't have an issue with it with winning 3 titles in 4 years. Like all the past dominant offenses,good coaches will find a way to contain it for the most part
Posted on 3/8/14 at 3:51 pm to narddogg81
quote:If a player has to have the game stopped for them to get off the field.
how do you an define an injury?
Since the coaches that are whining about the HUNH are all about player safety then they should have no problem with that player sitting and being checked out for the rest of that drive to make sure they are healthy enough to go back in. It solves both problems.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 3:53 pm
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:05 pm to Rabern57
quote:sounds like a rule change to me.
Since the coaches that are whining about the HUNH are all about player safety then they should have no problem with that player sitting and being checked out for the rest of that drive to make sure they are healthy enough to go back in. It solves both problems.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 4:06 pm
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:06 pm to narddogg81
quote:
how do you an define an injury? is a player with his breath knocked out injured? he certainly cant play the next play, but will likely be fine shortly. should he make efforts to get off the field to help the offense maintain its pace?
Once again, you change the topic. Here is your exact quote:
quote:
i believe its more accurate to say flopping is against the ethics of the rules and hunh is against the spirit of the game, ie the game is the interaction between the play called on offense and the defensive play called to counter. what makes football great is that it operates on multiple levels. a stated goal of the hunh is to prevent ds from getting in plays, or at least the play the want. both are currently within the rules as they stand
So, the question remains...does flopping (feigning an injury) to stop the clock meet the criteria of an unfair act?
quote:
games, teams, dates, which official were you, calls you made please? only fair. the rules of football are published, anyone can look them up.
...like I said, mostly JUCO and for 16 years. I worked a few years as a BJ, but mostly, and currently, HL.
"Calls I've made"?
What a dumbass question, but let's see. I've called Delay of game, Encroachment, Offside, Holding, BBW, Clipping, DPI, OPI, USC....is that enough or do you want me to list PF's as well? What's next, you want me to post a copy of my conference ID card and passport?
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:07 pm to narddogg81
quote:still waiting. also, some youtube links to games you officiated should be available.
quote: Let's start with knowledge of the rules and mechanics and see if helps satisfy your questions about my competence: You stated, earlier in the thread, that feigning an injury (flopping) is within the current rules of the game. Would you say feigning an injury to stop the clock meets the criteria of an unfair act? how do you an define an injury? is a player with his breath knocked out injured? he certainly cant play the next play, but will likely be fine shortly. should he make efforts to get off the field to help the offense maintain its pace? how about guy who is dizzy? is he just tired from too many snaps in row, is he having a heat stroke, or just needs gatorade? are you qualified to judge that? is the player? i would say straight up faking an injury is unethical, but degree of injury is a gray area. and if you go by the hunh set's opinion, if you can, do it. quote: Mostly JUCO and occasionally Div II. games, teams, dates, which official were you, calls you made please? only fair. the rules of football are published, anyone can look them up.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:08 pm to arrakis
quote:i mean particular calls you made. like at 6 minutes left in the half i called a false start on such and such player. feel free to use the last game you officiated, so that you can remember. you were demanding that sort of stuff from that other guy, surely you can remember calls you made?
ike I said, mostly JUCO and for 16 years. I worked a few years as a BJ, but mostly, and currently, HL. "Calls I've made"? What a dumbass question, but let's see. I've called Delay of game, Encroachment, Offside, Holding, BBW, Clipping, DPI, OPI, USC....is that enough or do you want me to list PF's as well? What's next, you want me to post a copy of my conference ID card and passport?
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 4:11 pm
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:10 pm to arrakis
quote:the question remains, how do you define flopping? can you say when one player is flopping or one is not?
So, the question remains...does flopping (feigning an injury) to stop the clock meet the criteria of an unfair act?
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:12 pm to narddogg81
quote:
Ill hang up and listen
You shouldn't have dialed in. This is stupid.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:12 pm to narddogg81
Folks don't usually upload JUCO games.....but if you locate one that you think I worked, post a link and I'll let you know.
Was that enough examples of "calls I've made"? Do tell us what brainfart you had to ask the question. This should be interesting.
So, you said "flopping" was within the rules of the game (I posted your quote) so tell us if it meets the criteria of an unfair act. Scared to back up your mouth, are you?
Was that enough examples of "calls I've made"?
Do tell us what brainfart you had to ask the question. This should be interesting. So, you said "flopping" was within the rules of the game (I posted your quote) so tell us if it meets the criteria of an unfair act. Scared to back up your mouth, are you?
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:13 pm to arrakis
quote:conference id sure. no need for your passport, thats silly. feel free to redact any personal information, but a scan of your conference id would server admirably. because at the moment you sound like you are full of shite.
What's next, you want me to post a copy of my conference ID card and passport?
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:14 pm to narddogg81
quote:
the question remains, how do you define flopping?
It's not my definition....it's YOURS. Once again, here is your quote:
quote:
but if its between having an exhausted defender that cant sub out or flopping, i say flop away. hunh and flopping are 2 sides of the same shitting coin in my opinion.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:17 pm to narddogg81
quote:Well aren't rules supposed to be made in the name of player safety? If only one team is suddenly having a problem with their players falling left and right then its because the coach's conditioning or game planning. Either way the NCAA needs to have rules to protect the players from their own coaches too.
sounds like a rule change to me.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 4:22 pm
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:18 pm to narddogg81
quote:
conference id sure. no need for your passport, thats silly. feel free to redact any personal information, but a scan of your conference id would server admirably. because at the moment you sound like you are full of shite.
Do I now?
I'm the one posting your exact words, asking a simple question, and you keep running like a punkass bitch.....so people can decide who is actually full of shite.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:18 pm to arrakis
quote:and yet you failed to link my reply, which made my position on it pretty clear. faking an injury when you dont have one is unethical and against the rules, but what defines an injury worthy of stopping play, and who is going to say which injuries those are? gray area.
So, you said "flopping" was within the rules of the game (I posted your quote) so tell us if it meets the criteria of an unfair act. Scared to back up your mouth, are you?
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:20 pm to narddogg81
congrats. Stupidest post of 2014. even for a Gump.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:20 pm to Rabern57
quote:im not disagreeing with you. you are the first honest person on here. you would call fro a rule change in this instance.
Well aren't rules supposed to made in the name of player safety? If only one team is suddenly having a problem with their players falling left and right then its because the coach's conditioning or game planning. Either way the NCAA needs to have rules to protect the players from their own coach's too.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:23 pm to narddogg81
quote:
and yet you failed to link my reply, which made my position on it pretty clear. faking an injury when you dont have one is unethical and against the rules, but what defines an injury worthy of stopping play, and who is going to say which injuries those are? gray area.
So, you didn't post this or simply backtracking once you realized you posted bullshite?
quote:
i believe its more accurate to say flopping is against the ethics of the rules and hunh is against the spirit of the game, ie the game is the interaction between the play called on offense and the defensive play called to counter. what makes football great is that it operates on multiple levels. a stated goal of the hunh is to prevent ds from getting in plays, or at least the play the want. both are currently within the rules as they stand
Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:31 pm to arrakis
quote:
O really? Then you'll have no problem providing a number of examples...game, quarter, time, etc.
I don't record these things, and I'm not going to take the time to Google/Youtube them for your gratification. It happens, and if you say you've never seen it then you're a liar. Posted on 3/8/14 at 4:32 pm to arrakis
quote:
It's not my definition....it's YOURS. Once again, here is your quote: quote: but if its between having an exhausted defender that cant sub out or flopping, i say flop away. hunh and flopping are 2 sides of the same shitting coin in my opinion.
quote:
So, you didn't post this or simply backtracking once you realized you posted bullshite? quote: i believe its more accurate to say flopping is against the ethics of the rules and hunh is against the spirit of the game, ie the game is the interaction between the play called on offense and the defensive play called to counter. what makes football great is that it operates on multiple levels. a stated goal of the hunh is to prevent ds from getting in plays, or at least the play the want. both are currently within the rules as they stand
In this instance exhaustion is the injury. should i link to heat exhaustion on web md? how about dehydration? are these injuries sufficient to stop play? the whole point is that 'feigning and illness' is pretty much impossible to define or detect, and is permissible under the current rules, if only for the fact that it cant be stopped without an additional rule change (ie player that leaves the field sits out a drive). its entirely subjective.
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