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re: HUNH Rule change
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:03 pm to NYCAuburn
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:03 pm to NYCAuburn
quote:
Fourth and most important. What part of the game does the Batter play in baseball? offense of defense
True, the offense/defense roles are reversed in that analogy. However, the pitcher (like the offense in football) is the one who dictates when the action starts.
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Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:08 pm to jchamil
quote:
True, the offense/defense roles are reversed in that analogy. However, the pitcher (like the offense in football) is the one who dictates when the action starts.
So you gloss over the biggest fail in your comparison, that the defense is allowed to sub?
Then you see your other mistake, yet dont see why its still incorrect.
Okay, you have the pitcher as the offense. Again go back to what I stated. in football is there anywhere that states that play of the offense is dictated by the defense being set? And in fact dont rules allow them to not be? Doesnt the game essentially breakdown in in that the offense gets one over on the defense?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:09 pm to NYCAuburn
quote:the whole point of football is for the offense to try and come up with a play to defeat the play that the defense is running. Both teams get to run a play of their choosing. It is not to use a procedural quirk (which is in its present form the result of a recent rule change ie the 40 second play clock) to trap the defense on the field or prevent then from substituting with the threat of a quick snap before an offensive play is even called if they try to substitute. It is indeed similar to the banned fast pitch in baseball, which was also cheap shot gotcha tactic that violated the spirit and traditional understanding of the pitcher batter interaction. This is exactly the same.
in fact the whole point of football is dedicated to trying to catch the defense off guard
This post was edited on 2/17/14 at 2:12 pm
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:12 pm to narddogg81
quote:
the whole point of football is for the offense to try and come up with a play to defeat the play that the defense is running
now how would they do that? would you say by
quote:
trying to catch the defense off guard
quote:
procedural quirk
quote:
to trap the defense on the field or prevent then from substituting with the threat of a quick small before an offensive play is even called if they try to substitute
it gets better quote:
. It is indeed similar to the banned fast pitch in baseball
quote:
This is exactly the same.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:17 pm to NYCAuburn
Emoticons, the resort of someone with nothing whatsoever to say
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:19 pm to narddogg81
quote:
Emoticons, the resort of someone with nothing whatsoever to say
When you are fundamentally wrong and blindly devoted to it, emoticons best express my emotions when reading your comments. There was no need to correct
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:37 pm to NYCAuburn
quote:since you have nothing to say, I will express your true feelings on your behalf. And I quote "Im NYCAuburn. Im scared because I know my team's offensive system is dependent on what is essentially a cheap shot (instead of relying on being better at running, blocking, passing, catching, ie football). I know that my team cannot succeed if required to play against a defense without said cheap shot, so much so that the thought of defensive substitution makes me wet my pants, even though it will have no effect on the pace at which my team plays. I care for nothing except the temporary advantage it affords my own team and would gladly see the great sport of football morph into fagball (ie soccer) if I thought it would benefit my team. Also, I live with my mom and have never seen a boob.". I think that about covers it.
When you are fundamentally wrong and blindly devoted to it, emoticons best express my emotions when reading your comments. There was no need to correct
This post was edited on 2/17/14 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:42 pm to narddogg81
quote:A highly developed human being.
narddogg81
Posted on 2/17/14 at 2:45 pm to narddogg81
quote:
narddogg81
Congrats, you are the typical.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:04 pm to NYCAuburn
If this is about being able to sub players then what are other ways to ensure ample abilities to sub.
1) nothing additional is needed... If you try to sub and the O catches you ..tough shite.
2) 10 second rule
3) after every 1st down there is a 10 second windo allowing for subs, this also allows time for the chains to be moved and set properly by the ref and will give a standardized timeframe for that necessary function. If you try to sub on any other down do so at your own risk.
3) subs are allowed only after a play that results in the play clock stopping. 10seconds ?
Thoughts?
1) nothing additional is needed... If you try to sub and the O catches you ..tough shite.
2) 10 second rule
3) after every 1st down there is a 10 second windo allowing for subs, this also allows time for the chains to be moved and set properly by the ref and will give a standardized timeframe for that necessary function. If you try to sub on any other down do so at your own risk.
3) subs are allowed only after a play that results in the play clock stopping. 10seconds ?
Thoughts?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:08 pm to narddogg81
quote:
since you have nothing to say, I will express your true feelings on your behalf. And I quote "Im NYCAuburn. Im scared because I know my team's offensive system is dependent on what is essentially a cheap shot (instead of relying on being better at running, blocking, passing, catching, ie football). I know that my team cannot succeed if required to play against a defense without said cheap shot, so much so that the thought of defensive substitution makes me wet my pants, even though it will have no effect on the pace at which my team plays. I care for nothing except the temporary advantage it affords my own team and would gladly see the great sport of football morph into fagball (ie soccer) if I thought it would benefit my team. Also, I live with my mom and have never seen a boob.". I think that about covers it.
so you agree it has little to do with safety and more to do with changing the rule to help defenses? It may be tricky as you say, but then bring the rule change up through normal channels... saying it is for safety is a joke... It is a defensive substitution rule and is not needed....
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:16 pm to allin2010
quote:
quote:
since you have nothing to say, I will express your true feelings on your behalf. And I quote "Im NYCAuburn. Im scared because I know my team's offensive system is dependent on what is essentially a cheap shot (instead of relying on being better at running, blocking, passing, catching, ie football). I know that my team cannot succeed if required to play against a defense without said cheap shot, so much so that the thought of defensive substitution makes me wet my pants, even though it will have no effect on the pace at which my team plays. I care for nothing except the temporary advantage it affords my own team and would gladly see the great sport of football morph into fagball (ie soccer) if I thought it would benefit my team. Also, I live with my mom and have never seen a boob.". I think that about covers it.
so you agree it has little to do with safety and more to do with changing the rule to help defenses? It may be tricky as you say, but then bring the rule change up through normal channels... saying it is for safety is a joke... It is a defensive substitution rule and is not needed....
I can't say it has to do with safety,unless it's due to a player being so tired he just starts loafing and gets creamed. I've already stated here that ANY team has the right to substitute on Defense. It is a GIVEN right in the game of football. If they cannot substitute their personnel as they need,WHY even put 11 men out their then. Just let the offense snap it and score period.If you take that away,the offense has a HUGE competitive advantage for obvious reasons.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:28 pm to NYCAuburn
This is well said
The HUNH offense, as ran today, is premised on abusing football's substitution rule.
The reason the offensive players hurry to the LOS after the last play is NOT to snap the ball within a few seconds of getting there. Rogers Redding, Coordinator of NCAA officials, says that the average point in time when the ball is snapped under HUNH offenses is at the 17-second mark of the 40-second time allowance. HUNH offenses almost never snap the ball within 10 seconds of the last play.
The reason coaches hurry their players to the LOS is to be able to snap the ball in case the defense attempts to substitute players. In so doing, they are taking advantage of the substitution infraction penalty in a way in which was not intended when the rule was conceived.
There is plenty of time for the defense to substitute before the ball is typically snapped but with HUNH offenses purposely getting to the LOS quickly to create the threat of the substitution penalty, the defense is put at a tremendous disadvantage, especially when you consider that defensive play requires far more physical exertion than offensive play.
All the proposed rule does is guarantee the defense a small window of opportunity (10 seconds after the clock is started following the end of the last play) to substitute without the substitution penalty being used against them.
It has no effect on the pace of the game. None. That is a ruse being used by HUNH proponents.
If the rule is not passed, I hope defensive coaches will start planning a designated injury after every play in order to force their hand on this issue. If it's acceptable to use the rule book to prevent substitutions, then it should be acceptable to use it for purposes of making substitutions.
The HUNH offense, as ran today, is premised on abusing football's substitution rule.
The reason the offensive players hurry to the LOS after the last play is NOT to snap the ball within a few seconds of getting there. Rogers Redding, Coordinator of NCAA officials, says that the average point in time when the ball is snapped under HUNH offenses is at the 17-second mark of the 40-second time allowance. HUNH offenses almost never snap the ball within 10 seconds of the last play.
The reason coaches hurry their players to the LOS is to be able to snap the ball in case the defense attempts to substitute players. In so doing, they are taking advantage of the substitution infraction penalty in a way in which was not intended when the rule was conceived.
There is plenty of time for the defense to substitute before the ball is typically snapped but with HUNH offenses purposely getting to the LOS quickly to create the threat of the substitution penalty, the defense is put at a tremendous disadvantage, especially when you consider that defensive play requires far more physical exertion than offensive play.
All the proposed rule does is guarantee the defense a small window of opportunity (10 seconds after the clock is started following the end of the last play) to substitute without the substitution penalty being used against them.
It has no effect on the pace of the game. None. That is a ruse being used by HUNH proponents.
If the rule is not passed, I hope defensive coaches will start planning a designated injury after every play in order to force their hand on this issue. If it's acceptable to use the rule book to prevent substitutions, then it should be acceptable to use it for purposes of making substitutions.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:28 pm to jchamil
Well throw that pitch before the batter is in the box and it won't coun't. Great analogy lol...
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:29 pm to RT58
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:35 pm to Crimson Legend
You're a bammer fan, I wonder what you would say to someone defending the HUNH lol... You'll be just like your lil baby coach crying because he has trouble against it. It must just be some HUGE coincidence that TEXAS A&M and AUBURN gave Saban all he wanted with the HUNH lol... He is just crying because it makes his job easier. This is total BS and if they let a few whining coaches cry the rules out of play cuz they don't want to play against it then hell with the NCAA. This has nothing to do with player safety. Even if it did then they should do away with the game of football because a player can suffer a career ending injury of the opening kick-off. Just whining and that's all this is.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:37 pm to Fat Hampster 420
quote:
You're a bammer fan, I wonder what you would say to someone defending the HUNH lol..
You don't have to wonder. All you have to do is have someone teach you to look up a member's post history. Then you will find that I do not believe this has anything to do with player safety.
On a lighter note, what are the odds that you'll post something worthwhile on your 20th?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:47 pm to Crimson Legend
I do not think the rule will pass simply because many HS and colleges have committed to this style of HUNH.
People fought against the forward pass. People fought against the shot clock in basketball.
If we want "player safety", we should go back to limited substitution and the size of players will go down. Or make a rule where there is no blocking below the waist anywhere on the field and no player is allowed to leave their feet to contact another player. Also take out kickoffs.
There is no way to make the game a no injury risk situation. This rule about 10 seconds is not really about safety, it is about security- JOB SECURITY!
People fought against the forward pass. People fought against the shot clock in basketball.
If we want "player safety", we should go back to limited substitution and the size of players will go down. Or make a rule where there is no blocking below the waist anywhere on the field and no player is allowed to leave their feet to contact another player. Also take out kickoffs.
There is no way to make the game a no injury risk situation. This rule about 10 seconds is not really about safety, it is about security- JOB SECURITY!
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:51 pm to makersmark1
I don't like the HUNH. I don't want college football to be more like arena football. But that's a personal preference. I'll admit that most people don't enjoy the triple option the way I do.
To me, it's not hard to find the right chord here. Let the offense run all the hurry up/no huddle they want. As long as they don't substitute, they can go as fast as they want to go. If they sub, then the game slows down for that snap and you give the defense adequate time to react, sub, and get into position comfortably.
To me, it's not hard to find the right chord here. Let the offense run all the hurry up/no huddle they want. As long as they don't substitute, they can go as fast as they want to go. If they sub, then the game slows down for that snap and you give the defense adequate time to react, sub, and get into position comfortably.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 3:51 pm to RT58
quote:
is premised on abusing football's substitution rule
"abusing" come on
quote:
the defense is put at a tremendous disadvantage,
And the offense is put under several pre snap disadvantages as well.
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All the proposed rule does is guarantee the defense a small window of opportunity
As well as penalize the offense (15 yards) for trying to play the game
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It has no effect on the pace of the game
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None.
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That is a ruse being used by HUNH proponents.
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I hope defensive coaches will start planning a designated injury after every play in order to force their hand on this issue. If it's acceptable to use the rule book to prevent substitutions,
Let me ask you this, Why do many teams have no issue subbing against a HUNH team but some teams do?
quote:
then it should be acceptable to use it for purposes of making substitutions.
You already have several avenues to sub, dont fool yourself that, that is the only way
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