re: Explain the Harsin comparisons to DeBoer with logic.

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Explain the Harsin comparisons to DeBoer with logic.

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Northerner with zero southern ties and honestly a strange guy. Not sure he will connect with fans and recruits here to succeed at Bama expectations

I don’t think he will be as bad as Harsin. He is a better Xs and Os coach. But at Bama going 8-4 or 9-3 means getting fired

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Come on now. Don't expect logic here. These kids are hoping he doesn't work out at Bama.

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It's kind of like you saying BK was a bad hire even though DeBoer is very similar.

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It's kind of like you saying BK was a bad hire even though DeBoer is very similar.

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Ok, do you think he will have better or worse talent while at Alabama? If he is able to do that much with less talent, why would anyone expect him to do worse with more talent?

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because there simply isn’t enough data on which to base a firm conclusion.

the guy has done pretty well, but he’s 49 years old and has exactly 3 years coaching experience at the P5 level, and has never been at the same school through an entire 4-year recruiting cycle.

i feel fairly confident that, if i had asked you a year ago who you considered the top 10 HCs in CFB, he would not have been on your list. as such, you are basing your positive assessment on a single year’s performance. i’m sure Oregon fans were thrilled with Mark Helfrich after his second season as HC too.

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I'm not a time traveler, so maybe he ends up sucking. But I certainly don't see anything that foreshadows it

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fair enough, but as you are well aware “sucking” at Bama has completely different implications. i would hazard a guess that if he goes 9-3 and misses the playoffs his first year the number of major contributors to Bama football calling for his head will be greater than zero.

and while there’s nothing to indicate that he’s will “suck” at Bama by any definition, neither is there any evidence that he can build and sustain a program to consistently compete for conference and national championships, because he’s never done so at a level that involves scholarshipped players.

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I've been an Alabama fan for half a century. The expectations have never changed. I know what bad years look like, still the same expectation even if it's obviously far from reach.

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and those expectations have spelled disaster for other men who’ve held the job before - most of whom came in with far more major college experience than DeBoer.

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And it can't be much worse than replacing Bear, or going through the early 2000's. The bigger worry is probably boosters being stupid again.

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and thats a significant worry, considering the massive expense they have taken on ($12 million buyout to UW + whatever terms promised to DeBoer to get him to jump ship), those boosters will have far less patience for even temporary mediocrity.

as i said, you seem to know a great deal about CFB HC quality. but i’m sure that your assessment of DeBoer’s suitability for the job is based in large part on unfounded optimism. we’ll see if it’s warranted soon enough.

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DeBooer is a terrible fit for Bama

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What if I told you that a Mormon boy born in Northern California, that grew up in Wyoming, graduated undergrad at BYU where he played rugby, got his law degree from a small private school in Malibu, CA, would become one of the most beloved HCs in the history of MissSt? You wouldn't believe me for a second.

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I think the better comparison would be McElwain.

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So, Butter Toothed Salmon Fricker

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because there simply isn’t enough data on which to base a firm conclusion.

the guy has done pretty well, but he’s 49 years old and has exactly 3 years coaching experience at the P5 level, and has never been at the same school through an entire 4-year recruiting cycle.

i feel fairly confident that, if i had asked you a year ago who you considered the top 10 HCs in CFB, he would not have been on your list. as such, you are basing your positive assessment on a single year’s performance. i’m sure Oregon fans were thrilled with Mark Helfrich after his second season as HC too.

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Limited data, no doubt. He could fail horribly, the topic of this thread was his comparison to Harsin and I am saying the 2 are no where near the same.

He's been a great coach so far, there is no reason to assume he will not be a great coach at Alabama. Meanwhile, Harsin was a terrible coach, with a lot of data showing that before he was hired, so there was no reason to assume he was going to be anything other than a terrible coach at Auburn.

It was always possible something clicked in Harsin and suddenly he became a great coach at Auburn, but it would be a silly assumption IMO. And so I think it is equally as silly to assume DeBoer would suddenly turn into a terrible coach.

So if you are going to go look for a young coach like that, DeBoer checks the boxes. Yes more data is always nice, but most of the guys with more data don't check those boxes.

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fair enough, but as you are well aware “sucking” at Bama has completely different implications. i would hazard a guess that if he goes 9-3 and misses the playoffs his first year the number of major contributors to Bama football calling for his head will be greater than zero.

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Alabama boosters have never been that stupid. Every coach is going to get 3 years unless they have major problems. If he loses to Auburn 3 years in a row, then he will be gone. Otherwise, I can't think of a single time in Alabama's history where this is true.

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and those expectations have spelled disaster for other men who’ve held the job before - most of whom came in with far more major college experience than DeBoer.

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The biggest disaster came from hiring a DL guy from within to headcoach, and boosters being stupid. And that guy still managed to get win a SEC Championship.

Followed by having to hire another guy with no head coaching experience at all due to Mike Price.

So who are these coaches with more major college experience than DeBoer? I have no idea what in the hell you are talking about. Ray Perkins? He had 0 college football experience and still kept Alabama ranked in the top15 3 out of 4 years.

Bill Curry? Has a split SEC championship. Fired because he couldn't beat Auburn. His major college football experience was a losing record at GT.

Stallings won a NC.

Franchoine bailed, he was a WAC coach before hand. Had a losing record the majority of his career.

So who is this mystery coach with far more major college experience than DeBoer that spelled disaster? Oh wait, not just 1, you said others.

What you are saying just isn't even remotely true. I told you I've been a fan for half a century, I'm not falling for a bunch of BS.

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and thats a significant worry, considering the massive expense they have taken on ($12 million buyout to UW + whatever terms promised to DeBoer to get him to jump ship), those boosters will have far less patience for even temporary mediocrity.

as i said, you seem to know a great deal about CFB HC quality. but i’m sure that your assessment of DeBoer’s suitability for the job is based in large part on unfounded optimism. we’ll see if it’s warranted soon enough.

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Everything you've responded with has been untrue and just dumb outside the fact there is limited data, and we will find out soon enough.

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It's kind of like you saying BK was a bad hire even though DeBoer is very similar.

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BK spent 11 years at a blue blood, and has spent 2 years at LSU so far. Despite coaching at some of the top programs in the country for 13 years now, he doesn't have a single post season win as a championship contender. He's an older coach and has always struggled against better competition, and I'm being nice when I say he has only struggled.

DeBoer does, and he's younger with much less experience.

In fact, DeBoer took over Washington the same year BK took over LSU. Washington went to the national championship game, LSU finished 5th in the SEC. And DeBoer did it with less talent according to recruiting ratings. DeBoer also took over a team that only had 4 wins the year before he took over, a team in much worse shape than LSU when BK took over. A team so bad, they fired the head coach 9 games into his 2nd year.

BK will need to win 3 playoff games without losses to have a .500 record in post season championship play. If Deboer won his next 3 playoff games without losses, his post season championship record would be .800. And since he's coach of Alabama now, it's the more likely of the 2 possibilities.

What are these similarities other than being white guys without SEC ties? You keep saying it over and over, but you don't really offer any evidence to support it.

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What are these similarities other than being white guys without SEC ties? You keep saying it over and over, but you don't really offer any evidence to support it.

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They're both guys with no SEC ties, their prior recruiting has been questioned, they're well respected coaches, a lot of staff continuity, and they've won everywhere they've been.

DeBoer played for a natty in his 2nd season at the P5 level and Kelly did in his 3rd, both were dominated.

The biggest difference in Kelly is 0-2 in playoff games and DeBoer is 1-0, but as we've said, Kelly ran into some elite teams where DeBoer had a perfect matchup for his team.

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BK spent 11 years at a blue blood,

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Being a blue blood doesn't mean shite anymore. Notre Dame isn't a top 10 team in terms of talent, recruiting, facilities, or NIL resources. They aren't as financially committed to football as the actual elite programs, it's why they haven't won a major bowl game in 30 years.