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Better late than never...
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:13 pm
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:13 pm
Sumlin has obviously done enough wrong (or not done enough right) to put him on the hot seat heading in year 5, but I like a lot of what he's done the past couple of offseasons to rectify the biggest weaknesses within the program.
1. Fix a terrible defense - after keeping Snyder a year too long, he hired one of the best DCs in the nation. Followed it up this year by stealing Turner away from MSU.
2. Fix a sputtering offense - promoting Clarence was bad, promoting Spav was no better, and keeping him an extra year (a troubling trend) almost got him fired, but he went balls to the wall on Meacham and then ultimately hired a proven guy in Mazzone that at least makes it a fair fight.
3. Fix the OL - BJ was a great recruiter, but he was out of his league when it came to coaching. Turner is a stud that will do good things if he gets the time.
4. Fix the off-field issues - between hiring Mikado Hinson and the team packing Kyler's bags for him, it appears we finally have a cohesive team that is past the non-football distractions.
5. Improve OOC scheduling - whatever the excuses for year 1 in the SEC, our year 2 and year 3 OOC schedules were embarrassing. But Arizona St last year, UCLA this year and next, plus Clemson, Notre Dame, Colorado in the future is a welcomed change. Would still like to see some better teams beyond the one headliner each year.
6. Hire better support staff - see the Polian hire. Still think we could use more off-the-field guys to improve recruiting.
Obviously the discussion is moot if we go 6-6 this year, but I think he's done enough to warrant keeping him around even if we don't reach the top this year.
Thoughts? Anything else that can clearly be fixed?
1. Fix a terrible defense - after keeping Snyder a year too long, he hired one of the best DCs in the nation. Followed it up this year by stealing Turner away from MSU.
2. Fix a sputtering offense - promoting Clarence was bad, promoting Spav was no better, and keeping him an extra year (a troubling trend) almost got him fired, but he went balls to the wall on Meacham and then ultimately hired a proven guy in Mazzone that at least makes it a fair fight.
3. Fix the OL - BJ was a great recruiter, but he was out of his league when it came to coaching. Turner is a stud that will do good things if he gets the time.
4. Fix the off-field issues - between hiring Mikado Hinson and the team packing Kyler's bags for him, it appears we finally have a cohesive team that is past the non-football distractions.
5. Improve OOC scheduling - whatever the excuses for year 1 in the SEC, our year 2 and year 3 OOC schedules were embarrassing. But Arizona St last year, UCLA this year and next, plus Clemson, Notre Dame, Colorado in the future is a welcomed change. Would still like to see some better teams beyond the one headliner each year.
6. Hire better support staff - see the Polian hire. Still think we could use more off-the-field guys to improve recruiting.
Obviously the discussion is moot if we go 6-6 this year, but I think he's done enough to warrant keeping him around even if we don't reach the top this year.
Thoughts? Anything else that can clearly be fixed?
8
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:15 pm to NanosTacoRun
I'm guessing the two remaining areas of improvement would be deciding what to do with McKinney and Moorehead. Are they championship-caliber assistants? They're in the main recruiting spots for a staff (along with Banks at Special teams coach), are they doing enough on the recruiting trail to keep them around?
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:17 pm to NanosTacoRun
Oh and Sumlin has got to stop flirting with other job offers every chance he gets. That would be issue #1 with him going forward. I know it's a business, but it's bad for A&M, and Woodward needs to get a handle on it.
/endtalkingtomyself
/endtalkingtomyself
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:19 pm to NanosTacoRun
quote:
Oh and Sumlin has got to stop flirting with other job offers every chance he gets.
After this season, any team can hire him away without penalty. That solves both their buyout problem and ours.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:26 pm to NanosTacoRun
quote:
I think he's done enough to warrant keeping him around even if we don't reach the top this year.
Nah.
This is Sumlin's year. He will field the most talented team A&M has had in decades which includes a true impact elite player right before he jumps to the top of the NFL. It is now or never.
If Sumlin doesn't do GREAT this season the class we sign in Feburary will be the worst since right after Fran was here. Seeing as how we didn't do great on NSD this year that would mean that we go into 2017 without the talent we need to compete. Firing Sumlin after he fails this year and next year (because of a lack of talent) is a waste of time. The only way recruiting recovers is winning or a new coach, there is no third option.
This is it, this is the year. The year we have all been waiting for since 2012. This is the year we learn if Sumlin is a longterm answer. If we only get seven wins we need to fire him to stop wasted the precious time we have between today and the day when OU can break the Big 12 GOR and join the SEC and completely frick over our recruiting for forever.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:30 pm to NanosTacoRun
quote:
5. Improve OOC scheduling - whatever the excuses for year 1 in the SEC, our year 2 and year 3 OOC schedules were embarrassing
the reasons we got the year one schedule were the exact same ones we got the years 2 and 3 schedules.
its not as easy as calling up a team and setting up the game.
with OOC schedules set so far in advance you have to find teams that have open dates that match your own and who are willing to play you.
if you want you can scroll through the future schedules thread LINK where I show just how few options there were year to year.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:45 pm to NanosTacoRun
I agree with all of that 100%
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:46 pm to CGSC Lobotomy
I think Sumlin has mismanaged the roster. He could have gotten a bunch of recruits had he offered some of those "spare" scholarships to "family and friends" of some talented players. We probably would have been avg. top 5 recruiting classes over the past 5 years and would have had some quality depth.
I also think that Sumlin is loyal to a fault to his assistants and this has hurt him in the past.
The most troubling thing has been the flirting with other jobs. It has really hurt the program.
I do like the new staff hires and I am excited to see them fill the roster with quality transfers and late qualifiers (potentially). This could be a great turnaround...hopefully it isn't too late.
I also think that Sumlin is loyal to a fault to his assistants and this has hurt him in the past.
The most troubling thing has been the flirting with other jobs. It has really hurt the program.
I do like the new staff hires and I am excited to see them fill the roster with quality transfers and late qualifiers (potentially). This could be a great turnaround...hopefully it isn't too late.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:47 pm to cardboardboxer
Bookmarked
Posted on 6/21/16 at 4:55 pm to Old Sarge
What is bookmarked Sarge?
I have been on the record for a while now that I expect a 10 win season this year, so they real question for me is "do we fire Sumlin in 2017 when he only wins 6 games because of talent?" My answer then will depend on what the 2018 class looks like.
And that other part of what I saying- that we shouldn't hold onto Sumlin if he fails this year- isn't really something that is bookmarkable. If we win seven games and still keep Sumlin that isn't a situation any of us should celebrate because it means we still lack the killer instinct that fellow SEC West programs have (like the purple program who almost fired their coach for doing better than Sumlin does).
I am just curious what I said that is bookmarkable.
I have been on the record for a while now that I expect a 10 win season this year, so they real question for me is "do we fire Sumlin in 2017 when he only wins 6 games because of talent?" My answer then will depend on what the 2018 class looks like.
And that other part of what I saying- that we shouldn't hold onto Sumlin if he fails this year- isn't really something that is bookmarkable. If we win seven games and still keep Sumlin that isn't a situation any of us should celebrate because it means we still lack the killer instinct that fellow SEC West programs have (like the purple program who almost fired their coach for doing better than Sumlin does).
I am just curious what I said that is bookmarkable.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:00 pm to Chill98
quote:
He could have gotten a bunch of recruits had he offered some of those "spare" scholarships to "family and friends" of some talented players. We probably would have been avg. top 5 recruiting classes over the past 5 years and would have had some quality depth.
I hate Ag on Ag stuff but seriously man that sounds like crazy talk.
You are basically saying "If Sumlin could have signed elite recruits without gimmicks like giving friends and family offers we would have space for more elite recruits." That completely ignores the reality that if Sumlin didn't do gimmicks those kids sign at a more prestigious program like Bama or Ohio St.
I can see faulting Sumlin for managing say QBs, but not for the tricks he has done in recruiting. He is easily the best A&M coach for recruiting in my lifetime.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:02 pm to cardboardboxer
quote:
If Sumlin doesn't do GREAT this season the class we sign in Feburary will be the worst since right after Fran was here.
And you defined great as 10 wins
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:21 pm to cardboardboxer
quote:
You are basically saying "If Sumlin could have signed elite recruits without gimmicks like giving friends and family offers we would have space for more elite recruits." That completely ignores the reality that if Sumlin didn't do gimmicks those kids sign at a more prestigious program like Bama or Ohio St.
We aren't Bama or Ohio St... The Sips play this game (Armanti/D'Onta Foreman and Kris/Demarco Boyd), LSU does (Leonard/Lanard Fournette and Sione/Maea Teuhema). Clemson and Auburn play the game too. They offered a 2019 WR this weekend because they thought it would help with Kellen Mond and Hezekiah Jones.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:36 pm to Old Sarge
Winning isn't the only way to get recruits. The Sips, USC, and UCLA proved that last year and UT (Tenn) and Ole Miss before. There are many ways to get a great recruiting class.
This post was edited on 6/21/16 at 5:37 pm
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:39 pm to Chill98
Bagmen
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:39 pm to Dr RC
quote:
the reasons we got the year one schedule were the exact same ones we got the years 2 and 3 schedules.
its not as easy as calling up a team and setting up the game.
with OOC schedules set so far in advance you have to find teams that have open dates that match your own and who are willing to play you.
We could have opened the 2013 season with Louisville+Strong+Bridgewater. I understand that there were challenges, but we took the easy way out and didn't appear to challenge ourselves at all during the transition period.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:45 pm to cardboardboxer
quote:
Nah.
This is Sumlin's year. He will field the most talented team A&M has had in decades which includes a true impact elite player right before he jumps to the top of the NFL. It is now or never.
If Sumlin doesn't do GREAT this season the class we sign in Feburary will be the worst since right after Fran was here. Seeing as how we didn't do great on NSD this year that would mean that we go into 2017 without the talent we need to compete. Firing Sumlin after he fails this year and next year (because of a lack of talent) is a waste of time. The only way recruiting recovers is winning or a new coach, there is no third option.
This is it, this is the year. The year we have all been waiting for since 2012. This is the year we learn if Sumlin is a longterm answer. If we only get seven wins we need to fire him to stop wasted the precious time we have between today and the day when OU can break the Big 12 GOR and join the SEC and completely frick over our recruiting for forever.
It's an easy decision to fire him if we're a 6 or 7 win team in year 5. And it's easy to retain him of we get to 10+ wins. Even with 9 wins, you probably keep him around.
My point was that if he's only at 8 (or 9) wins, and depending on how the Ws and Ls occur, I think we're seeing him make the changes necessary to have confidence in him moving forward. If he had continue to stick with Spav or not do some of the other stuff mentioned, then it's a championship-ish season or bust scenario. But I wouldn't place that sort of standard on the 2016 season.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 5:50 pm to NanosTacoRun
This is Sumlin's make or break year.
He came in with very few expectations to speak of from the fanbase, struck gold and gained a ton of goodwill with his first couple of years. Bungled away all of said goodwill the next couple of years for a variety of reasons.
For whatever reason, he finds himself here. Square 1, but with a much shorter leash. It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out.
Personally, he'll have to win me back over, both with on-field results, and a lack of off-field drama.
He came in with very few expectations to speak of from the fanbase, struck gold and gained a ton of goodwill with his first couple of years. Bungled away all of said goodwill the next couple of years for a variety of reasons.
For whatever reason, he finds himself here. Square 1, but with a much shorter leash. It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out.
Personally, he'll have to win me back over, both with on-field results, and a lack of off-field drama.
Posted on 6/21/16 at 6:53 pm to NanosTacoRun
quote:
We could have opened the 2013 season with Louisville+Strong+Bridgewater. I understand that there were challenges, but we took the easy way out and didn't appear to challenge ourselves at all during the transition period.
We don't know what the sticking point was so how can you say we took the easy way out? Louisville tried setting up a neutral site game with several schools that year and couldn't get it done so it's completely possible the problem was on their end. Charlie Strong even told ESPN that Sumlin wanted to play the game. Not sure why he would say that unless he truly believed it.
quote:
Texas A&M and Louisville were in discussions to square off in the season opener at Houston's Reliant Stadium, a showdown that would have featured reigning Heisman Trophy winner Johnny Manziel and Cardinals star quarterback Teddy Bridgewater.
Louisville coach Charlie Strong and Texas A&M coach Kevin Sumlin were in favor of playing the game, Strong told ESPN. Ultimately, however, the game could not be worked out.
Because of a soft non-conference schedule that includes Ohio, Eastern Kentucky, FIU and Kentucky, Louisville has tried to bolster its schedule in the offseason.
The Cardinals were in discussions about playing neutral-site games with Texas A&M and Alabama and also a home-and-home series with Wisconsin, but nothing could get finalized.
LINK
Hell, Okie Light and Moo State kicked off the year at Reliant so I'm not even sure the stadium would have been available.
This post was edited on 6/21/16 at 6:58 pm
Posted on 6/21/16 at 6:58 pm to Old Sarge
quote:
And you defined great as 10 wins
Yes that is the line for me.
What is your line?
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