Started By
Message
re: What are the top 3 Worst SEC Coaching Hires the Past 10 years?
Posted on 9/10/13 at 1:44 am to therick711
Posted on 9/10/13 at 1:44 am to therick711
quote:
Assistant Coach Version:
1. Willie Martinez UGA/Auburn/possibly UT, Not a good defense in sight.
2. Scott Loeffler Auburn, 91 under the Bus, 117 thereafter (total offense)
3. Malleveto LSU, ruined a legit defense, took a few years to restore it.
4. Chuck Weiss UF, need it even be explained?
5. Major Applewhite UA, not a great fit, painful offense to watch
6. Steve Adazio UF, murdered the Urban spread.
Those are the one's I could identify offhand.
Sunseri and Loeffler should top this list.
1
Posted on 9/10/13 at 7:40 am to volfan30
I think Bama fans would add Dave Rader to the list of worst assistant hires. We could also add Hugh Nall as OC.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 7:44 am to VFL1800FPD
quote:
kiffin was a great hire
You're being sarcastic, right?
If not, you might want to pass this info along to So Cal, right now....I'm not sure they're convinced at this moment...
Posted on 9/10/13 at 7:48 am to TheCheshireHog
quote:
Does Ron Zook fall within the last 10 years?
I wasn't a Ron Zook fan but he doesn't come close to making this list. He never had a losing season at UF, just didn't meet the UF standards following Spurrier. His record would have been OK had he been at other schools with lower standards or had he not followed Steve Spurrier at UF.
Zook'em Gators!
Posted on 9/10/13 at 7:55 am to UFMatt
quote:
I wasn't a Ron Zook fan but he doesn't come close to making this list. He never had a losing season at UF, just didn't meet the UF standards following Spurrier. His record would have been OK had he been at other schools with lower standards or had he not followed Steve Spurrier at UF.
Zook'em Gators!
Yep. For Florida (for the purposes of this thread), I'd say Weis was way, way worse. Didn't do shite for that offense
This post was edited on 9/10/13 at 7:58 am
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:03 am to TJGator1215
quote:
Shula
While Shula wasn't a great coach, he wasn't that bad if a hire at the time. He was never going to get Bama back to the very top. we had some good teams under him and he provided stability/foundation that was needed after the three amigos (dubose/Fran/Pappy).
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:17 am to TheCheshireHog
quote:
Ron Zook
Shouldn't be on this list. Florida fans will disagree with me, but I think he would have been a good hire in time. They built a fantastic foundation there. Meyer benefited from that foundation.
I have a buddy who was on that staff and they all felt they were really building something and moving in the right direction. Foley wasn't patient. Look at Muschamp's record at Florida right now and Zooks record over same period. Very similar.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:20 am to bamasgot13
I don't think anyone would argue that Zook couldn't recruit, but he wasn't a good coach.
And while I've had about enough of Muschamp he doesn't belong on this list. But it was Arky fans who listed him so I guess I should just forget it.
And while I've had about enough of Muschamp he doesn't belong on this list. But it was Arky fans who listed him so I guess I should just forget it.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:22 am to Tom288
quote:
Muschamp he doesn't belong on this list
Muschamp definitely does NOT belong on the list. He was a very solid hire and will get there. The loses to UGA and UM aren't really on him (6 turnovers & 5 turnovers, respectively, I believe).
My point was just that Zook through this point in his Florida career has a very similar record to Muschamp.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 9:08 am to bamasgot13
If those losses don't fall ultimately on him than who do they fall on? the HC should be the first to account for poor play.
I have nothing against Muschamp but I'm not sold on him being a great hire yet either.
I have nothing against Muschamp but I'm not sold on him being a great hire yet either.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:02 am to ElDawgHawg
If UF wins only 7 or 8 games, Muschamp will be gone. Foley isn't patient.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:16 am to TenTex
inb4lesmiles
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:18 am to DyeHardDylan
quote:
If UF wins only 7 or 8 games, Muschamp will be gone
Considerin he won 11 games last year, no, he won't be gone (even with the Sugar Bowl disaster).
This post was edited on 9/10/13 at 10:19 am
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:25 am to oleheat
quote:
You're being sarcastic, right? If not, you might want to pass this info along to So Cal, right now....I'm not sure they're convinced at this moment...
At the time, Kiffin was a good hire. He went 8-4 (wins over UGA and SC) on a team that had been badly needing some sucess in the previous few years. What he did was awful, and I am a firm believer in karma, but I don't think what he did affects that he was, at the time, a good hire.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:40 am to SpartyGator
Here is the raw data - skip to next post for results
Here is the pool to draw from for the past decade. Texas A&M and Missouri were left out because they were not in the SEC long enough to provide bad hires (note losing seasons required to make list - Kiffin is noted exception) :
2012
05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 3)
04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Arkansas - John L Smith (year 1) - gone after 1 year so not in Top 3
03 - 09 : 0 - 8 : Auburn - Gene Chizik (year 4) - won MNC so not in top 3
02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 3)
2011
06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Vanderbilt - James Franklin ( year 1) - Vandy got better which eliminates Frankin
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 2)
05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 2)
02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Ole Miss - Houston Nutt (year 4) - won Cotton Bowl in 2008 and 2009 so eliminated
2010
06 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Georgia - Mark Richt (year 10) - bowl game every year coaching eliminates Richt
06 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 1)
06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 1)
04 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Ole Miss - Huston Nutt (year 3) - won Cotton Bowl in 2008 and 2009 so eliminated
02 - 10 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Robbie Caldwell (year 1) - led to Franklin hire so eliminated
2009
05 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Mississippi State - Dan Mullen (year 1) - 3 bowl games in 4 years eliminates Mullen
02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 8) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
07 - 06 : 4 - 4 : Tennessee - Lane Kiffin (year 1) - only there 1 year and winning record eliminates Kiffin
(while I think Kiffin is a turd he was only there 1 year which limited damage which means he should not be on this list)
2008
05 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Phillip Fulmer - won first BCS MNC so eliminated from list
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Arkansas - Bobby Petrino (year 1) - 3 bowls in 4 years eliminates Petrino
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Auburn - Tommy Tuberville (year 10) - 8 bowls and a phantom MNC in 10 years eliminates Tuberville
04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 5)
2007
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 6) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
03 - 09 : 0 - 8 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 3) - Replaced David Cutcliffe so Rebs worse off
2006
06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 4) - Bad by Alabama standards but Cotton Bowl win and led to Saban and interm for NCAA fallout
04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 2) - Replaced David Cutcliffe so Rebs worse off
04 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 5) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
03 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 3)
2005
05 - 06 : 3 - 5 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 4) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
05 - 06 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Phillip Fulmer - won first BCS MNC so eliminated from list
04 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Arkansas - Huston Nutt (year 8) - 8 bowls in 10 years so eliminated
03 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Rich Brooks (year 3) - went to 4 bowls in final 4 years so eliminated
03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 2)
03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Ole Miss - - Ed Ogeron (year 1) - Replaced David Cutcliffe so Rebs worse off
2004
05 - 06 : 3 - 5 : Arkansas - Huston Nutt (year 7) - 8 bowls in 10 years so eliminated
04 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Ole Miss - David Cutcliffe (year 6) - only 1 losing season at Ole Miss so eliminated
03 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 1)
02 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Kentucky - Rich Brooks (year 2) - went to 4 bowls in final 4 years so eliminated
02 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 3) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
2003
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : South Carolina - Lou Holtz (year 5) - did well for South Carolina so eliminated
04 - 99 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 1) - Bad by Alabama standards but Cotton Bowl win and led to Saban and interm for NCAA fallout
04 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Kentucky - Rich Brooks (year 1) - went to 4 bowls in final 4 years so eliminated
02 - 10 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 2) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
02 - 10 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Jackie Sherrill (year 13) - NCAA issues aside he did alright for State so eliminated
continued in next post
Here is the pool to draw from for the past decade. Texas A&M and Missouri were left out because they were not in the SEC long enough to provide bad hires (note losing seasons required to make list - Kiffin is noted exception) :
2012
05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 3)
04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Arkansas - John L Smith (year 1) - gone after 1 year so not in Top 3
03 - 09 : 0 - 8 : Auburn - Gene Chizik (year 4) - won MNC so not in top 3
02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 3)
2011
06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Vanderbilt - James Franklin ( year 1) - Vandy got better which eliminates Frankin
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 2)
05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 2)
02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Ole Miss - Houston Nutt (year 4) - won Cotton Bowl in 2008 and 2009 so eliminated
2010
06 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Georgia - Mark Richt (year 10) - bowl game every year coaching eliminates Richt
06 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 1)
06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 1)
04 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Ole Miss - Huston Nutt (year 3) - won Cotton Bowl in 2008 and 2009 so eliminated
02 - 10 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Robbie Caldwell (year 1) - led to Franklin hire so eliminated
2009
05 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Mississippi State - Dan Mullen (year 1) - 3 bowl games in 4 years eliminates Mullen
02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 8) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
07 - 06 : 4 - 4 : Tennessee - Lane Kiffin (year 1) - only there 1 year and winning record eliminates Kiffin
(while I think Kiffin is a turd he was only there 1 year which limited damage which means he should not be on this list)
2008
05 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Phillip Fulmer - won first BCS MNC so eliminated from list
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Arkansas - Bobby Petrino (year 1) - 3 bowls in 4 years eliminates Petrino
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Auburn - Tommy Tuberville (year 10) - 8 bowls and a phantom MNC in 10 years eliminates Tuberville
04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 5)
2007
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 6) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
03 - 09 : 0 - 8 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 3) - Replaced David Cutcliffe so Rebs worse off
2006
06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 4) - Bad by Alabama standards but Cotton Bowl win and led to Saban and interm for NCAA fallout
04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 2) - Replaced David Cutcliffe so Rebs worse off
04 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 5) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
03 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 3)
2005
05 - 06 : 3 - 5 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 4) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
05 - 06 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Phillip Fulmer - won first BCS MNC so eliminated from list
04 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Arkansas - Huston Nutt (year 8) - 8 bowls in 10 years so eliminated
03 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Rich Brooks (year 3) - went to 4 bowls in final 4 years so eliminated
03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 2)
03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Ole Miss - - Ed Ogeron (year 1) - Replaced David Cutcliffe so Rebs worse off
2004
05 - 06 : 3 - 5 : Arkansas - Huston Nutt (year 7) - 8 bowls in 10 years so eliminated
04 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Ole Miss - David Cutcliffe (year 6) - only 1 losing season at Ole Miss so eliminated
03 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 1)
02 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Kentucky - Rich Brooks (year 2) - went to 4 bowls in final 4 years so eliminated
02 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 3) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
2003
05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : South Carolina - Lou Holtz (year 5) - did well for South Carolina so eliminated
04 - 99 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 1) - Bad by Alabama standards but Cotton Bowl win and led to Saban and interm for NCAA fallout
04 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Kentucky - Rich Brooks (year 1) - went to 4 bowls in final 4 years so eliminated
02 - 10 : 1 - 7 : Vanderbilt - Bobby Johnson (year 2) - eliminated for being Vanderbilt
02 - 10 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Jackie Sherrill (year 13) - NCAA issues aside he did alright for State so eliminated
continued in next post
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:40 am to TenTex
2012 / 05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 3)
2012 / 02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 3)
2011 / 05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 2)
2011 / 05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 2)
2010 / 06 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 1)
2010 / 06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 1)
2009 / Everybody eliminated
2008 / 04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 5)
2007 / 03 - 09 : 0 - 8 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 3)
2006 / 06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 4)
2006 / 04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 2)
2006 / 03 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 3)
2005 / 03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 2)
2005 / 03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Ole Miss - - Ed Ogeron (year 1)
2004 / 03 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 1)
2003 / 04 - 99 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 1)
The results :
Mike Shula - while bad by Alabama standards he still got a Cotton Bowl win and he had the NCAA fallout to contend with from the previous coach. Since this eventually led to Saban and the Bama rebirth not seen since Bryant hes is removed from the Top 3 list.
Sylvester Croom - Could be in the Top 3 but he did have the 8-5 season in 2007 and he did inherit a NCAA investigation damaged team. He gets dropped because he only lasted 5 years and the Bulldogs did better with the next hire that limited damage.
#3 Ed Ogeron - While Ed was no winner his damage was limited to only 3 years as Cutcliffe preceded him and Nutt followed him. Viewed in legal terms Nutt at least mitigated damage from Ogeron or Ole Miss could have been #1 or #2
#2 Derek Dooley - Derek could easily been #1 but part of his inheritance was from Fulmer and part was from Kiffin. The Vols needed somebody to accept the brunt of damage the way Shula did at Alabama but Kiffin pussied out after 1 year. While perhaps not the best hire by Tennessee standards it may not have been the worst hire if the Vols can turn the corner with Butch.
#1 Joker Phillips - This is prefaced by Joker being a good guy and part of the UK family, but Joker may go down in SEC lore as the poster child for the Peter Principle in action for SEC football - UK's had the basketball equivalent with the Billy Clyde hire - for years to come. Rich Brooks spent 3 years taking an embattled football program to respectability and a solid footing for future stability. Joker disrupted that almost before Brooks had sailed off into the sunset. To compound the problems he lasted 3 years instead of being let go after year 2 or never hired in the first place. Add these 3 years to the 3 years it will take to see what Stoops can do and you are looking at a 6 year window of damage at the minimum. This alone is what warrants Joker in the #1 spot above all others.
2012 / 02 - 10 : 0 - 8 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 3)
2011 / 05 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 2)
2011 / 05 - 07 : 1 - 7 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 2)
2010 / 06 - 07 : 3 - 5 : Tennessee - Derek Dooley (year 1)
2010 / 06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Kentucky - Joker Phillips (year 1)
2009 / Everybody eliminated
2008 / 04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 5)
2007 / 03 - 09 : 0 - 8 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 3)
2006 / 06 - 07 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 4)
2006 / 04 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Ole Miss - Ed Ogeron (year 2)
2006 / 03 - 09 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 3)
2005 / 03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 2)
2005 / 03 - 08 : 1 - 7 : Ole Miss - - Ed Ogeron (year 1)
2004 / 03 - 08 : 2 - 6 : Mississippi State - Sylvester Croom (year 1)
2003 / 04 - 99 : 2 - 6 : Alabama - Mike Shula (year 1)
The results :
Mike Shula - while bad by Alabama standards he still got a Cotton Bowl win and he had the NCAA fallout to contend with from the previous coach. Since this eventually led to Saban and the Bama rebirth not seen since Bryant hes is removed from the Top 3 list.
Sylvester Croom - Could be in the Top 3 but he did have the 8-5 season in 2007 and he did inherit a NCAA investigation damaged team. He gets dropped because he only lasted 5 years and the Bulldogs did better with the next hire that limited damage.
#3 Ed Ogeron - While Ed was no winner his damage was limited to only 3 years as Cutcliffe preceded him and Nutt followed him. Viewed in legal terms Nutt at least mitigated damage from Ogeron or Ole Miss could have been #1 or #2
#2 Derek Dooley - Derek could easily been #1 but part of his inheritance was from Fulmer and part was from Kiffin. The Vols needed somebody to accept the brunt of damage the way Shula did at Alabama but Kiffin pussied out after 1 year. While perhaps not the best hire by Tennessee standards it may not have been the worst hire if the Vols can turn the corner with Butch.
#1 Joker Phillips - This is prefaced by Joker being a good guy and part of the UK family, but Joker may go down in SEC lore as the poster child for the Peter Principle in action for SEC football - UK's had the basketball equivalent with the Billy Clyde hire - for years to come. Rich Brooks spent 3 years taking an embattled football program to respectability and a solid footing for future stability. Joker disrupted that almost before Brooks had sailed off into the sunset. To compound the problems he lasted 3 years instead of being let go after year 2 or never hired in the first place. Add these 3 years to the 3 years it will take to see what Stoops can do and you are looking at a 6 year window of damage at the minimum. This alone is what warrants Joker in the #1 spot above all others.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:52 am to TenTex
Chizik - Even though we won the Natty it wasn't worth it. Malzahn is the one that wanted Cam, not Cheez It. He KNEW it was because of Gus / Cam that we won the Natty so Cheez It changes the whole offense out of spite!
Mike Price - Tried to pick up every co- ed he laid eyes on.
Mike Shula - One word: Incompetent (watch his play calling in his first year as OC for the Carolina Panthers)
Mike Price - Tried to pick up every co- ed he laid eyes on.
Mike Shula - One word: Incompetent (watch his play calling in his first year as OC for the Carolina Panthers)
Posted on 9/10/13 at 11:15 am to TenTex
quote:
This should also be measured in how a programmed was damaged from the tenure of the coach.
1) Lane Kiffin, never seen SEC students riot over a coach leaving
2) Houston Nutt, Ole Miss, at least he got a few more million $'s
3) John L Smith, Arkansas*, It was all down hill after the intro
Since Kiffin and Smith were only there a year there is no way to put them in the Top 3.
Huston Nutt had 2 good years and 2 bad years so Freeze getting to a bowl in his first year limits Ole Miss to just 2 bad years under his tenure. Not great but certainly not worthy of being #2 on a list that measures long term program damage.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 11:18 am to Dice410
quote:Damn son, you dumb
Chizik - Even though we won the Natty it wasn't worth it.
Page 4 of 5
Back to top
Follow SECRant for SEC Football News