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re: Rivalry Trophies
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:11 pm to Mizzeaux
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:11 pm to Mizzeaux
quote:
ISU is the only Big 12 school I still actually like
I actually like Iowa State as well and have had fun with their fans. I feel bad they have to live in the craptacular shadow shadow of some of the other B12 schools but it does not negate they have some damn ugly trophies.
quote:
I hope you have a great evening.
And you as well
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Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:13 pm to Cheese Grits
Why iS there a soccer player on tip of it?
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:14 pm to TeamCornbread
quote:
Why iS there a soccer player on tip of it?
Hell, let's just say it's a football player.
Why is there a kicker on top of it?
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:14 pm to Mizzeaux
quote:
you've got to give the nod to Kentucky
They had Bear Bryant and a MNC under his watch which I think Iowa State can not claim.
UK also has the elite college basketball team in the country so there is that
On a positive note, Iowa State fans seem to enjoy beer more than most and are a hospitable lot.
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:18 pm to Cheese Grits
quote:
They had Bear Bryant and a MNC under his watch which I think Iowa State can not claim.
Meh, I tend to consider championships awarded before bowl games bullshite, especially when they're shared with 5 other teams and not recognized until well into the future when computers start figuring shite out afterwards.
If that's a legit title, I'm claiming Mizzou's national championship too.
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:19 pm to Cheese Grits
quote:
Iowa St > UK
Relax, I was messing with you.
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:35 pm to cbi8
Adding a trophy and name to the Ole Miss/LSU rivalry was the dumbest thing they could have done. It needs to just go back to the way it was. Some rivalries just don't need trophies.
Posted on 10/21/13 at 11:56 pm to Mizzeaux
Oklahoma lost the first game of the season in 1948 on september 25th and went on to win all their games including the Sugar Bowl that year. The following year the Sooners went 11-0 including a rout of LSU 41-0 in the Sugar Bowl. The following year the Sooners went 10-0 and met the Wildcats in the 1951 Sugar Bowl where the Cats beat them 13-7 in front of a stunned 80,000+ fans.
Think of that for a second...
Like Notre Dame under Digger Phelps breaking the UCLA run under Wooden, Bear Bryant and the Cats beat a great run of Sooner teams that went undefeated from September 25, 1948 to January 1, 1951 (31 straight wins over 3 seasons). Oklahoma averaged 34.5 points per game for the season and they were held to just 7 by UK. UK shut out 5 teams and only 2 SEC teams scored more than 1 TD against the Cats that fall. No non SEC team scored more than 7 points on the Cats from the beginning to the end, including the mighty Sooners from Oklahoma who were never outside the Top 10 the entire regular season.
The Cats had only 1 loss all season to rival Tennessee 0-7 in Knoxville to a Vol team led by Neyland - who Bear Bryant never beat. This is a quote from Wik :
In that year the final Associated Press poll came out before the bowl games, and Oklahoma claimed a national championship. Kentucky, however, also holds an NCAA-recognized national championship for that season, as the Sagarin ratings held Kentucky to be the best team in the country that year.
As to Mizzou claiming 1960 it was only due to a vacated win after the fact of a Kansas player being ruled ineligible. #5 Missouri beat #4 Navy in the Orange Bowl 21-14. #5 Missouri never played #3 Iowa, #2 Ole Miss, or #1 Minnesota. In the 1960 season these schools could all make some claim.
1960 #2 Ole Miss went 10-0-1 and won the Sugar Bowl
1960 #1 Minnesota was awarded the MNC before their bowl game by the AP and UPI
1960 New Mexico State went 11-0 and won the Sun Bowl in the Border Conference (former home of AZ, AZ State, TX Tech, etc)
Think of that for a second...
Like Notre Dame under Digger Phelps breaking the UCLA run under Wooden, Bear Bryant and the Cats beat a great run of Sooner teams that went undefeated from September 25, 1948 to January 1, 1951 (31 straight wins over 3 seasons). Oklahoma averaged 34.5 points per game for the season and they were held to just 7 by UK. UK shut out 5 teams and only 2 SEC teams scored more than 1 TD against the Cats that fall. No non SEC team scored more than 7 points on the Cats from the beginning to the end, including the mighty Sooners from Oklahoma who were never outside the Top 10 the entire regular season.
The Cats had only 1 loss all season to rival Tennessee 0-7 in Knoxville to a Vol team led by Neyland - who Bear Bryant never beat. This is a quote from Wik :
In that year the final Associated Press poll came out before the bowl games, and Oklahoma claimed a national championship. Kentucky, however, also holds an NCAA-recognized national championship for that season, as the Sagarin ratings held Kentucky to be the best team in the country that year.
As to Mizzou claiming 1960 it was only due to a vacated win after the fact of a Kansas player being ruled ineligible. #5 Missouri beat #4 Navy in the Orange Bowl 21-14. #5 Missouri never played #3 Iowa, #2 Ole Miss, or #1 Minnesota. In the 1960 season these schools could all make some claim.
1960 #2 Ole Miss went 10-0-1 and won the Sugar Bowl
1960 #1 Minnesota was awarded the MNC before their bowl game by the AP and UPI
1960 New Mexico State went 11-0 and won the Sun Bowl in the Border Conference (former home of AZ, AZ State, TX Tech, etc)
Posted on 10/22/13 at 12:45 am to Cheese Grits
quote:
As to Mizzou claiming 1960 it was only due to a vacated win after the fact of a Kansas player being ruled ineligible. #5 Missouri beat #4 Navy in the Orange Bowl 21-14. #5 Missouri never played #3 Iowa, #2 Ole Miss, or #1 Minnesota. In the 1960 season these schools could all make some claim.
Missouri beat #4 Navy in a bowl game after the championship had been awarded.
#1 Minnesota lost once that year before the bowl games to unranked Purdue and lost to #6 Washington and still got the championship. They share the national championship with two losses. One of which to an unranked team
#2 Ole Miss is the only real claim for a championship that year, and they only played two ranked teams in #11 Arkansas (which they won by 3 points) and #14 Tennessee. They tied LSU, but they're probably the real champions based on being undefeated.
#3 Iowa lost to Minnesota, which eventually lost two games, so they're not the champion by default, although they were ranked in the top 5 along with Minnesota almost all season (Big Ten Bias?)
Then there's Washington, that lost to a Navy team Missouri beat.
FWIW: The Poling Rating that awarded Mizzou the national championship after the fog cleared and Mizzou beat three nationally ranked teams is also
quote:qualified rating system.
an NCAA-recognized national championship
Heck, if Minnesota gets to lose to an unranked Purdue and a team ranked lower than Mizzou, why would it matter if Mizzou lost to an unranked kansas that cheated and nobody else?
Mizzou just doesn't claim the championship.
ETA: If you actually take an objective look at Mizzou's 1960 season results and compare the results to the other teams able to claim championships that year especially Minnesota, Iowa, and even Washington I'm sure you'll find yourself agreeing that Mizzou got the short end of that stick.
This post was edited on 10/22/13 at 12:54 am
Posted on 10/22/13 at 5:47 am to TeamCornbread
quote:
Why iS there a soccer player on tip of it?
So you're saying kickers/punters aren't real football players?
Posted on 10/22/13 at 5:55 am to tween the hedges
quote:
Ga/Fl play for this stupid thing now
lame
Posted on 10/22/13 at 7:43 am to austingator
honestly, I had no clue LSU and Ole Mrs even played for a trophy
Posted on 10/22/13 at 8:09 am to evil cockroach
quote:
honestly, I had no clue LSU and Ole Mrs even played for a trophy
I just found out last saturday as well. It is what inspired me to procrastinate from studying and make this thread
Posted on 10/22/13 at 8:10 am to Cockopotamus
Here is the proposal by a Gamecock fan on a new trophy, that earlier this year was adopted and supported by resolutions by the student governments at both Carolina and Clemson, so hopefully something comes from this. LINK /
Posted on 10/22/13 at 9:02 am to Mizzeaux
quote:
#2 Ole Miss is the only real claim for a championship that year, and they only played two ranked teams in #11 Arkansas (which they won by 3 points) and #14 Tennessee. They tied LSU, but they're probably the real champions based on being undefeated.
This is what I would argue for
quote:
#3 Iowa lost to Minnesota, which eventually lost two games, so they're not the champion by default, although they were ranked in the top 5 along with Minnesota almost all season (Big Ten Bias?)
Being old, after the NCAA took over the media (circa 1950) the NCAA was run as a monopoly from about 1950 till about late 1970's when Oklahoma and Georgia won in the Supreme Court and the CFA was formed. Back then if you were a B1G team you got on TV when most everybody else was just seen live or heard on radio. Imagine being a fan of Texas A&M and turning on the TV and only seeing B1G teams on TV in TX. Walter Byers was a tool but he was the B1G's tool. Notice how many B1G MNC's the B1G has won since Byers retired in 1988.
This is the one I would clearly argue against
quote:
#1 Minnesota lost once that year before the bowl games to unranked Purdue and lost to #6 Washington and still got the championship. They share the national championship with two losses. One of which to an unranked team
I would probably argue against this one as well. The one thing possibly affecting this is the early history of the Gophers and they are the only NCAA FBS team to 3peat. We may think of Minnesota today as football cellar dwellers but from early football up till World War II they were football kings. A big part of the rise of Ohio State after World War II is the decline of Minnesota. That early era saw many coaches at Minnesota in the .700 - .800 range including Williams 136-33-11 .786 and Bierman 96-35-6 .727. I can see them getting the love back then when it was still close to their glory years.
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Heck, if Minnesota gets to lose to an unranked Purdue and a team ranked lower than Mizzou, why would it matter if Mizzou lost to an unranked kansas that cheated and nobody else?
It is the same quandry as the 2004 year where Auburn went undefeated (and had to play the extra CCG that Southern Cal did not) and they can not claim the MNC after the Trojans were forced to vacate their wins. Auburn also beat a Top 10 Virginia Tech in the Sugar Bowl.
In 1960 Kansas beat Missouri 23 - 7 and Bert Coan scored 8 TD's the whole season. The question is how many did he score that day? Since the Tigers only scored 7 that means if everybody else scored the 16, they already beat Mizzou. If Coan did not even score that day it may be a moot point. Since Coan played for Kansas the following season (1961) It is safe to say if he was disqualified it was after he was in the pros (like Reggie Bush) and it was for his time at TCU where the recruiting issue happened.
It sucks for Missouri, but that is the problem when cheating is only penalized well after the games have been played instead of before.
As for UK and the Oklahoma game that was a very big deal at the time. Here are the Top 10 winning streaks in college football :
1. Oklahoma 47 Notre Dame 1953–1957
2. Washington 39 Oregon State** 1908–1914
3. Yale 37 Princeton 1890–1893
4. Yale 37 Princeton 1887–1889
5. Toledo 35 Tampa 1969–1971
6. USC 34 Texas 2003–2005
6. Miami (FL) 34 Ohio State 2000–2002
6. Penn 34 Lafayette 1894–1896
9. Pittsburgh 32 Cleveland Naval Reserve 1914–1918
10. Oklahoma 31 Kentucky 1948–1950
Take away the pre WW II streaks and the schools not currently in the Big 5 and this is the list
1. Oklahoma 47 Notre Dame 1953–1957
2. USC 34 Texas 2003–2005
2. Miami (FL) 34 Ohio State 2000–2002
4. Oklahoma 31 Kentucky 1948–1950
Oklahoma in that era has 2 of the Top 4 on the list so the Kentucky win is historically a big deal especially as #2 Southern Cal has since been vacated. 3 of Oklahoma's 7 MNC came from this era and viewed today where MNC's are awarded after January #1 there is little debate that UK would have been #1 in the polls. On a side note the Oklahoma coach (Bud Wilkinson) was the quarterback for the Minnesota Gophers in their 3 year 3peat MNC run.. He was also an assistant under Faurot when he was at Iowa Pre Flight in 43'.
Posted on 10/22/13 at 8:39 pm to Cheese Grits
What's with the Mizzou obsession with Kentucky?
Posted on 10/22/13 at 8:42 pm to tween the hedges
Should be replaced with a large crutch for this season
Posted on 10/22/13 at 10:39 pm to RebelFreeze48
I love the story of the Egg Bowl. They started the trophy because of a fight where students used wooden chairs against each other. It has to be one of the oldest rivalry trophies.
"In 1927 Ole Miss beat what was then known as Mississippi A&M College 7-6, the Ole Miss fans rushed the field, some trying to tear the goalposts down. A&M fans did not take well to the Ole Miss fans destroying their property and fights broke out. Some A&M fans defended the goal posts with wooden chairs, and several injuries were reported. To prevent such events in the future, students of the two schools created the "Golden Egg", a large trophy which has been awarded to the winning team each year since 1927. The trophy is a large football-shaped brass piece mounted to a wooden base and traditionally symbolizes supremacy in college football in the state of Mississippi for the year. The footballs used in American football in the 1920s were considerably more ovoid and blunter than those in use today and similar to the balls still used in rugby; the trophy thus, to modern eyes, more resembles an egg than a football. The awarding of the "Golden Egg" was instituted in 1927 by joint agreement between the two schools' student bodies."
"In 1927 Ole Miss beat what was then known as Mississippi A&M College 7-6, the Ole Miss fans rushed the field, some trying to tear the goalposts down. A&M fans did not take well to the Ole Miss fans destroying their property and fights broke out. Some A&M fans defended the goal posts with wooden chairs, and several injuries were reported. To prevent such events in the future, students of the two schools created the "Golden Egg", a large trophy which has been awarded to the winning team each year since 1927. The trophy is a large football-shaped brass piece mounted to a wooden base and traditionally symbolizes supremacy in college football in the state of Mississippi for the year. The footballs used in American football in the 1920s were considerably more ovoid and blunter than those in use today and similar to the balls still used in rugby; the trophy thus, to modern eyes, more resembles an egg than a football. The awarding of the "Golden Egg" was instituted in 1927 by joint agreement between the two schools' student bodies."
Posted on 10/23/13 at 12:10 am to s_i5
quote:
What's with the Mizzou obsession with Kentucky?
Could be KY has a monopoly on the bourbon supply?
Could be UK has a MNC in Rifle?
This post was edited on 10/23/13 at 12:30 am
Posted on 10/23/13 at 12:19 am to Mizzeaux
quote:
Why is there a kicker on top of it?
maybe it's the punter from the Punt Bama Punt game?
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