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re: Question for Alabama fans regarding Saban
Posted on 2/2/13 at 10:35 am to Rickdaddy4188
Posted on 2/2/13 at 10:35 am to Rickdaddy4188
quote:No, the NCAA recognizes some of those. The ones that shouldn't be counted are the ones that were added after the AP started giving titles in 1936 and was recognized along with the UPI, started in 1950, as the ones that count. 1941, Bama did not win the AP title. That is the only one I wish Bama would get rid of.
The only ones I think Bama shouldn't claim are the one that were retro actively claimed using a poll that wasn't even in existence until a decade after the games were played.
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Posted on 2/2/13 at 11:10 am to FlukerFlakes
IMO( which is the only one that matters) Saban is the best CFB coach, EVER. He turned around two SEC programs.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 11:29 am to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
IMO( which is the only one that matters) Saban is the best CFB coach, EVER. He turned around two SEC programs.
You could argue Bear Bryant did too (he won the SEC at KENTUCKY and beat the national champ Oklahoma the same year in the Sugar Bowl). Also, took Kentucky to the Orange and Cotton. Kentucky has never been to as good of bowls and that was done in 1950.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 11:43 am to FlukerFlakes
quote:
You could argue Bear Bryant did too (he won the SEC at KENTUCKY and beat the national champ Oklahoma the same year in the Sugar Bowl). Also, took Kentucky to the Orange and Cotton. Kentucky has never been to as good of bowls and that was done in 1950.
BUT, Bear had built in advantages that Saban doesn't come close to having. No scholly limit, Bama being the only SEC team that was consistently on TV , and also the rest of the SEC was no where near as good as they are today. Bear had to worry about 1 or maybe 2 teams a year( on avg). Now , in the SEC, even the 3rd or 4th place team in Bama's division has a good bit of NFL talent.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:11 pm to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
No scholly limit,
Every team had no scholly limit. It wasn't some cheating thing only Bear had.
quote:
Bama being the only SEC team that was consistently on TV
This is what happened because Bear was so good. Additionally, none of these apply to kentucky in 1950, 8 years before Bear even got to Alabama.
Oh, and Bear also raised Texas A&M. After running off over half the team his 1st year there, he had an undefeated season there 2 years later and won the South West CC.
And then look at Bear during the 70's. Alabama won the SEC title 8 times during that decade. 8 friggin times.
Saban with another NC is as close as anyone will ever be to Bryant. But he needs maybe 2 more to pass him. Bear had 6 NCs, plus 1966 undefeated untied missing title, plus 1977 missing title due to BS voting for ND.
Bryant should have had 8 national titles to his name at Alabama. And also almost won one at both Kentucky and Texas A&M
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:49 pm to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
No scholly limit
This is where you're getting things confused. There was some what of a limit, but what he did was he would hide players under other sports scholarships. So some players on the football team would actually be under a baseball scholarship.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 1:35 pm to thatguy1892
quote:
There was some what of a limit
Nope.
The first NCAA imposed scholly limit started in 1973 after the passing of Title IX in 1972. This limit was 105. Then, in 1978 it went to 95. Then in 1992, it went to the current 85.
Before the limits. Teams could give out as many scholarships as they could afford.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:24 pm to Rickdaddy4188
quote:I keep seeing other rival fans saying this. All teams could do this, not just Coach Bryant. Was not an advantage to Alabama.
No scholly limit,
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:29 pm to jatebe
quote:
I keep seeing other rival fans saying this. All teams could do this, not just Coach Bryant. Was not an advantage to Alabama.
I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. It's an advantage BEAR HAD OVER SABAN. NOT OTHER SEC SCHOOLS AT THE TIME.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:30 pm to FlukerFlakes
quote:
Every team had no scholly limit. It wasn't some cheating thing only Bear had.
Again, I'm listing advantages BEAR HAD OVER SABAN. not other SEC schools.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:34 pm to FlukerFlakes
quote:
Every team had no scholly limit. It wasn't some cheating thing only Bear had.
EVERYONE uses that. I'm not "for" the Bear looking better than Saban or vice versa... but, if Saban were given the same system he'd be competing against people USING that same advantage.
people shouldn't be using that argument.
*edit*
and i'm not even sure where this conversation has drifted fwiw... just chiming in on that part.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 2:35 pm
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:36 pm to FlukerFlakes
quote:
Saban with another NC is as close as anyone will ever be to Bryant. But he needs maybe 2 more to pass him. Bear had 6 NCs, plus 1966 undefeated untied missing title, plus 1977 missing title due to BS voting for ND.
WHEN Saban wins his 5th , it'll be more impressive than what Bear did. The SEC is stronger than its ever been and at the end of the year Saban has to play team that is either ranked 1 or 2, while that didnt always happen for Bear's national titles. Also the parity in CFB is far more widespread than when Bear was at Bama. It's not even close really. When Bear was winning national titles, the SEC was far weaker. In the last 15 years years 5 diff SEC teams have won a national title and 6 diff SEC teams have won the SEC title. This didnt happen during the Bear's reign. I know it had a lot to do with Bear winning all the conf titles, but still the SEC wasn't the powerhouse conf that it is now.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:41 pm to m2pro
I said its an advantage Bear had OVER SABAN. If there were no scholly limits now, then I'm sure some kids that went elsewhere would've chosen Bama. There has to be some 4 star kids in Alabama that didn't get an offer or weren't shown a lot of love because you can only offer and accept so many kids.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:44 pm to m2pro
If you think there aren't kids thy Saban wanted but didn't get because of the numbers, you're being naive.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 4:19 pm to Rickdaddy4188
quote:
Again, I'm listing advantages BEAR HAD OVER SABAN. not other SEC schools.
Then why didn't other coaches from Bear's era match him or get close to him? Yes, Saban and Bear worked within different rules of the day. But, that doesn't change the fact that their peers had to follow the same rules of the day.
Bear:
6 AP/UPI national titles
1 undefeated untied uncrowned shafted Bama team
1 shafted Bama team
1 undefeated TexA&M team
1 11-1 SECC Kentucky team
14 SEC championships (including a string of 5 in a row and 2 strings of 3 in a row)
1 SWC championship
Saban:
4 AP/UPI/BCS national titles
4 SEC titles
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 4:26 pm
Posted on 2/2/13 at 4:34 pm to JDM1992
quote:
His words: we win and celebrate NC's here
Bear lied.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 4:48 pm to Spank Jackson
This thread provided lots of lols. Thanks gaiz
Posted on 2/2/13 at 5:05 pm to FlukerFlakes
Good god you gumps are dense. We are talking only about Bear and Saban. Bear had advantages that Saban doesn't. Period. It's like talking to fricking wall.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 5:08 pm
Posted on 2/3/13 at 7:02 am to FlukerFlakes
quote:
The same rules apply in the SEC, dumbass. In the event of a 3 way tie, the BCS absolutely is used in determining who goes to the SECCG.
When did that happen again? Sure, it can happen, but that's the exception.
quote:
It almost happened in 2011 (if Arkansas beat LSU in the last game, there would have been a 3 way tie with the 3 teams only losses in conference being to each other.....then the BCS standing would have come into play)
If. Like I said before, you're arguing for the sake of argument. The SEC Champ won a game between 2 division winners without all that bullshite you're trying to use.
The SEC champ is not voted the champ. The SEC champ won their division and then beat the other division's champ. Arguing otherwise makes you the "dumbass".
This post was edited on 2/3/13 at 7:05 am
Posted on 2/3/13 at 7:14 am to jatebe
quote:
You don't read very well, do you?
My reading comprehension is fine, your common sense is not.
quote:
USC did beat Alabama early in the season.
Boom goes the dynamite.
quote:
Then USC got beat by an unranked team which dropped them below Alabama. Alabama did not lose another game for USC to jump us.
What does USC losing to another team have to do with the FACT that USC beat Bama? At the end of the season, USC and Bama had the same exact record. BUT, we know that USC was better than Bama because they beat them in an actual game. I really don't know what else to tell you.
quote:
Bama's 1978 AP national championship is legit.
It doesn't matter what you and I say, that title is forever in the books. But I am simply talking to people as true football fans. And if you can let go of your crimson glasses, you would say the same thing I am if it didn't involve your team.
Head to head is the most important, unbiased, and factual way to determine who is better. You throwing in other games has nothing to do with the fact that those teams played each other.
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