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re: Is Derek Henry the least hyped pre-draft Heisman winner in history?
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:35 pm to Grovewater
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:35 pm to Grovewater
quote:
Is Derek Henry the least pre-draft Hiesman winner in history?
That would be Jason White.
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Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:36 pm to fibonaccisquared
quote:
Almost exactly who I picture him as. That is not a knock either. Were it not for some bad health, Brandon Jacobs was a very serviceable back in the NFL. Generally good for positive yardage unless the OL just gets blown up, may not break a lot of huge runs, but the football equivalent of a "singles hitter"... get you 2-5 yards on 1st down to set up shorter 2/3 down plays.
Yea, I agree.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:37 pm to craigbiggio
quote:
Jason White
Or Tim Tebow
Or Troy Smith
Or Eric Crouch
Or Chris Weinke
Or Danny Weurffel
Or Gino Torretta
Or Charlie Ward
Or Ty Detmer
Etc, etc, etc
If it were 1999 Henry would be just as high a pick as Ron Dayne was, but the league isn't the same league anymore.
This post was edited on 2/24/16 at 2:39 pm
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:41 pm to Grovewater
quote:
Is Derek Henry the least pre-draft Hiesman winner in history?
Might be part of the problem the media has with him? I will take pity on the original poster as his university has never had a HEISMAN winner
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:41 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Even if you do think that, Henry's actual performance on the field was very much worthy of the Heisman trophy. Should McCaffery have won instead? Maybe, but the idea that he "didn't deserve it" is asinine. Any opinion to the contrary of that is just being obtuse.
Semantics, but yea you have a point. I should amend my statement to say "Christian McCaffrey was more deserving". Let me ask you objectively, and put down the fan goggles and answer honestly, if you guys had Christian McCaffrey instead of Derek Henry against Ole Miss, would you have won? I say yes.
Derek Henry had impressive numbers in the Ole Miss game, but the vast majority of those numbers game during parts of the game when everybody thought the game was over and Ole Miss had 2nd team in. When the 1st team was in, he wasn't bad, bad he wasn't a real threat. I contend McCaffrey would have destroyed us.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:42 pm to Grovewater
quote:
Is Derek Henry the least pre-draft Hiesman winner in history?
Troy Smith was a 5th round pick
Jason White went undrafted
Eric Crouch was a 3rd round pick put as a WR
Chris Weinke went in the 4th round
Danny Weurfell went in the 4th round
Charlie Ward played in the NBA
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:43 pm to Grovewater
quote:
Let me ask you objectively, and put down the fan goggles and answer honestly, if you guys had Christian McCaffrey instead of Derek Henry against Ole Miss, would you have won?
Probably, but only because Christian McCaffery wouldn't have fumbled 2 kickoffs inside our 20 yard line like our return guys did.
As for the actual running back production, not really, no.
quote:
Derek Henry had impressive numbers in the Ole Miss game, but the vast majority of those numbers game during parts of the game when everybody thought the game was over and Ole Miss had 2nd team in
Yea, because we handed Ole Miss a 2 score lead right off the bat, our backup QB threw interceptions and we played from behind the entire night.
Henry won us football games when other teams knew they were getting him. He wore people down, he finished them off. I'm sure Kiffin would have found 100 different ways to get McCafferry tons of touches and yards, but without Henry pounding the other team I don't think we would have won all of the rest of our games, no.
This post was edited on 2/24/16 at 2:44 pm
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:44 pm to LC412000
quote:
Might be part of the problem the media has with him? I will take pity on the original poster as his university has never had a HEISMAN winner
Edited, thank you for pointing that out. Even if it is a proper noun, i'm still in the habit of assuming "I" before "E"
This post was edited on 2/24/16 at 3:03 pm
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:45 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Or Tim Tebow
All he does is win
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:46 pm to IAmReality
quote:
In today's NFL you'd be crazy to take any RB in the 1st round.
Yeah the Rams are really regretting that Gurley pick
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:47 pm to The_Joker
quote:
Yeah the Rams are really regretting that Gurley pick
They took him at the end of the 1st round and he is a once every 5-10 year type player at running back, even more so than Fournette.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:48 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
They took him at the end of the 1st round and he is a once every 5-10 year type player at running back, even more so than Fournette.
He was the 10th pick. Chargers took Gordon in the first round too
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:49 pm to craigbiggio
quote:
He was the 10th pick
For some reason I was thinking he was the 17th pick, no idea why.
quote:
Chargers took Gordon in the first round too
Yep, and that was pretty stupid
This post was edited on 2/24/16 at 2:50 pm
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:50 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Which games would he have outperformed Henry in?
Let's not act like it's inconceivable that Chubb could put up better numbers against those D's given the number of carries.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:52 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Yea, because we handed Ole Miss a 2 score lead right off the bat, our backup QB threw interceptions and we played from behind the entire night.
Henry won us football games when other teams knew they were getting him. He wore people down, he finished them off. I'm sure Kiffin would have found 100 different ways to get McCafferry tons of touches and yards, but without Henry pounding the other team I don't think we would have won all of the rest of our games, no.
I get the argument, and I may be one of the few Ole Miss fans who will acknowledge the self-inflicted mistakes Alabama made, but if you had to describe "turnovers" in terms of a formula, I truly do believe "luck" is less than 30% of the equation. Both of those fumbled returns were from bad field position,forced by Ole Miss, which forced panic/contact. and the interceptions were forced by our defensive line living in Bama's back field all night.
The Adeboyjo catch was a gift from god, but it likely would have been an incomplete pass if it hadn't been caught, and at that point in the game there was no reason to think Bama could have stopped our offense anyways.
Look, you need some luck to beat a Nick Saban coached Championship Alabama team in Bryant Denny, but you also need players making plays. Alabama would have won the 2014 National Championship if not for pure luck by Auburn, but players also made plays at crucial times.
I will acknowledge that luck was involved, but Bama fans trying to blame purely self-inflicted mistakes and "luck" on that loss isn't fair, and it doesn't reward credit to the Ole Miss players, who without the #1 player in CFB on the field, found a way.
This post was edited on 2/24/16 at 2:54 pm
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:52 pm to Grovewater
quote:
Is Derek Henry the least pre-draft Heisman winner in history?
This is a sentence fragment.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:52 pm to RB10
quote:
Let's not act like it's inconceivable that Chubb could put up better numbers against those D's given the number of carries.
HENRY AVERAGED 5.6 YARDS PER CARRY
Jeebus, people around here act like he averaged 3.8 a carry and ran 50 times a game every game.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:52 pm to The_Joker
quote:
Yeah the Rams are really regretting that Gurley pick
They might yet. Gurley could be an exception, but the short average shelf life + quantity of viable and cheaper replacements makes RB in the first round in lieu of positions with more longevity and more scarce quality options a very risky proposition.
This post was edited on 2/24/16 at 2:55 pm
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:53 pm to Grovewater
quote:0/10
He wasn't even a top 3 back in the SEC, and shouldn't have won the Hiesman.
Posted on 2/24/16 at 2:53 pm to Grovewater
quote:
I get the argument, and I may be one of the few Ole Miss fans who will acknowledge the self-inflicted mistakes Alabama made, but if you had to describe "turnovers" in terms of a formula, I truly do believe "luck" is less than 30% of the equation. Both of those fumbled returns were from good field position, and forced panic/contact. and the interceptions were forced by our defensive line living in Bama's back field.
The Adeboyjo catch was a gift from god, but it likely would have been an incomplete pass if it hadn't been caught, and at that point in the game there was no reason to think Bama could have stopped our offense anyways.
Look, you need luck to beat a Nick Saban coached Championship Alabama team in Bryant Denny, but you also need players making plays. Alabama would have won the 2014 National Championship if not for pure luck by Auburn.
I will acknowledge that luck was involved, but Bama fans trying to blame purely self-inflicted mistakes and "luck" on that loss isn't fair, and it doesn't reward credit to the Ole Miss players, who without the #1 player in CFB on the field, found a way.
Literally 0% of my post had anything to do with saying Ole Miss winning was lucky or a fluke. It 100% had to do with the fact that when you fall behind by 3 scores early, whether because your QB falls down and fubmles for TDs 3 times or the other team just scores fast, you generally end up adjusting your gameplan.
We had to do that (or did, I'm not convinced we had to, but we did).
Honestly, I think that was Kiffin's worst coaching job of the season. Henry was ripping off runs left and right the 4th quarter, and when we got the ball back down 6 we should have let him run more. Kiffin got cute and Coker threw a pick to seal the game.
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