re: How many football games does Mississippi State win in 2013?

He will still want or try to argue that, but he will fail. It's not that big of a deal. He just needs to deal with it...

My in laws graduated from State. Are pretty well off but have Om season tickets in all sports, live in Oxford and give a lot of money. I know several others in Oxford that are the same way. Sorry ...

I'm at umc and have state friends there. They realize that their biology degree from state isn't that will make them money. They understand what is going on...

Worst case: 4-8
Best case: 7-5

tl;dr

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tl;dr

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Too logical; didn't relate

It's okay, deltaland.

30% state? Maybe. 10% USM, and the majority OM. Some smaller schools thrown in as well. Tough being the only medical university in the state. But like I said, they all know where their money will come from

My oldest brother went to State... HUGE Ms State baseball fan and season ticket holder... Sayin he's probably gonna buy season tickets next year for OM football for him and his two girls... He's about to get it

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Your post stated the Seals as boosters and then just listed the others as "prominent alumni." You didn't at all demonstrate that they boost shite.

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Do I need to list every other mega booster's actual contributions to the university? Or is seeing their name on all the athletics buildings and half the university buildings overall enough for you? I've had 2 scholarship-level boosters @ OM tell me directly that they are jealous of the Seal and Mize estates that are now tied to MSU. Funny thing is that Mize willed an undisclosed lump sum believed to be between $50 and $100 million to MSU earmarked for the sole purpose of "getting and keeping a coach worth a damn or getting rid of one that isn't." Assuming that has been properly invested, it's value should have almost doubled by now. This is why MSU fans in the know lol @ the implication that we will ever lose a coach over money.

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I wasn't saying that State has one booster, I was saying that you claimed that State has more than OM while only demonstrating one big booster: the Seals.

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Refer to previous paragraph. Ole Miss has more $25k-500k yearly boosters -- that's how you make up the difference. MSU has more mega-boosters. I don't know how to quantitatively prove that -- but it's accepted truth among high-level social circles @ OM.

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Link? Thanks.

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Endowment figures FY 2010-2011
Endowment figures FY 2009-2010
Endowment figures FY 2008-2009
Endowment figures FY 2007-2008
Endowment figures FY 2006-2007
Endowment figures FY 2005-2006
Endowment figures FY 2004-2005

You are welcome. Surely, you aren't saying the lowly ole farmers have outinvested every single year for as far back as I can currently find.

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You somehow conflate salaries of alumni with endowment here. You do realize that they're not directly related, right? Schools invest in stocks, bonds, and even real estate, all of which are counted in "endowment" figures. It's not just a matter of philanthropic giving, but rather the net wealth of the university itself.

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Correct. I simplified in a way that was easy for many here to understand -- which assumes "all things equal" in investing. Considering the size and diversity of these sums, there surely wouldn't be much variation in interest between universities. All the things you list certainly play a major role. My goal wasn't to dabble into specifics -- but to show a trend. I simplified it as greatly I could.

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Honestly, a bigger correlation to endowment figures is tuition costs. Look at schools with smaller endowments, then look at their tuitions. Compare those to their counterparts. You'll see that even universities which are smaller and younger than ours can have much, much larger endowments (for example, Carnegie Mellon is several decades younger than either State or Ole Miss and has a much smaller student body - yet has a much larger endowment, because they raise a shitload of money through tuition costs every year).

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Agreed to an extent. At last check(when I was @ MSU through 2006), OM was ~ 20% more expensive to attend. No idea about now -- I know MSU has increased tuition every single year. OM is also 30 years older -- no idea how that applies.

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Like I said, this shite is way more complicated than you want it to be. You are trying to simplify or boil down rather complicated phenomena in order to make State look good. It's lame, engie.

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How is it lame? I linked you to the hard numbers now...since you didn't believe my original post. It is not to "make State look good." I made a post that the gap is closing -- and I've backed it up with the reasons why.

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Ole Miss isn't "getting poorer." Sorry bro. I'll happily admit that State's doing a good job of raising money though, just as Ole Miss is.

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Didn't say, nor imply, that they were. It's just a case of MSU getting richer at a moderately faster pace...

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Like I asked, what list is he on and when was he on it. Because Bernie Ebbers went to MC and, before he went to prison, he was the wealthiest Mississippian. Just saying that Williams isn't the only Mississippian to be on a Forbes list. I'm not sure if that's what you meant but, then again and as per the usual, you weren't exactly clear.

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Williams is not a Mississippian -- He lives in FLA. The list I was referring to was of Forbes billionaires. There are currently no Mississippians on the list(nor does Williams appear to be on the current list -- although I can see no reference anywhere of him losing wealth). Again, my post was to paint in generalities -- not precision. It was "clear", you just chose to nitpick.

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And if you picked a different decade you'd get different results. Your methods aren't exactly without their flaws.

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Of course other decades would be different -- But I'm not looking at the distant past. I'm using the present and recent past as the best possible predictor of the near future. How would you prefer I better accomplish that? Never said it was perfect -- but it's the best available.

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Student gap? The difference in enrollment between our two schools is literally a few-hundred.

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You had better check again. Any number that's "a few hundred" also includes UMC, which is literally filled with alumni of other institutions. Most of an alumni's long-term support statistically goes to the 4-yr undergrad. The difference is almost 4k between Oxford and Starkville.

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Unless you can demonstrate that number of living alumni correlates directly to funding for a university (such as its endowment) then you'd have a point, but you haven't yet demonstrated that and I've even demonstrated that the contrary can be the case (as in smaller and younger schools than ours having much larger endowments due to academic prestige, wise use of donations or grants, and wealthy alumni).

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I can't. Nor was it my intention. If MSU grads make more $$ on average, and there is more people graduating yearly, it stands to reason that -- as time goes on -- there will be a larger and larger influx of donations.

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Do I need to list every other mega booster's actual contributions to the university? Or is seeing their name on all the athletics buildings and half the university buildings overall enough for you?

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All you did was name drop engie. That doesn't prove anything. I can literally do the exact same thing to the exact same effect.

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I've had 2 scholarship-level boosters @ OM tell me directly that they are jealous of the Seal and Mize estates that are now tied to MSU.

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I'ave had two State fans tell me that they had all the sad after the Egg Bowl and began contemplating seppuku.

Hearsay on the internet isn't valuable, engie.

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Funny thing is that Mize willed an undisclosed lump sum believed to be between $50 and $100 million to MSU earmarked for the sole purpose of "getting and keeping a coach worth a damn or getting rid of one that isn't."

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Link? Not doubting you, but even you can see how far-fetched this sounds.

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This is why MSU fans in the know lol @ the implication that we will ever lose a coach over money.

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Strawman, again. Who in this thread has ever said anything about State's ability to pay coaches? Who here has suggested you would lose a coach due to being unable to pay him?

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I don't know how to quantitatively prove that -- but it's accepted truth among high-level social circles @ OM.

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You don't know how to prove it, yet you expect me to believe it? And you can't just say "it's accepted truth" and leave it at that. That's not evidence, engie. It's hearsay, like most of your arguments.

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Surely, you aren't saying the lowly ole farmers have outinvested every single year for as far back as I can currently find.

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No, because that's not even what your own link says. In 2012, our endowment grew by 19.5% per your link. Yours grew by 19%. So in the first link you have your statement is proven false.

Again, I've conceded that State has done a fine job of raising money. Why it's so hard for you to reciprocate in the face of the evidence is beyond me (aside from the fact that you're super insecure 'n' shite).

Also, I'll give the grinderz credit: our endowment took a huge hit due to the economic downturn (It's something that I've heard before and your links support that). We have a lot of our endowment tied up in stocks, bonds, and funds, whereas y'all have a lot of yours tied up in land and other real assets. So the structure of your endowment means that economic downturns don't impact you as adversely. Nicely done, grinderz.

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My goal wasn't to dabble into specifics -- but to show a trend.

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The trend is that we're both on the upswing both in terms of finances and academic opportunities for our students. Ultimately, this is good for Mississippi. Why you think this is something over which we should compete is ridiculous.

I spoke with Roger Wicker and Thad Cochran briefly at an event on the HIll a few years back, where they said that most Mississippians would be shocked to see how they work to get federal funding for all of the state's schools, regardless of their affiliation. As far as academics go and offerings available to Mississippians, I salute both Ole Miss and State for working hard to improve. As far as football goes, I hope y'all prepare your anuses, because Freeze is going in dry (after begging god for forgiveness).

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OM was ~ 20% more expensive to attend. No idea about now -- I know MSU has increased tuition every single year. OM is also 30 years older -- no idea how that applies.

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I have no idea what the figures are but I always assumed they were comparable. I'm too lazy to look it up. Ole Miss did recently raise out of state admission standards and tuition, which is a good thing.

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I made a post that the gap is closing -- and I've backed it up with the reasons why.

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Your initial argument was that State is getting richer and Ole Miss is getting poorer or something. That's my source of contention.

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Williams is not a Mississippian -- He lives in FLA. The list I was referring to was of Forbes billionaires. There are currently no Mississippians on the list(nor does Williams appear to be on the current list -- although I can see no reference anywhere of him losing wealth). Again, my post was to paint in generalities -- not precision. It was "clear", you just chose to nitpick.

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I think you just chose to use a bad source. I don't know if this is true or not, but could it be that the Forbes list is incomplete? Not everyone's finances are public or divulged for the sake of a magazine. This could be a complete rumor, but it's an interesting point: I've heard that there are more wealthy people in Mississippi than we may realize, they just don't make such public.

But who knows.

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You had better check again. Any number that's "a few hundred" also includes UMC, which is literally filled with alumni of other institutions. Most of an alumni's long-term support statistically goes to the 4-yr undergrad. The difference is almost 4k between Oxford and Starkville.

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Those are good points, but I still don't think they prove anything. Again, I've demonstrated that universities that are much smaller than ours can (and do) have a lot more money than ours. The number of students isn't the best indicator of fundraising capabilities. At least nothing you've shown has demonstrated that.

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I can't. Nor was it my intention. If MSU grads make more $$ on average, and there is more people graduating yearly, it stands to reason that -- as time goes on -- there will be a larger and larger influx of donations.

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Again see above. They're linked, but not inexorably.