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My current issues with our football situation....long

Posted on 11/4/14 at 9:46 am
Posted by Hawgeye
tFlagship Brothel
Member since Jun 2009
30921 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 9:46 am
I've been relatively quiet this year on the Brandon Allen side of things. I felt like I really hammered the kid a season ago. I took a step back at the start of this season and gave him the benefit of the doubt, considering everyone I knew close to the program, everyone you heard on any radio show, praised Allen and continued to give him a pass because of injury. Well, everyone besides on person though. This person is involved daily with the program and I respect his opinion more than any other person.

We both agreed last year Arkansas would be a max 5 win team with Allen back at QB. As the season got upon us, I let everyone else talking, persuade me into thinking Allen may be a viable option at QB for us.

Well, he is not. He is not what this offense needs at QB.

I know I bagged on Chaney last year very early. Ive laid off of him this year, because I can see mostly what he is trying to do. It all comes back to Allen and his inability to complete passes when we need them. The inability to will the team to victory. The ability to make mental mistakes at the most critical of times. The ability to still, stare down only one WR or TE and then simply throw the ball away if one person is not open.

**PERSONS CRITICAL OF CHANEY, PLEASE READ THIS**

There seems to be some critical thinking towards Chaney on why we don't line up in the shotgun more when we need to pass. Ive seen websites of ours critical of our OC, asking why do we pass with Allen under center?

Its simple. Allen cant handle that many WRs or TEs running routes at once. It confuses him and gives him too many options.

Think about this for a second....Everyone praised Tyler Wilson in 2011 when we went 11-2. I was skeptical of Wilson. Mainly because he could not read a defense. This was shown by our offense changing what we did at the LOS under Mallett. Our Mallett led offense would never look to the sideline for a play change. Fast forward to Wilson, and the entire offense began to look at the sideline for play changes. Wilson was never able to read a defense on his own. He had to rely on Petrino and company to get them into the right play. Thus, Wilson has had not much of a pro career.

Now, with Allen. Not only can Allen not comprehend some of the simplest defensive reads, he cannot follow more than 2-3 WRs on pass routes. This is why we pass quite a bit out of the I formation with him being under center. It limits his thought process. Go back and look at film and break down how many passes he throws away out of bounds. Now dissect which offense we are in when he makes those throws out of bounds.

Being in the shotgun with 4-5 WRs or TEs is too much for Allen to handle. Even at the end of the game against State, he focused on one player mainly. Henry, luckily made some fantastic catches in traffic. This gave us a false hope going down the field late. Everyone knew an interception was coming.

My point is, Chaney is having to make the passing game as simple as possible for Allen. Not too many options in the passing game, or this confuses Allen. Unfortunately for us, Allen is the best we have that is game ready. He is the best option to hand off right now.

Ive got more to say, but Im tired of typing....I hope this all makes sense



Posted by hoginthesw
DFW
Member since Sep 2009
5329 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 9:51 am to
Way to reinforce my already depressed take on our qb situation.

And you've been missed around here.
Posted by Hawgeye
tFlagship Brothel
Member since Jun 2009
30921 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 9:54 am to
I wouldn't be too depressed. It is what it is.

When a new coach comes in, the QB is really where it hurts if the QB isn't very good.

Look at Petrino. He was left with Dick, Dick, and a freshman Tyler Wilson. Luckily, Ryan transferred in and Petrino was able to squeak out 8 wins his second season.

If Ryan doesn't transfer in, we are stuck with another Dick and a not ready yet Tyler Wilson.
Posted by hoginthesw
DFW
Member since Sep 2009
5329 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:07 am to
Honestly, I'm sold as of now on what BB is building for the future. Our defense is going to be winning games for us soon when we have a capable offense, and I love that. Right now they are giving 100% and the blame just can't be shouldered on them.

I just hate losing with a passion. At anything. It's something I will never be able to swallow without melting. At the age of 37 it's obvious that's not changing.

I still question some of Chaney's calls....but, that will happen with any coach and any fan base.

BA is what he is and that's just the dish that's been dealt.

Posted by Feral
Member since Mar 2012
12376 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:11 am to
One of the bigger "what ifs" of Razorback history is what would Petrino's tenure have looked like if Lloyd Carr doesn't get fired and/or Rich Rod doesn't get hired and Mallett doesn't transfer home.

Petrino showed here that he had a terrible eye for QB talent in recruiting, as evidenced by the fact he recruited Brandon Allen in addition to several guys like Mitchell, Youngblood and Jacoby Walker who transferred out.
This post was edited on 11/4/14 at 10:14 am
Posted by Hawgeye
tFlagship Brothel
Member since Jun 2009
30921 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:15 am to
Petrino got lucky with Ryan coming in for him. I doubt we win 10 games in 2010 without him. No telling what our win total is in 2009 without him.

Wilson benefited from an easier schedule in 2011 in my opinion to get to 11 wins. Wilson also had a great group of in state skill players surrounding him.

This team could sure use a Joe Adams right now to insert a spark on special teams, that's for sure.
Posted by Person of interest
The Hill
Member since Jan 2014
1786 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:15 am to
I had hopes for BA preseason if he could clean up a few things. He has for the most part but is terrible in clutch situations. I just don't think we will win many (or any) big games depending on BA.
Posted by Hawgeye
tFlagship Brothel
Member since Jun 2009
30921 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:19 am to
I hope Peavey is ready this spring. I hope Storey can come in and push Peavey. Those are the only two I would want to read about vying for the starting spot.

I think Mitchell will transfer out, which sucks because he is very athletic. I hope Austin Allen transfers out as well. I wouldn't mind going ahead and seeing Brandon Allen move to a GA role.
Posted by Feral
Member since Mar 2012
12376 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:22 am to
quote:

My point is, Chaney is having to make the passing game as simple as possible for Allen. Not too many options in the passing game, or this confuses Allen. Unfortunately for us, Allen is the best we have that is game ready. He is the best option to hand off right now.

Ive got more to say, but Im tired of typing....I hope this all makes sense


I don't dispute that Chaney is calling an offense with an arm tied behind his back, but two things that frustrate the crap out of me are the Allen's terrible fundamentals and some utterly stupid situational playcalls.

I'm not breaking news when I say that we need a pure QB coach, but the fact that Allen is throwing off of his back foot and can't progress through reads at all is frustrating. Plus, stupid things like running sweeps and tosses at the goal line in SEC play and calling things like a reverse with Keon Hatcher deep in Texas Tech territory when we're gashing them with our standard formation rushing attack is maddening.
Posted by Feral
Member since Mar 2012
12376 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:24 am to
quote:

Petrino got lucky with Ryan coming in for him. I doubt we win 10 games in 2010 without him. No telling what our win total is in 2009 without him.


Without Mallett, we're playing either a second year Tyler Wilson or Nathan Dick, and that team probably doesn't make a bowl game.
Posted by Hawgeye
tFlagship Brothel
Member since Jun 2009
30921 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:27 am to
Instead of calling passing plays all the time, Chaney is forced to get more creative because he isn't confident in the QB to complete passes. That's my belief.

Allen could very well be a practice QB. Some players are practice guys, some players are game guys.

Allen corrects things during the week, absorbs all of the coaching from Chaney and Lunney, but when it comes to a game he resorts back to his old ways. There are lots of guys like that in the football world.

Its much like raising a child. A parent can set their children on the right course, teach them right from wrong, but when things go south when they mature, its not always about how they were raised.
Posted by TheCheshireHog
Cashew Chicken Country
Member since Oct 2010
40855 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 10:37 am to
Hatcher did average 12.7 YPC last year on those orbit sweeps. Not the wacky toss version like we ran at Tech obviously but I am still surprised we've completely abandoned it this year when we usually hit it two or three times a game the second half of last season.
Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57693 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 3:08 pm to
quote:

Without Mallett, we're playing either a second year Tyler Wilson or Nathan Dick, and that team probably doesn't make a bowl game.
I don't buy this at all. When Mallett went out against Auburn, Wilson came in and threw for 332 yards and 4 TD's in 2 and a half quarters. That's WITHOUT being the main guy. That was also against a team that went on to not lose a single game. Wilson was good, he just couldn't read a D. With Petrino calling the plays and making the adjustments, Wilson had the pure skill to execute. That's all Petrino needed.
Posted by Feral
Member since Mar 2012
12376 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 3:49 pm to
quote:

I don't buy this at all. When Mallett went out against Auburn, Wilson came in and threw for 332 yards and 4 TD's in 2 and a half quarters. That's WITHOUT being the main guy. That was also against a team that went on to not lose a single game. Wilson was good, he just couldn't read a D. With Petrino calling the plays and making the adjustments, Wilson had the pure skill to execute. That's all Petrino needed.


You're citing a game from 2010 when talking about a hypothetical scenario for 2009? Plus, that was against a terrible defense, and he was in his third year of the Petrino system, two of which while serving as backup to Mallett.

That 2009 team was still young as hell, especially on defense and at the skill positions.
This post was edited on 11/4/14 at 3:54 pm
Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57693 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 4:11 pm to
quote:

You're citing a game from 2010 when talking about a hypothetical scenario for 2009?
The point was that Petrino wouldn't have had as much success had Mallett not transferred. Wilson wasn't the starter in 2010 either. I'm disputing that Petrino would have had the same success had Wilson started all four years.

And that "terrible defense" held a team averaging 60 points to 19 in the title game. And even if it was a bad defense, 332 yards and 4 touchdowns in TWO AND A HALF QUARTERS is good against anyone. At one point he had 3 touchdowns vs. 2 incompletions. The team would have been just fine with Wilson as the QB and Petrino making the adjustments. It amounted to the same level of success as Mallett doing everything on his own, if not more success.

And you think a whole offseason under Petrino wouldn't have had him ready to win the same 8 games the team did with Mallett? The fact that you think we wouldn't have even made a bowl game with that team speaks volumes. That team was a couple of bad breaks (See the Florida and LSU games) from having the same record as in 2010.

I understand a lot of the fanbase is still butthurt about Petrino, but you're not giving Petrino or Wilson nearly enough credit. Mallett was good, but a Bobby Petrino lead Wilson was just as good.
This post was edited on 11/4/14 at 4:15 pm
Posted by Feral
Member since Mar 2012
12376 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 4:27 pm to
quote:

And you think a whole offseason under Petrino wouldn't have had him ready to win the same 8 games the team did with Mallett? The fact that you think we wouldn't have even made a bowl game with that team speaks volumes. That team was a couple of bad breaks (See the Florida and LSU games) from having the same record as in 2010.


Again, this is such a false equivalency. You're using close losses and/or performance under Mallett to legitimize your argument that we'd have done the exact same thing under Wilson.

Also, that team was also a bed-crapping by ECU's kicker during the worst coaching performance I've ever seen at any level of football from being 7-6, so there's that.

I'm not positing revisionist history or arguing Bobby Petrino was a terrible coach and/or Wilson was a bad QB, I'm simply stating that Mallett covered up a lot of holes in 2009. That 2010 team was always destined to do great things because that's the year it was always going to come together for us in terms of talent, depth and experience.

This post was edited on 11/4/14 at 4:29 pm
Posted by TheCheshireHog
Cashew Chicken Country
Member since Oct 2010
40855 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 4:34 pm to
quote:

Mallett was good, but a Bobby Petrino lead Wilson was just as good.


That 2010 team would have beat the shite out of the 2011 team. I don't care what their records were.
Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57693 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 4:35 pm to
quote:

That 2010 team would have beat the shite out of the 2011 team. I don't care what their records were.
That 2011 team was without Knile Davis per his injury and still won 11 games.
Posted by Drewbie
tFlagship
Member since Jun 2012
57693 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 4:37 pm to
quote:

Again, this is such a false equivalency. You're using close losses and/or performance under Mallett to legitimize your argument that we'd have done the exact same thing under Wilson.

And you're using nonexistent data to assume that Wilson wouldn't have performed well enough to replicate the success despite winning more games than Mallett in his lone year under Petrino WITHOUT having the SEC's leading rusher in Knile Davis.
Posted by TheCheshireHog
Cashew Chicken Country
Member since Oct 2010
40855 posts
Posted on 11/4/14 at 4:42 pm to
quote:

That 2011 team was without Knile Davis per his injury and still won 11 games.


That's fine. They still weren't better than the '10 team.
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