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re: Tuesday Night IM Thread
Posted on 3/26/14 at 1:26 am to Rebelgator
Posted on 3/26/14 at 1:26 am to Rebelgator
Don't let the retards on this place get to you
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Posted on 3/26/14 at 1:30 am to Rebelgator
quote:
Exactly. What y'all have to put up with from the general public is obscene.
Honestly, I haven't had too many negative experiences with the general public, and I'm grateful for that. There's also more of a culture of military appreciation nowadays, especially since 9/11, and I think many of us who've entered active duty since then have benefited from that.
Also, I tend to diffuse confrontations, so most folks tend not to want to continue military-bashing to my face, at least
quote:
It just builds up to the point where it makes you mad no matter how calm you are.
I just really, really dislike blanket statements. I know way too many people in a variety of professions to say "[______] are mostly bad."
I mean, I can understand it a little bit: cops tend to be on hand when you're already having a bad day to begin with. Nobody likes being pulled over, investigated, ticketed, etc.
But to hear some of the posters on this board and the O-T, you'd think we lived in a police state or something where folks are scared to walk down the street without being shot in the head for glancing at a cruiser or something.
The VAST majority of law enforcement are just normal folks trying to make a living the best way they can. And in adverse conditions for shite pay. Prosecute the personnel and precincts that are corrupt and abuse their power. But stop with the bullshite blanket statements.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 1:37 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
I just really, really dislike blanket statements. I know way too many people in a variety of professions to say "[______] are mostly bad."
Unless we're talking about SEC officials, then I agree wholeheartedly.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 1:41 am to Rebelgator
quote:
Unless we're talking about SEC officials, then I agree wholeheartedly.
Naturally
Although SEC football officials>>>>>>>>>big12 football officials.
Which ain't saying much, but there's that
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:10 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
The VAST majority of law enforcement are just normal folks trying to make a living the best way they can. And in adverse conditions for shite pay. Prosecute the personnel and precincts that are corrupt and abuse their power.
Stopping by to say I agree with all of this. I don't think that individual police are the problem despite all the issues I have with the "system."
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:34 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Are there bad cops? Sure. Guess what? There are despicable people in every profession.
That is certainly true, there are good and bad cops.
But that's not the full issue.
The officers that were involved in the homeless man incident are probably not bad cops, probably not despicable people. Most likely very good officers, uncorrupt, overall swell guys who are devoted to their profession.
There's more to why people are becoming less enchanted with law enforcement than there being a few bad eggs. Your stance is only applicable in a small sense.
This post was edited on 3/26/14 at 2:35 am
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:38 am to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
The officers that were involved in the homeless man incident are probably not bad cops, probably not despicable people. Most likely very good officers, uncorrupt, overall swell guys who are devoted to their profession.
Give me a break, Sleeping. I'm not defending those clowns. They were not in the right. And my defense of the average police officer is not a condoning of any act of police brutality. You're better than this.
quote:
Your stance is only applicable in a small sense.
Actually, yours is.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:38 am to TbirdSpur2010
I essentially said the exact same thing 808 said, and didn't see his post before I made mine.
But thanks for the down vote.
But thanks for the down vote.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:40 am to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
I essentially said the exact same thing 808 said, and didn't see his post before I made mine.
But thanks for the down vote.
Huh? Only post of yours I've down voted was on this page.
This post was edited on 3/26/14 at 2:41 am
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:41 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Huh? Only post of yours I've down voted was on this page
Yeah, and I basically said the same thing he said.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:46 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Give me a break, Sleeping. I'm not defending those clowns. They were not in the right. And my defense of the average police officer is not a condoning of any act of police brutality. You're better than this.
Shocker that you didn't get the point.
Clearly they were in the wrong. But I'd bet as individuals they're not bad human beings, I'd bet they're not despicable people or corrupt. As a unit they acted in a certain way that is enabled more by the system than their personal morals.
So.. in a more direct way, my issue is with the system, the robotic protocol, and things of that nature more than the individuals.
This post was edited on 3/26/14 at 2:50 am
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:52 am to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
Shocker that you didn't get the point.
Why are you consistently confrontational? I mean, honestly.
quote:
Clearly they were in the wrong. But I'd bet as individuals they're not bad human beings, I'd bet they're not despicable people or corrupt. As a unit they acted in a certain way that is enabled more by the system than their personal morals.
So.. in a more direct way, my issue is with the system, the robotic protocol, and things of that nature not the individuals.
Cool, and I have no issue with that stance. That's not the tenor of most of the bashing that goes on in these cop hate threads here and on the other O-T, though, and you know it.
Also, realize that law enforcement isn't a cut and dried world. People are human and will frick things up. That doesn't mean that the mistakes of a few (and it is a few when held up against the vast majority of law enforcement personnel that are doing the right thing day in and day out) should be used to denigrate everyone. That isn't right, either.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 2:54 am to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
Yeah, and I basically said the same thing he said.
And I downvoted it because I disagree that my stance is only applicable in a small sense, which is something you said, not him.
Also, don't get so touchy over up/down votes, man. Come on, now
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:05 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Why are you consistently confrontational? I mean, honestly.
I made a non confrontational post that was met with a down vote and an aggressive reply and you say this? I mean really.. come on.
quote:
Also, realize that law enforcement isn't a cut and dried world.
I think that's kind of my point. Which is why I said your stance is only applicable in a small way. To write things off because 'oh there's good cops and bad cops' is a very cut and dry stance. There's a lot more too it, I think just about everyone would agree with that simple notion, but that's not really a very applicable dismissal of a lot of the incidents that are shared on this board.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:18 am to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
I made a non confrontational post
You made a sarcastic one. Don't play dumb
quote:
that was met with a down vote and an aggressive reply
Again with the down vote? Make like Frozen and let it go. I hardly ever look at whether my posts get up and down voted. Say your piece and let it stand.
And my reply was in response to your sarcasm. Again, don't play dumb.
quote:
To write things off because 'oh there's good cops and bad cops' is a very cut and dry stance. There's a lot more too it, I think just about everyone would agree with that simple notion, but that's not really a very applicable dismissal of a lot of the incidents that are shared on this board.
I believe I've found our disconnect on this issue:
My stance is NOT to write things off, nor is it cut and dried. I'm not writing off any act of police brutality and/or abuse of power. That's why I said to prosecute those who do. Also, I have not dismissed any of the incidents on this or any other board. Like I said, my stance is that those who do wrong need to be punished and removed from their positions in short order.
My issue is that in these threads that follow these incidents, the general consensus is always and overwhelmingly that all police are bad and are pigs and crooks. When the fact of the matter is the good that the vast majority of cops do goes completely unnoticed and unappreciated. I'm not saying that we need to have ticker tape parades for every cop that answers a noise complaint, but it's not asking for too much to have a little objectivity. Too many posters use incidents like these to vent their general hatred for all things law enforcement and, and that is what I take issue with.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:21 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Also, realize that law enforcement isn't a cut and dried world. People are human and will frick things up.
Yes. But there's consequences for fricking things up and there should be. If you shoot a kid who answers the door with a Wii controller in their hand then you lose your job and your pension. Period. Do not pass go.
But that's not what happens. There are far too often no real consequences for clear cases of police mistakes and misjudgment. That enables more mistakes and poor judgment.
If I accidentally shoot a person, I'm going to have real consequences. There should be no difference in consequences between the mistakes a cop makes and the mistakes a civilian makes. Unequal justice isn't justice at all.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:36 am to the808bass
quote:
there's consequences for fricking things up and there should be. If you shoot a kid who answers the door with a Wii controller in their hand then you lose your job and your pension. Period. Do not pass go.
Agreed.
quote:
There should be no difference in consequences between the mistakes a cop makes and the mistakes a civilian makes. Unequal justice isn't justice at all.
The difference is, cops are in far more life-threatening situations on a routine basis than your average civilian. There is a higher propensity to make a mistake. These aren't robots--these are people.
It is the justice system's responsibility to ferret out what incidents are otherwise good cops who made a tragic mistake in a high-stress situation and those who had malice of intent and blatant disregard for protocol. And the justice system is not perfect by ANY means. We all know that.
Just like your assertion that if you accidentally shoot a person, you're going to have real consequences, there will be a legal process to suss out whether your accident was due to negligence on your part or not. You're not automatically sentenced to a prison term without due diligence.
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:43 am to the808bass
Again, my stance is not to defend an imperfect legal system or to dismiss instances when police personnel abuse their power. Hell, I've even made a thread on this very board calling out an a-hole cop that singled me out on my street for a parking ticket. Not saying that's tantamount to the issues of police brutality I've seen posted, but just saying not all my experiences with law enforcement have necessarily been positive.
My ire is raised when I see folks in these threads that denigrate any and all police personnel, when they are overwhelmingly good folks who go to great lengths to do their job the correct way. That is the tenor of most of the posters in these threads--calling out all police personnel as opposed to faulting the "system," as you put it.
Does that make sense?
My ire is raised when I see folks in these threads that denigrate any and all police personnel, when they are overwhelmingly good folks who go to great lengths to do their job the correct way. That is the tenor of most of the posters in these threads--calling out all police personnel as opposed to faulting the "system," as you put it.
Does that make sense?
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:45 am to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
You made a sarcastic one. Don't play dumb
There was nothing at all sarcastic about my first post in this thread.
quote:
My issue is that in these threads that follow these incidents, the general consensus is always and overwhelmingly that all police are bad and are pigs and crooks.
Of course you're going to see negative comments. But you must realize that most, if not all, people that make those comments are fully aware that the majority of individuals in law enforcement are not evil people.
quote:
Too many posters use incidents like these to vent their general hatred for all things law enforcement and, and that is what I take issue with.
And this is where I think you're confused. When people vent about their hatred for law enforcement they're not saying all cops are bad and law enforcement is evil. (Making the point that 'not all cops are bad, most are good' really not applicable) Instead they're recognizing that the organism as a whole is a bit out of touch, overly aggressive, not accountable, ect
It's a recognition that the system and the way it's influencing the nature of the profession is a problem, not that 'oh my god all cops are evil scum'.
This post was edited on 3/26/14 at 3:47 am
Posted on 3/26/14 at 3:55 am to Sleeping Tiger
quote:
There was nothing at all sarcastic about my first post in this thread.
I took your comments about being sure the cops who shot the homeless dude as being uncorrupt, upstanding, etc. as sarcasm. If I was off base, I apologize
quote:
most, if not all, people that make those comments are fully aware that the majority of individuals in law enforcement are not evil people.
Which makes it sad that they do make them. But people are gonna say what they're gonna say, I suppose. I just don't agree with it.
quote:
And this is where I think you're confused. When people vent about their hatred for law enforcement they're not saying all cops are bad and law enforcement is evil. (Making the point that 'not all cops are bad, most are good' really not applicable) Instead they're recognizing that the organism as a whole is a bit out of touch, overly aggressive, not accountable, ect
I'm not confused at all. Many of the people venting in this way are not calling out the organism or legal system. Read any cop thread on the O-T, and the vitriol against cops as people is astounding. This board has been much more objective by comparison.
ETA: And btw..........I gave you an upvote
This post was edited on 3/26/14 at 3:56 am
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