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re: Malaysian Airlines lost contact with a plane carrying 239 people
Posted on 3/8/14 at 10:03 am to CatFan81
Posted on 3/8/14 at 10:03 am to CatFan81
"Three Americans, including a baby, feared dead
Two passengers believed to have been traveling on stolen passports"
LINK
Updated info from the Daily Mail shows confusion is the operative word regarding what happened and where the plane might have crashed.
After reading the article, it would seem the aircraft encountered some kind of catastrophic event, preventing the pilots sending a distress signal. It may be a long time before its wreckage is found.
Two passengers believed to have been traveling on stolen passports"
LINK
Updated info from the Daily Mail shows confusion is the operative word regarding what happened and where the plane might have crashed.
After reading the article, it would seem the aircraft encountered some kind of catastrophic event, preventing the pilots sending a distress signal. It may be a long time before its wreckage is found.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 10:16 am
1
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:05 am to Kentucker
I did not hear the PC but have they gotten cooperation with Vietnam yet? At the time I last saw, 10 pm they were not even starting a search but worried that Vietnam would not help much.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 10:25 pm to Prof
I think it'll take an international effort to find the plane and then determine what happened. The two people traveling under false passports sounds extremely suspicious. It would be a first-time event for them to be terrorists but they've proven to be creative in the past. I can't imagine why they'd strike at a plane whose passengers were two-thirds Chinese nationals, though.
There was a mass killing in China recently. Maybe that terrorist group lashed out at Beijing again.
There was a mass killing in China recently. Maybe that terrorist group lashed out at Beijing again.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 10:43 pm to Kentucker
^^I think you may be right about terror being a consideration/possibility but the Uyghurs who were responsible for that knife attack are really too unorganized and poor for a hijacking like this, imo. They're not like Chechens, the IRA, or the various Islamic groups but backwards, uneducated podunks with no money or training. They live in an autonomous region and mostly retaliate when China kills or cracks down to hard on them - a kid gets killed they retaliate against police. The reason for the current anger/tension is that a bunch of Han Chinese have moved into their autonomous region and they're favored by the government. But they're not a true terrorist group, more like a minority that gets mad every now and then over perceived wrongs and retaliates or commits domestic violence.
Now there may be others. China has a lot of ethnic groups who have more knowledge/resources and capabilities. It's just that even getting a Uyghar to Malaysia to begin with would be very difficult given how limited their resources and $$$ are.
That said, you never know.
Now there may be others. China has a lot of ethnic groups who have more knowledge/resources and capabilities. It's just that even getting a Uyghar to Malaysia to begin with would be very difficult given how limited their resources and $$$ are.
That said, you never know.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 10:52 pm to Mizzeaux
quote:
1. Bomb 2. Structural Failure 3. Weather
1) the debris field would be wide spread if it blew apart so not likely
2) they haven't found pieces of debris separate from a main crash
3) possible but not likely. Most storms the plane would have detected and avoided or can handle the wx
What probably happened is they somehow got the plane into a stall and plunged straight into the ocean similar to the 2009 Air France accident.
The 777 has a single engine service ceiling greater than any of the obstacles in the area and it wasn't carrying full fuel so it was light.
For what it's worth my father flies the 777 and I am an airline pilot myself. Most of the options you listed just don't seem probable.
So sad
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:03 pm to Prof
More likely al Qaeda or Jemaah Islamiyah. Al Qaeda has used Kuala Lumpur as a logistical base before. It would surprise me if it's terrorism and it's not AQ/JI-linked.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:11 pm to Jma313
Weather has been eliminated by NTSB which is now doing the investigation portion. FAA and even Boeing have joined it as well. A former NTSB official said that a bomb OR explosive decompression was most likely -- they were at 35,000 feet and climbing.
NTSB and FAA involvement makes sense. US NAVY helping makes sense but the FBI? Makes no sense. Apparently there are 2 passengers other than the 2 with fake passports who are being looked at.
Now, a pilot who was flying 30 minutes ahead of the flight has said that he spoke to the Malaysian flight. He was contacted by Vietnamese ATC and asked to try and establish contact with the flight. He said he spoke with the Malaysian flight via the emergency channel BUT said there was tons of interference and couldn't tell if he was speaking with the pilots (there was an unspoken implication that he knew their voices). He also said he heard mumbling in the background.
Here's the link on that one:
LINK
And a good infographic regarding showing the two planes:
NTSB and FAA involvement makes sense. US NAVY helping makes sense but the FBI? Makes no sense. Apparently there are 2 passengers other than the 2 with fake passports who are being looked at.
Now, a pilot who was flying 30 minutes ahead of the flight has said that he spoke to the Malaysian flight. He was contacted by Vietnamese ATC and asked to try and establish contact with the flight. He said he spoke with the Malaysian flight via the emergency channel BUT said there was tons of interference and couldn't tell if he was speaking with the pilots (there was an unspoken implication that he knew their voices). He also said he heard mumbling in the background.
Here's the link on that one:
LINK
And a good infographic regarding showing the two planes:
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:13 pm to Prof
Very odd.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:15 pm to Jma313
I've seen a lot of people saying that it was a hijacking which I don't think is likely either.
Doesn't the 777 have a very secure cockpit? These were very experienced pilots. They weren't likely going to open the cockpit door.
I know that it's the most advanced commercial airliner that's out there today.
There were reports of two very large oil slicks which would indicate that there was some sort of break up unless I haven't seen the latest reports.
Doesn't the 777 have a very secure cockpit? These were very experienced pilots. They weren't likely going to open the cockpit door.
I know that it's the most advanced commercial airliner that's out there today.
There were reports of two very large oil slicks which would indicate that there was some sort of break up unless I haven't seen the latest reports.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:17 pm to Jma313
quote:
1) the debris field would be wide spread if it blew apart so not likely
They haven't found debris at all.
quote:
2) they haven't found pieces of debris separate from a main crash
Same as above. There's no crash site yet.
quote:
3) possible but not likely. Most storms the plane would have detected and avoided or can handle the wx
I was thinking CAT, but I agree.
ETA: From what I'm reading, there's at least 3 PAX on the plane with false passports, and all those tickets were sold on a code share type deal with China Southern Airlines.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 11:18 pm
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:26 pm to Mizzeaux
quote:
ETA: From what I'm reading, there's at least 3 PAX on the plane with false passports, and all those tickets were sold on a code share type deal with China Southern Airlines.
That would lead one to think more of the possibility of a bomb on board.
That would honestly be the best scenario for a plane cruising at 35,000 feet as horrible as that may seem.
If it was something mechanical to the extent that the pilots couldn't even even send a mayday signal, I can't even imagine the terror that those people would have faced.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:29 pm to Mizzeaux
According to Malaysia's The Star Online, these are the very latest developments:
No one knows where the plane might have crashed or why;
At least two more passengers, besides those with false passports, are under suspicion;
The plane might have been trying to get back to Kuala Lumpur.
No one knows where the plane might have crashed or why;
At least two more passengers, besides those with false passports, are under suspicion;
The plane might have been trying to get back to Kuala Lumpur.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:30 pm to CatFan81
I hear what you're saying catfan but either scenario is frightening. If it was explosive decompression there would still be several seconds of sheer terror as the plain ripped apart and you headed down toward earth or the ocean.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:32 pm to Prof
No doubt that it would have been horrific. I can't imagine anything more horrific than plunging into the South China Sea from 35,000 feet though.
At 35,000 feet they should have been cruising smoothly.
At 35,000 feet they should have been cruising smoothly.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:38 pm to CatFan81
Lack of a mayday or something isn't a big deal and really isn't unusual. In an emergency you do three things: Aviate, Navigate, Communicate, in that order.
You don't take attention away from trying to gain control of the aircraft to key the mic and tell ATC what's going on.
You don't take attention away from trying to gain control of the aircraft to key the mic and tell ATC what's going on.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:44 pm to Jma313
quote:
What probably happened is they somehow got the plane into a stall and plunged straight into the ocean similar to the 2009 Air France accident.
Could a catastrophic electrical failure cause the plane to plummet straight downward? I ask that because I read somewhere that the 777 could glide for 40 minutes from a height of 35,000 feet.
It's the only scenario UNder which I can imagine the plane dropping off the radar so quickly short of an explosion. Neither scenario would give the pilots time to radio for help.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:47 pm to Mizzeaux
quote:
In an emergency you do three things: Aviate, Navigate, Communicate, in that order.
From my understanding Asian pilots don't have nearly the navigational and manual training of western pilots so I guess anything's feasible.
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:49 pm to Kentucker
quote:
Could a catastrophic electrical failure cause the plane to plummet straight downward?
I'm pretty sure that's what happened with the Alaskan Airlines flight a few years ago. Even they had time to communicate with nearby airports though.
ETA: It wasn't a problem with their electrical equipment. It was the stabilizer? Still, it caused a plummet.
This post was edited on 3/8/14 at 11:50 pm
Posted on 3/8/14 at 11:54 pm to CatFan81
quote:
I'm pretty sure that's what happened with the Alaskan Airlines flight a few years ago. Even they had time to communicate with nearby airports though. ETA: It wasn't a problem with their electrical equipment. It was the stabilizer? Still, it caused a plummet.
Yeah, I remember that one. It was featured on an episode of Gone in Seconds. Horrifyingly scary.
The 777 is so advanced that I thought it might have its wing and rudder controls tied into the electrical system. I know older planes were more subject to loss of control when the hydraulics were impaired.
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