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re: Do you feel bad about the US dropping the atomic bombs on Japan?
Posted on 2/25/15 at 8:51 am to 3nOut
Posted on 2/25/15 at 8:51 am to 3nOut
quote:
Just to defend her, no she never carried water for ISIS, but when Islam comes up she gets really defensive in the face of facts and common sense
I hate all religion equally. I just find it absurd that people lump all Muslims into the terrorist category. Christians would be up in arms if they were all lumped into the abortion bomber or Fred Phelps follower category.
3
Posted on 2/25/15 at 8:51 am to Hardy_Har
"Ideals are peaceful, history is violent."
Posted on 2/25/15 at 8:55 am to OBReb6
No
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:05 am to skirpnasty
quote:
While this is true, Pearl Harbor targeted military while 9/11 and the atomic bombs primarily targeted civilians.
Geez, I can't believe that I'm about to be labeled like some terrorist supporter like Catfan but here goes...
You can easily make the argument that the 9/11 attacks were against valid military targets. First, the Pentagon is a no-brainer. Clearly a military target. Second, the plane that went down in PA was probably bound for a DC target. While some argue against it, the targeting of an enemy's political leadership is generally an accepted tactic.
That leaves the WTC. Certainly a civilian owned and occupied target, but also a big part of the US financial (and thus industrial) hub and destroying the industrial and economic base of the enemy is a valid military objective.
Understand, I'm in no way defending the attacks themselves. I honestly would have supported the use of groundburst nukes to get the frickers when they where holed up in the Afghan mountains but from a military operations perspective, the targets they hit that day were pretty legit.
As far as the a-bomb targets go, Hiroshima was the headquarters for the Japanese Second Army - the unit in charge of defending Kyushu - which was to be invaded in a couple of months. It was also a transportation hub that hadn't been hit by previous bombing raids. Nagasaki was a major seaport, shipyards, and also home to steelworks and ordinance plants. Like Hiroshima, it had also been mostly spared from earlier raids. It was also the alternate target that day. The primary was socked in by clouds and smoke. Again, both were pretty legit targets.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:15 am to Vols&Shaft83
quote:
Vols&Shaft83
Catsessed, bitch.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:15 am to skirpnasty
I'm curious why the idea of civilians being an invalid target seems to be 100% accepted here.
WW2 was a "total war" where entire populaces were required to keep it going. Why is it morally wrong to bomb the factory full of civilian workers building the guns, but morally acceptable to bomb the uniformed logistics trains bringing the guns to the front, or the uniformed units who fire the guns at the front.
Do you really have to wait until the guns or people are actually firing at you?
WW2 was a "total war" where entire populaces were required to keep it going. Why is it morally wrong to bomb the factory full of civilian workers building the guns, but morally acceptable to bomb the uniformed logistics trains bringing the guns to the front, or the uniformed units who fire the guns at the front.
Do you really have to wait until the guns or people are actually firing at you?
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:17 am to CatFan81
quote:
I hate all religion equally. I just find it absurd that people lump all Muslims into the terrorist category. Christians would be up in arms if they were all lumped into the abortion bomber or Fred Phelps follower category.
terrible anology. Christian, Buddhist, Scientology or whatever religions rarely commit terrorist acts these days. But I'm so tired of these Muslim sand ******* terrorists making half of world news practically every frickin day. All religions are not alike. Muslim practically has monopoly on terrorism.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:25 am to OBReb6
Sure I do. But the consequences weren't understood. Is it okay to be horrified by the results, but agree with the decision as it was made?
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:30 am to cokebottleag
This thread can basically be boiled down to self-defense. How you feel about that will shape how you feel about Pearl, 9/11, and the Japan bombings.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:31 am to cokebottleag
quote:
I'm curious why the idea of civilians being an invalid target seems to be 100% accepted here.
WW2 was a "total war" where entire populaces were required to keep it going. Why is it morally wrong to bomb the factory full of civilian workers building the guns, but morally acceptable to bomb the uniformed logistics trains bringing the guns to the front, or the uniformed units who fire the guns at the front.
Do you really have to wait until the guns or people are actually firing at you?
You answered your own question in your post.
The world hasn't seen total war since 1945. Those old enough to have participated are now in their late 80s or 90s and those old enough to have meaningful memories of it are in their late 70s.
Those of us who study history may have a conceptual idea, but even we don't have a real grasp of what that means. People who only get their history in school and on the History/Hitler/Aliens channels have no idea at all.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:36 am to Legendary0903
quote:War is not fun, and one cannot win a war playing nice. For some reason people today have lost sight of this.
Yes. A ridiculous amount of innocent, albeit brainwashed, citizens died. Men, women, and children. They died to force the hand of a few deranged men at the top.
This post was edited on 2/25/15 at 10:21 am
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:37 am to CatFan81
quote:
I hate all religion equally. I just find it absurd that people lump all Muslims into the terrorist category. Christians would be up in arms if they were all lumped into the abortion bomber or Fred Phelps follower category.
I think we do a bad job of blaming economic and social characteristics that go beyond Islam. African war lords and their militias are just as violent and terrorist as these radical Islamist sects, but no one wants to come out and condemn some voodoo or whatever it is they support, or draw any parallels between these two groups. No one is out there saying that these African war Lords and their shite is as dangerous as Islam, or the reason they are violent. Poor, uneducated, power hungry, and cheap access to arms is the common denominator. No one wants to talk about that for some reason. Don't get me wrong, Islam is a great vehicle for terrorism, and their anti-Zionist culture, where even the non-violent and wealthy support the terrorist activities (not unlike rich African Generals) takes it to extremes those African War Lords can't. I mean dealing with those racists in Dixie, its not hard to believe that some of those people around you lump all Muslims together, but there are those like me that have a context for their power, and still think the the culture of Islam is a great contributor. Much like I don't think all Christians are homophobes, and I think homophobia is rooted in internal insecurity of one's own sexuality, that doesn't mean I don't think Christian culture is very anti-homosexual and promotes dangerous ideas that lead kids all across the country to commit suicide. Issues are multifaceted. Islam in those regions definitely promotes terrorism on a very large scale.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 9:49 am to TeLeFaWx
quote:
I mean dealing with those racists in Dixie, its not hard to believe that some of those people around you lump all Muslims together,
Troll post. There's more fat hats in Texas waiving the American flag doing just what you described than ANYWHERE and you know it..
quote:
but no one wants to come out and condemn some voodoo or whatever it is they support, or draw any parallels between these two groups. No one is out there saying that these African war Lords and their shite is as dangerous as Islam, or the reason they are violent. Poor, uneducated, power hungry, and cheap access to arms is the common denominator. No one wants to talk about that for some reason.
Warlords don't use Voodoo as the vehicle for their violence, Neither does anyone else other than Radical Islamist / Wahadis. What you're failing to acknowledge is that Islam was made form-fitted to rise the poor up against christianity, and there's no bigger conductor for Islam than poverty and violence. It's doctrined that way and hate driven. Everything is done for a reason, and that's why Muhammad the camel salesman made it that way he did.
This post was edited on 2/25/15 at 9:50 am
Posted on 2/25/15 at 10:09 am to Hardy_Har
quote:
Troll post. There's more fat hats in Texas waiving the American flag doing just what you described than ANYWHERE and you know it..
False.
quote:
Warlords don't use Voodoo as the vehicle for their violence, Neither does anyone else other than Radical Islamist / Wahadis. What you're failing to acknowledge is that Islam was made form-fitted to rise the poor up against christianity, and there's no bigger conductor for Islam than poverty and violence. It's doctrined that way and hate driven. Everything is done for a reason, and that's why Muhammad the camel salesman made it that way he did.
There is so much wrong with this I don't know where to begin.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 10:15 am to TeLeFaWx
quote:
There is so much wrong with this I don't know where to begin.
I wouldn't either if I were trying to argue against a group of religions that haven't been voilent in hundreds of years.. In the US, Mormons were the last real violent bunch but you'll see no light shed there.
I'm not pushing any religion here, but if you deny the direct link / natural monopoly between Islam and terrorism then You're blind as frick. NSA hires farsey linguists 9 to 1 on other languages.
You were just shitting on rednecks because you know the way to Catfan's heart (weak).. Texas is the gloat boat of relentless Muslim hating patriots.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 10:18 am to TeLeFaWx
quote:
that doesn't mean I don't think Christian culture is very anti-homosexual and promotes dangerous ideas that lead kids all across the country to commit suicide. Issues are multifaceted.
I'm glad you haven't pulled the trigger yet.. Really.
All your shite is a troll
Posted on 2/25/15 at 10:38 am to Hardy_Har
quote:
I wouldn't either if I were trying to argue against a group of religions that haven't been voilent in hundreds of years.. In the US, Mormons were the last real violent bunch but you'll see no light shed there.
I have no idea what you're even saying at this point.
quote:
I'm not pushing any religion here, but if you deny the direct link / natural monopoly between Islam and terrorism then You're blind as frick. NSA hires farsey linguists 9 to 1 on other languages.
Deny a direct link? You're saying that Islam was purposefully crafted to terrorize Christianity. That's insane. Jesus appears 93 times in the Koran.
quote:
ou were just shitting on rednecks because you know the way to Catfan's heart (weak)..
Mississippi is the dumbest/poorest/least educated state in the Union. These are facts you can't get past.
quote:
Texas is the gloat boat of relentless Muslim hating patriots.
False. There are plenty of Muslims in Texas. I grew up with more than a few. In wealthy/educated/populated areas(things that Mississippi completely lacks) you find people of all different backgrounds.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 10:39 am to Hardy_Har
quote:
All your shite is a troll
Cool. You're dumb and poor and from Mississippi. I could have just said you're from Mississippi and covered the first two, but I felt you'd enjoy the whole thing.
Posted on 2/25/15 at 10:41 am to SavageOrangeJug
quote:
Tough shite.
man, you're so cool
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