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re: Bush in 2007 delivered eerily accurate warning about Iraq unrest
Posted on 9/12/14 at 10:47 am to Stonehog
Posted on 9/12/14 at 10:47 am to Stonehog
I know you haven't. I was kidding.
But I am curious as to your theory (or maybe more than a theory) as to why Bush lied his way into Iraq?
I've read many theories on it, all of which I thought were far-fetched. Honestly curious, not trying to troll or flame.
But I am curious as to your theory (or maybe more than a theory) as to why Bush lied his way into Iraq?
I've read many theories on it, all of which I thought were far-fetched. Honestly curious, not trying to troll or flame.
0
Posted on 9/12/14 at 10:48 am to 3nOut
quote:
You are lying to yourself if you were shocked that there weren't WMDs in Iraq considering what Sadam had done in the past to his own people.
I wouldn't say shocked is the right word, but I really wasn't surprised. Neo-cons(and Bush really wasn't one, but had plenty on his staff - Cheney) are notorious for ginning up fear of some perceived boogey man around the corner. Yes, Saddam used chemical weapons on his own people(the Kurds), but most, if not all, of that use was in the late 80's. Lo and behold the WMD's they did find were from that era and were no longer useful.
I don't fully blame Bush for the Iraq war. I do not think he blatantly lied to justify the war. I do blame his entire staff that pushed for it, and I do blame him for not doing enough due diligence on the faulty intelligence they relied on to justify the war. I do blame him for using 9/11 to gin up fear to justify it. I do blame them for not mapping out an exit strategy, and I do blame them for stupidly believing they could spread democracy in that region.
Biggest foreign relation boondoggle in my lifetime that we will be paying the price for for many, many years to come.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 10:52 am to The Spleen
quote:
I don't fully blame Bush for the Iraq war. I do not think he blatantly lied to justify the war. I do blame his entire staff that pushed for it, and I do blame him for not doing enough due diligence on the faulty intelligence they relied on to justify the war. I do blame him for using 9/11 to gin up fear to justify it. I do blame them for not mapping out an exit strategy, and I do blame them for stupidly believing they could spread democracy in that region.
I don't disagree with any of this.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 10:56 am to The Spleen
quote:
I don't fully blame Bush for the Iraq war. I do not think he blatantly lied to justify the war. I do blame his entire staff that pushed for it, and I do blame him for not doing enough due diligence on the faulty intelligence they relied on to justify the war. I do blame him for using 9/11 to gin up fear to justify it. I do blame them for not mapping out an exit strategy, and I do blame them for stupidly believing they could spread democracy in that region.
i agree with everything but the last sentence. thinking we can spread democracy to that region was not stupid, maybe blindly optimistic, but not stupid.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 10:57 am to cas4t
But I took this from Obama's speech as well
Could all of this not have been said about Hussein as well?
quote:
"ISIL poses a threat to the people of Iraq and Syria and the broader Middle East, including American citizens, personnel, and facilities," Obama said. "If left unchecked, these terrorists could pose a growing threat beyond that region, including to the United States. While we have not yet detected specific plotting against our homeland, ISIL leaders have threatened America and our allies."
Could all of this not have been said about Hussein as well?
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:01 am to cas4t
I took this passage from an article as well.
quote:
"I want the American people to understand how this effort will be different from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan," he said, as if to reassure a dubious public. "It will not involve American combat troops fighting on foreign soil. This counterterrorism campaign will be waged through a steady, relentless effort to take out ISIL wherever they exist, using our air power and our support for partners’ forces on the ground." That's a relief to those of us who don't want to see another 5,000 American soldiers shipped home in body bags, several times more with missing limbs or brain injuries, and a years-long epidemic of post-traumatic stress disorder, depression, and substance abuse.
quote:
But if America didn't successfully eliminate violent extremists in Afghanistan or Iraq even with tens of thousands of boots on the ground, if extremists in those countries began to gain more power as soon as Americans left, if we didn't manage to successfully train their armies even during a years-long deployment of our best forces, why do we think that a foe Chuck Hagel characterizes as the most formidable we've seen in the War on Terror can be beat with airstrikes and a few hundred advisers?
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:05 am to The Spleen
quote:
and I do blame them for stupidly believing they could spread democracy in that region.
The insane part to me- Government invades Iraq with a known contingency plan for democracy that could take up to 30 years to be successful, but we elect new officials every 4 years.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 11:11 am to 3nOut
quote:
blindly optimistic, but not stupid.
TomAto-TomAHto
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