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Posted on 2/9/15 at 6:39 pm to Tigersessed
On point. I hope we get one and can not recall any stars coming from mo and playing for mizzou in the last 10 years or so. Poor metric to measure a mizzou coach of any era.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 7:48 pm to AKTigerChief
It's a poor sign of how good of a job a coach is doing to keep the local talent at Mizzou? Not sure I'm following. I mean I get they can get players from elsewhere, but I certainly think that being able to keep the local talent home is important. The history of Mizzou basketball could be completely different had they convinced some kids to stay home.
Tyler Hansbrough
Otto Porter
Bradley Beal
David Lee
Larry Hughes (though he kind of stayed home)
I'm sure there are others.
Tyler Hansbrough
Otto Porter
Bradley Beal
David Lee
Larry Hughes (though he kind of stayed home)
I'm sure there are others.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 9:33 pm to reedus23
You just proved his point by showing that elite talent doesn't stay in state. Are you saying that we have never had a good coach in our history? We have never signed a top 5 basketball prospect, but you are saying KA should sign 2 in the next 2 years. That line of reasoning isn't awkward?
Posted on 2/9/15 at 9:37 pm to Tigersessed
I think I agree then. No, Haith, MA and QS did a poor job of getting the instate talent. Yes, KA should get the instate talent. In fact, that was one of his priorities when he was hired, per KA. If KA can't keep the instate talent instate then we hired the wrong guy. That's what I'm trying to say.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 9:43 pm to reedus23
Norm Stewart also did a poor job of keeping the in state talent. I agree that getting the top in state talent would be nice. I'm not sure that should be a big priority in judging a coach's success.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 9:49 pm to Tigersessed
Actually Norm did a fairly good job of it. In fact, he used to take the top player in the state even if that top player wasn't necessarily to that level because he saw the importance of getting the top instate kids.
Ultimately, I agree, it's the wins and losses that will determine a coach's success. I think to get to the point to making Final Fours or better, the best place to start is at home. Just as with GP, I think it's important that they land the instate difference makers (i.e. Lock/Beckner/etc.), I think KA has to do the same thing in basketball.
If the goal is ultimately a Final Four, I'd think a Tatum/Porter combination to go with whomever they land outside of the state would be a good start.
ETA - If they can land that level of talent from outside of the state, great. I just thought that THAT would be unrealistic. More realistic to be able to keep homegrown talent home.
Ultimately, I agree, it's the wins and losses that will determine a coach's success. I think to get to the point to making Final Fours or better, the best place to start is at home. Just as with GP, I think it's important that they land the instate difference makers (i.e. Lock/Beckner/etc.), I think KA has to do the same thing in basketball.
If the goal is ultimately a Final Four, I'd think a Tatum/Porter combination to go with whomever they land outside of the state would be a good start.
ETA - If they can land that level of talent from outside of the state, great. I just thought that THAT would be unrealistic. More realistic to be able to keep homegrown talent home.
This post was edited on 2/9/15 at 9:50 pm
Posted on 2/9/15 at 9:57 pm to reedus23
I think we are basically on the same page. Norm kept the in state talent, but rarely the elite in state talent. Later in his tenure, the top talent went to kU, Gtown, UCLA, Arizona, Colorado, etc. Peeler was probably the last elite talent we kept and that was the late 80s.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 10:02 pm to Tigersessed
I think we are too. And I agree about later in Norm's career. And I'm not saying it's the end all as to whether or not KA is a success. It's a part of it, but not all. Many Mizzou fans have bemoaned the lack of ability to land the instate recruits over recent years. This hiring was the chance and the opportunity that should have been used to fix that, and hopefully he does.
I tried finding a quote from KA directly, but through Puryear's mouth, KA said:
Not happening again means they'll go get Tatum, Porter and others. I know realistically they're not going to get them all, but my bar starts with the fact he should.
From that same article.
LINK /
I tried finding a quote from KA directly, but through Puryear's mouth, KA said:
quote:
“They wanted to keep me home — they said that a lot,” Puryear said. “Mizzou has missed out on some pretty big Missouri guys in the past. They said they don’t want that to happen again.”
Not happening again means they'll go get Tatum, Porter and others. I know realistically they're not going to get them all, but my bar starts with the fact he should.
From that same article.
quote:
Anderson can't talk about specific recruits, per NCAA rules, but on Monday he re-emphasized his desire to recruit from the state of Missouri — a message he also made clear at his April press conference.
LINK /
Posted on 2/10/15 at 10:22 am to reedus23
Reedus you can't expect KA to land Tatum when he comes in late in the recruiting scene on him and yes he is local, but honestly his local ties are to SLU. I think with Porter if he misses then that's maybe a problem. Basketball is different in regards to in state recruiting than football. Top players out of STL have always had blue bloods coming after them. IMO basketball is much more of a national thing as you only need to hit on a couple of kids to make your team competitive. Honestly he is behind on everyone in this upcoming class as well. The top players have been recruited for years. So if you can get this team respectable by the time Porter comes around and make it a viable option then that's what I see as the goal. I don't think you give enough credit to how crappy a situation this turnaround really is. Bball chemistry is not built over night. Also as a side note Mizzou has played the 4th toughest schedule in the country. Not by KA choice. Often times when coaches know they will be young they schedule an easier out of conference to ease in the new players. We did not have that luxury and the confidence of the team is now going in the wrong direction. Maybe if we pull out the Illinois game or Okie State then this teams confidence goes the other direction. Arky game as well. I guess my point is with young teams you need to give them time. Also the fact that people have such an issue with KA benching people for behavior issues IMO is a joke. Sorry he is trying to instill discipline in a young group of men.
Posted on 2/10/15 at 10:42 am to seaniec04
I agree I have no problem with him benching players. Another problem and a difference between football recruiting is AAU. With football players you deal with their family and High school coaches. With basketball players some kids play on mutiple summer league teams. Which means KA has to deal with more coaches. These coaches want their players to play for the best college programs, so they can recruit the best players for their AAU teams.
Their is no way KA can miss out on Tatum, Porter, and Cook. He needs to get a least one. Hopefully all three.
Their is no way KA can miss out on Tatum, Porter, and Cook. He needs to get a least one. Hopefully all three.
Posted on 2/10/15 at 10:59 am to MizzouBS
I'd be happy with Cook and Porter. Tatum I fear is an uphill battle. 
Posted on 2/10/15 at 12:54 pm to seaniec04
quote:
Reedus you can't expect KA to land Tatum when he comes in late in the recruiting scene on him and yes he is local, but honestly his local ties are to SLU.
Sure I can. If he can't lock up the state, we got the wrong guy. Now, having said that, I'm not saying fire the guy if he doesn't land him. But I am saying it's a knock against him or a blemish. He will also have had about 2 years to work him, added to the fact that it's not like Mizzou ignored him before KA. Fuller's should have been on him for 5 years now.
Yes, Tatum has ties to SLU but if you lose a top recruit to SLU, well, enough said.
quote:
IMO basketball is much more of a national thing as you only need to hit on a couple of kids to make your team competitive.
If he lands a Tatum like talent from elsewhere, then it certainly would soften the blow of not getting Tatum. Yes, top players have had blue bloods coming after them and since the days of Norm we've done a poor job of stopping them from pilfering our state. KA himself stated that it was his goal to stop that.
quote:
I don't think you give enough credit to how crappy a situation this turnaround really is.
It wasn't as bad as some would make out. KA has made it worse because his aim, in rebuilding a program, is to tear it down first. I get that. But the talent on this team is not nearly as bad as they've played.
quote:
I guess my point is with young teams you need to give them time.
I'm not calling for KA to be fired immediately. Him and the young kids will be given time.
quote:
Also the fact that people have such an issue with KA benching people for behavior issues IMO is a joke. Sorry he is trying to instill discipline in a young group of men.
Then get rid of them all. If they haven't figured it out by now, then either KA isn't getting the message across or the kids are idiots. There's no reason to have more suspensions than wins unless your players are complete thugs or your coach is going overboard in order to make a point. But the general principle of installing discipline, I don't anyone would have a problem with.
Posted on 2/10/15 at 12:56 pm to seaniec04
I do agree. Tatum is an uphill battle, but that's what bringing in a big name coach is supposed to help with. Landing the big fish and convincing them that Mizzou is a destination spot for top talent, particularly when it is their state school.
Posted on 2/10/15 at 2:33 pm to seaniec04
Agreed on discipline issues. Guess what happens when you miss curfew in the Army. Or if you get sloshed and tank your next mornings presentation while working for a company, etc. etc..
Posted on 2/11/15 at 12:23 am to reedus23
quote:
It's a poor sign of how good of a job a coach is doing to keep the local talent at Mizzou? Not sure I'm following. I mean I get they can get players from elsewhere, but I certainly think that being able to keep the local talent home is important. The history of Mizzou basketball could be completely different had they convinced some kids to stay home.
Tyler Hansbrough
Otto Porter
Bradley Beal
David Lee
Larry Hughes (though he kind of stayed home)
I'm sure there are others.
Ben McLemore was also a killer to lose.
I worry about Porter and Tatum both ending up at Kansas. Tatum is a Duke lean but Kansas is going hard after him. Porter is a Kansas lean. I doubt we get either.
Posted on 2/11/15 at 12:59 am to ZackAttackTiger
I have a hard time believing that the son of a Mizzou coach would end up at kansas.
Posted on 2/11/15 at 1:20 am to ZackAttackTiger
quote:
I worry about Porter and Tatum both ending up at Kansas
Yeah, I wouldn't worry about this. I see 0% chance of Mizzou getting either. Fingers crossed that we can recruit anyone with a pulse.
edit: We need idiot-savant type of kids. Really gifted and coachable...yet someone who cannot notice that Mizzou is the worst team in one of the worst basketball conferences.
This post was edited on 2/11/15 at 11:02 am
Posted on 2/11/15 at 7:44 am to 50CalMG
Jolly dropping 41 the other night I hope he hasn't had a chance to watch mizzou lately.
Posted on 2/11/15 at 12:12 pm to ZouDerrty
Porter Jr is a close to a slam dunk as Mizzou will see in a longtime. His aunt is the head girls bball coach his father is on staff with her and both of his older sisters have already committed to Mizzou. If Mizzou fails to land him we just need to stop trying to "recruit" all together.
I'm really starting to like this Jolly kid a lot
I'm really starting to like this Jolly kid a lot
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